AirFrance.us shows award seats, Delta does not see them
Sep 12, 2012, 9:45 am
#16
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Los Angeles, CA
Programs: DL PM
Posts: 1,094
This has been a huge devaluation of the program for me and another reason I am considering switching to UA. I feel like AF is no longer an option as I can't find one low level biz seat from any gateway to CDG for any months I've tried, by website or with an agent. Do I need to join FB to see the seats available? I really don't want to pay to join EF as I don't travel enough to make it worthwhile.
Sep 12, 2012, 10:14 am
#17
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Jun 2001
Programs: DL 1 million, AA 1 mil, HH lapsed Diamond, Marriott Plat
Posts: 28,190
Given that ExpertFlyer allows one to set alerts for specific flight/cabin/award inventory/seat count, it's really handy for AF/KL/AZ award searches with DL miles.
AF Business inventory USA-CDG is tougher to find than it used to be but it's not impossible. Your lack of success suggests use of the wrong search tools (and yes, delta.com for flexible date searches on partner carriers is fundamentally flawed).
Last edited by 3Cforme; Sep 12, 2012 at 10:21 am
Sep 12, 2012, 1:10 pm
#18
Join Date: Apr 1999
Location: Andover, MA, 01810
Posts: 1,972
Something is definitely up with AF. On sabre as of Monday the X and O classes disappeared for flights to USA/Canada. They're still there intra-Europe and to Asia.
KLM is fine.
When something similar happened 6 months ago, it was just O class that was gone, and it was everywhere on AF/KLM.
KLM is fine.
When something similar happened 6 months ago, it was just O class that was gone, and it was everywhere on AF/KLM.
Last edited by UserMark; Sep 12, 2012 at 1:17 pm
Sep 12, 2012, 1:18 pm
#19
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Los Angeles, CA
Programs: DL PM
Posts: 1,094
I did register for a FB acct. and checked availability on their site then called DL to see if I could redeem for a flt that showed a biz seat available. DL showed no seats whatsoever that entire week. It's been a problem for at least two months now. No problem booking my intra-Europe/mideast on AF.
Sep 12, 2012, 3:09 pm
#20
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: Chicago, IL
Programs: UA Plat, SPG Plat, Marriott Plat
Posts: 68
This has been a huge devaluation of the program for me and another reason I am considering switching to UA. I feel like AF is no longer an option as I can't find one low level biz seat from any gateway to CDG for any months I've tried, by website or with an agent. Do I need to join FB to see the seats available? I really don't want to pay to join EF as I don't travel enough to make it worthwhile.
Sep 12, 2012, 3:10 pm
#21
Original Poster
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: Southern California
Programs: Alaska MVP 75K, Delta Plat, Bonvoy Ambasador, Hilton diamond.
Posts: 527
The flight in question
The flight in question is AF69 LAX-CDG on October 10th. KVS & FB shows 9 biz seats available @ the "classic" 50K tier.
Return flight is AF66 CDG-LAX on October 16th, KVS & FB shows 9 biz seats...
When I go through the booking on airfrance.us it lets me go all the way through 100K round trip.
I tried the "long sell" request, PM agent said "still not available". She was half brain dead, or came off that way anyway...so who knows if she actually did it.
The sad thing is that I'm going to end up crediting my travel to FB going forward if I can't book these tickets with SkyMiles. Being forced onto delta metal @ "high" award levels is deal breaker. I'd rather pay gigantic fuel surcharges over 3x the miles. Most of my travel is TPAC & TATL in premium cabins so I could care less about delta status to be blunt...especially if I can pick up status with AF.
Return flight is AF66 CDG-LAX on October 16th, KVS & FB shows 9 biz seats...
When I go through the booking on airfrance.us it lets me go all the way through 100K round trip.
I tried the "long sell" request, PM agent said "still not available". She was half brain dead, or came off that way anyway...so who knows if she actually did it.
