Here is one thing we both agree on. Can we say we turned a new leaf today?

The Official Medallion Qualification Update Thread
 

I'm not speaking on behalf of delta I do not represent delta, I am employed by them however i too am a customer the only difference in my posting and anyone else's is that I work there. Unlike the op I did not leak any information just subscribed to a post that I found interesting, I have said nothing worse then what other customers have simply discussing the upcoming changes to a program that I too am a member of. As an employee I may have a biased opinion but I'm still allowed to have one.

To my experience, it's actually the opposite. You can easily jack up MQD for mid-cons or shorter flights coz normally those flights generate the most cpm. I think DL knows that's the strongest network they have, especially ATL, DTW, CVG, and JFK feeding all the traffic to the every small town of the East. Even if you don't get higher fare buckets, you can still get the upgrade pretty easily even for FOs or GMs.

What I don't like about DL is actually their way to earn miles. Even in IRROPs, they book you into higher fare bucket easily, but still credit the original paid fare bucket to you. Great for the company to lower the liabilities on the balance sheet, but bad for the customers. Therefore, for DL, you really wanna get the fare buckets you want at the beginning.

Apparently, if you want to get the exception from MQD consideration, one thing that makes it so easy is to get a home out of the country. :)

Btw, if one is DM or PM but based out of the US, do they still get all the choice benefits like eCert, miles, or SWUs? AFAIK, only the Tiffany and Co vouchers are only available to the US addresses.

Nope. It applied to elites. The workaround was that you could avoid it by booking on CO.com. Corporate travelers, however, were usually SOL. And it took years for CO to cave and ultimately did only around the time of the merger, IIRC.

I'm aware of that. It doesn't change the fact that AA makes the distinction with one of those methods.

When it comes to financial performance, I think the legacies learned quite a bit from LCCs and continue to learn from them today.

The past? As I remember it, DL caved and continued down a path to bankruptcy, buffeted by price competition from LCCs, which they (and all of the legacies) unsuccessfully tried to fight via appeals to FF programs and "better" products.

I'm fully aware of how Save Skymiles benefited some (heck, a lot) of FFers, but it is entirely less clear that DL benefited. I'm not saying that FFers should be particularly concerned with DL's financial performance - that isn't their job - but DL is concerned with their financial performance and the arguments against this particular initiative, quite frankly, largely confirm the rationale behind the decision. At some point, for this to change, DL will have feel some sort of pain and losing a bunch of folks paying a fraction of the cost to carry them while incurring a greater deferral of revenue ain't going to hurt.

Which benefits have vanished that will be returned to you under the new medallion qualifying structure?

Do you really think Delta sells much of its product at a loss? :confused:

I'm curious on if Delta and other airline employees like NetJets, have to meet the MQD requirement for status as well or is Delta is exempting them?

I know there are Delta employees and employees like NetJet employees who are PM and DM from the paid travel they do. I know Delta has employees fares that are deeply discounted so that would make meeting the MQD's harder for them as opposed to someone that flies on K+ fares or has an am ex and charges $25K.

If a Delta employee flies 80K MQMs in a year, most on cheaper fares and doesn't have an am ex spend of $25K and say their spend is only $6K in MQD's, will Delta give them PM benefits or will they only be gold like a non-employee?

I remember it a bit differently. Leo Mullin refused to listen to SSM, Delta headed to bankruptcy, and Leo and senior execs gave themselves large pensions/severance packages which would be paid even in case of bankruptcy.

Jerry Grinstein took over, adopted many of the SSM points, and Delta headed back on the road to financial stability.

Richard Anderson replaced Grinstein, got to sit at C.E. Woolman's desk every day, and began reversing some of Grinstein's reversals. I am not going to guess whether the new changes will put Delta back in bankruptcy court or, as Anderson obviously hopes, make it financially sound enough for the company to be able to afford to buy him a new desk.

I should have clarified but I meant under the current system, not the one being implemented in 2014. The new system will be great for short-segment, but high-spend travelers to finally get ahead of long segment but low revenue spenders. Under the current system, the problem is it doesn't matter how high of a fare you're on (unless it's full Y) as a GM or FO always loses out to a DM or PM regardless of their fare, but the high spend, weekly-flying GMs and FOs on short segments can't get ahead without really adjusting their travel habits or throwing in a mileage run or two to bump over the next threshold, which not everyone has the time to do.

Obviously, DL employees get non-rev benefits that do not earn miles. Most senior (as in long term, not high ranking) employees do not use the non-rev benefits because they are quite a hassle. They travel like you and I on revenue tickets and earn miles and status like you and I. I doubt DL's internal policies have changed that much in the last few years

As a PM who flies out of DTW myself, I don't see my upgrades going up much in 2015. There have been flights I have been on where no PM's got upgraded except those paying to be in first or on a full Y fare.