The sad thing is that I'm going to end up crediting my travel to FB going forward if I can't book these tickets with SkyMiles. Being forced onto delta metal @ "high" award levels is deal breaker. I'd rather pay gigantic fuel surcharges over 3x the miles. Most of my travel is TPAC & TATL in premium cabins so I could care less about delta status to be blunt...especially if I can pick up status with AF.
Sep 12, 2012, 3:27 pm
#22
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: San Jose, CA
Programs: DL DM, HH Gold, SPG Gold, Hyatt Plat
Posts: 2,874
The flight in question is AF69 LAX-CDG on October 10th. KVS & FB shows 9 biz seats available @ the "classic" 50K tier.
Return flight is AF66 CDG-LAX on October 16th, KVS & FB shows 9 biz seats...
When I go through the booking on airfrance.us it lets me go all the way through 100K round trip.
I tried the "long sell" request, PM agent said "still not available". She was half brain dead, or came off that way anyway...so who knows if she actually did it.
The sad thing is that I'm going to end up crediting my travel to FB going forward if I can't book these tickets with SkyMiles. Being forced onto delta metal @ "high" award levels is deal breaker. I'd rather pay gigantic fuel surcharges over 3x the miles. Most of my travel is TPAC & TATL in premium cabins so I could care less about delta status to be blunt...especially if I can pick up status with AF.
Return flight is AF66 CDG-LAX on October 16th, KVS & FB shows 9 biz seats...
When I go through the booking on airfrance.us it lets me go all the way through 100K round trip.
I tried the "long sell" request, PM agent said "still not available". She was half brain dead, or came off that way anyway...so who knows if she actually did it.
The sad thing is that I'm going to end up crediting my travel to FB going forward if I can't book these tickets with SkyMiles. Being forced onto delta metal @ "high" award levels is deal breaker. I'd rather pay gigantic fuel surcharges over 3x the miles. Most of my travel is TPAC & TATL in premium cabins so I could care less about delta status to be blunt...especially if I can pick up status with AF.
On AirFrance.us, I searched the same dates and it is showing that there are seats available at the classic level (50k one way or 100k round trip). It's possible that there's an error with the Flying Blue search engine, and those seats aren't actually available. They might error out when you actually try to finalize booking.
There's 2 seats on LAX-FCO with AZ on the 7th if you can leave earlier, and then get from Rome to your final destination. Better product too, with their newly remodeled 777s. Getting home is going to be the tougher part.
Sep 12, 2012, 3:31 pm
#23
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Worldwide
Posts: 12,949
The flight in question is AF69 LAX-CDG on October 10th. KVS & FB shows 9 biz seats available @ the "classic" 50K tier.
Return flight is AF66 CDG-LAX on October 16th, KVS & FB shows 9 biz seats...
When I go through the booking on airfrance.us it lets me go all the way through 100K round trip.
I tried the "long sell" request, PM agent said "still not available". She was half brain dead, or came off that way anyway...so who knows if she actually did it.
Return flight is AF66 CDG-LAX on October 16th, KVS & FB shows 9 biz seats...
When I go through the booking on airfrance.us it lets me go all the way through 100K round trip.
I tried the "long sell" request, PM agent said "still not available". She was half brain dead, or came off that way anyway...so who knows if she actually did it.