If no PM's are getting upgraded on a flight due to the number of diamonds flying, I don't see that changing. Someone that is flying 125K MQMS or more a year is going to make sure they keep their diamond status, if they don't have the necessary MQM's most of them will try to buy higher fares at the end of the year if their employer will allow them to do so (I have no problems with whatever fare class my employees buy providing they reimburse me for the difference between that and the cheapest fare) or will easilly charge $25k on an Am Ex. There is a lot of complaining on here about people getting status with Am Ex. In order to meet the first MQM bonus you have to spend $25K to $30K depending on the card. Anyone getting MQM's from an Am Ex (with the exception of a sign up bonus or MR transfer offer) is going to have the spend in to waive the MQD requirement anyway.

I see the MQD's thinning out FO's and GM's a lot more than I do PM's or DM's. I've already got over $35K in spend in on my Plat. Delta Am Ex and it's only January 23, so it isn't like Delta is putting a hard spend requirement in place anyway. If someone wants status enough and can't spend enough in MQD's just get an am ex card.

I thought if you wanted First, you should buy First?

IIRC, a Delta employee a while back said they had deeply discounted employee fares that earned MQMs.

I was just wondering if employees still had to meet the MQD requirements like other flyers. If they do, that could cut down on employee elites as well if they are flying on deeply discounted fares are a paid passenger

I'm not one of those that says that all the time here, but I do agree, if you want to be guaranteed in first, you should buy a first class seat. Just like if you want a suite or exec level hotel room bad enough you should pay for it instead of relying on a diamond upgrade.

I was answering your question that you had addressed to Bubba, in that as a PM who flies out of DTW (same scenario as him, I know he is a PM and pretty sure he uses DTW), that I don't expect any added benefits myself out of the requirements and don't expect to see my upgrades go up.

As a DTW based PM, my upgrades have been pretty decent. Even when I SDC. I only missed out on three domestic upgrades last year. One was a trip to MIA, one was a trip returning to MIA and the other a trip to FLL (that time I was on a full Y and tried to buy First since I was booked into first on the way back but no seats available). I even got an op-up on a T fare on my return LHR/DTW trip so I have no complaints with my upgrades last year. This year I am 3/3.

Will be interesting to see. They could have been keeping in their back pocket waiting for DL to make the first move, or they could not introduce it and stick a thumb in DL's eye. We shall see.

Now that was a dumb move. That and the getting rid of PM award change fee waivers when there was no DM. Backed off to two, then backed off entirely but not without a blame campaign.

Are you kidding me? 3-tier is some sort of improvement? Let's not seriously compare amount of lows on DL vs AA and UA/CO.

And as for SWU on cheap coach fare, let's not kid ourselves on cheap vs UA/AA>

There always has been just a few apologists - don't forget longing4piedmont and mooper. But to be honest, I welcome their differing opinion -as IME FT is all about discussion.

No I don't, please tell me how much my glass of water costs DL when I ask for my PDB.

As for SC drinks, DL clearly made a decision about this and has watered down their SC's when opening membership to all. I'm sure they are doing fine.

I too am in this boat. I do feel that DL caters to most large corporate travelers, not to say there aren't any who choose to pay more on DL (a few FTers have proven me wrong), but FT-ers are a good representation of the masses out there, IMO I agree with you.

deltagirl22, I agree with many of your sentiments. There are many DYKWIA flyers and many DL bashers. I too am one that has been very critical of DL over the years. While I of course don't like the changes, I understand them. What I really fault/bash DL for is:

1. Dishonesty - promises about fixing the award calendar, bringing carry-over items from NWA (IT, Perkchoice, etc), Jeff's personal vouch that # of lows wont' decrease, etc

2. Blaming - the whole 72 hour and it's blaming of elites. No one buys that.

3. Unannounced changes - admittedly this has been getting better, and while DL doesn't owe us advanced notice it's just good CS. But to not even mention it in a courtesy email is just rude. I'm thinking about the award chart changes (esp when Asian levels increased by over 100%) with no notice or grace period

4. Silly CS policies - who ever came up with the DM line can only search 3 itineraries for you and then will disconnect your line. As if I won't call back?

5. Lack of good IT investment - yeah your app is cool etc. But for how many years has the award calendar NOT worked. What is the purpose of having a broken calendar other than dishonesty? And really, the numerous errors about flights being sold out or whoops let's try that again is unacceptable. I've never had these issues with NWA, UA, CO, or AA. And to be honest, it's wise. Do you know how many hours you'd save your own call reps if you invested in some good IT that allowed me to search for partner awards?

6. Poorly trained reps - seriously, you work for the DM line and you don't know CZ is a ST partner? And I don't need to be lectured about how a long sell won't work when it clearly has numerous times when booking AZ, MU, etc.

7. Dishonesty - related to #6, but there's nothing worse than a rep who lies to me about what is going on when they don't know. Don't tell me that the award level is 2x because I can't have an OJ on my award flight. And then when I give you a past itin don't lie and tell me you meant that there are no OJ's on international flights and that's what you meant to say (this has happened to me twice in the past year).

DL has done a great job with hard product improvements, and the FFP evolves with the time, I get that. But fix the above issues and I can live with the program a lot better and actually say then loyalty is a two way street.