[KVS Availability Tool 7.0.5/Diamond - Amadeus: Awards/SkyTeam/US-AF]
Code:
LAX Los Angeles Intl CA US [KLAX] CDG Paris Charles De Gaulle FR [LFPG] WED 10 Oct 2012 | 1 Seat Carrier Flight From Depart To Arrive St Availability --------- ------ ---- -------- ---- -------- --- -- ------------- AF 65 LAX 15:50 CDG 11:35 +1 CX- WA+ YS+ AF 69 LAX 18:45 CDG 14:15 +1 CS+ WS+ YS+ AF 77 LAX 21:35 CDG 17:00 +1 CX- WX- YS+ KL 602 LAX 13:45 AMS 08:55 +1 CX- WX/ YA+ -> AF 1341 AMS 10:45 +1 CDG 12:00 +1 KL 602 LAX 13:45 AMS 08:55 +1 CX- WX/ YA+ -> KL 1233 AMS 12:30 +1 CDG 13:45 +1 KL 602 LAX 13:45 AMS 08:55 +1 CX- WX/ YA+ -> KL 1243 AMS 16:25 +1 CDG 17:40 +1 KL 602 LAX 13:45 AMS 08:55 +1 CX- WX/ YA+ -> KL 1245 AMS 17:45 +1 CDG 19:00 +1
Code:
CDG Paris Charles De Gaulle FR [LFPG] LAX Los Angeles Intl CA US [KLAX] TUE 16 Oct 2012 | 1 Seat Carrier Flight From Depart To Arrive St Availability --------- ------ ---- -------- ---- -------- --- -- ------------- AF 66 CDG 10:30 LAX 13:10 CS+ WA+ YS+ AF 76 CDG 19:10 LAX 21:35 CX- WX- YA+ AF 1240 CDG 07:25 AMS 08:40 CX- WX- YA+ -> KL 601 AMS 09:50 LAX 11:45 AF 84 CDG 10:35 SFO 12:45 CX- WX- YS+ -> DL 4780 SFO 14:55 LAX 16:18 AF 84 CDG 10:35 SFO 12:45 CX- WX- YS+ -> DL 4678 SFO 15:55 LAX 17:19 AF 84 CDG 10:35 SFO 12:45 CX- WX- YS+ -> DL 4795 SFO 17:59 LAX 19:20 AF 84 CDG 10:35 SFO 12:45 CX- WX- YS+ -> DL 693 SFO 18:47 LAX 20:13
Sep 12, 2012, 4:01 pm
#24
Join Date: May 2001
Location: MSP
Programs: DL Diamond, Hyatt Globalist, Hilton Gold, Bonvoy Gold
Posts: 106
Been having a similar issue today trying to get an the nonstop AF flight ORD-CDG on 10/15. ExpertFlyer shows no O class availability, but AF.us site shows a classic business award available. Medallion line shows no availability and couldn't get a long sell to go through. The representative said that AF makes more awards available for its FB members than for its partners' members. (She said Delta does the same thing ...)
Sep 12, 2012, 4:02 pm
#25
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: San Jose, CA
Programs: DL DM, HH Gold, SPG Gold, Hyatt Plat
Posts: 2,874
KVS, why is ExpertFlyer showing zero in O, while you show available? Does your program pull from the AF website, or directly from actual inventory?
As to AF making more seats available to it's members, that's probably only in reference to the flex awards which cost more miles for AF members. Sort of like DL medium and high level awards (which can't be booked by AF members using their miles).
As to AF making more seats available to it's members, that's probably only in reference to the flex awards which cost more miles for AF members. Sort of like DL medium and high level awards (which can't be booked by AF members using their miles).
Sep 12, 2012, 4:17 pm
#26
Join Date: May 2001
Location: MSP
Programs: DL Diamond, Hyatt Globalist, Hilton Gold, Bonvoy Gold
Posts: 106
This agent specifically said that AF will sell classic awards to its members and not make those seats available to Delta members through O class, which is exactly what's happening in my situation. She seemed knowledgeable on the topic.
Sep 12, 2012, 4:30 pm
#27
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: SUX
Programs: BA Silver; HHonors Gold; SPG Gold; Points but dirt with everyone else
Posts: 8,050
FTers know more about DL partner award bookings than 90% or more of DL phone agents. I've gotten that "They make more seats available to their own members." line before and after finding a competent agent been able to get the seat.
Sep 12, 2012, 4:45 pm
#28
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: San Jose, CA
Programs: DL DM, HH Gold, SPG Gold, Hyatt Plat
Posts: 2,874
Both can't be right, and right now we don't know which one is.
Sep 12, 2012, 4:59 pm
#29
Join Date: May 2006
Location: GA
Programs: VA-PLT, QF-GLD, DL-GM, UA-ex1K, AA-exPLT, HH-DM, IHG-PLT, MR-GLD
Posts: 8,242
I think Delta already renegotiated the deal... they cut inventory to AF and AF is just reciprocating.
Sep 12, 2012, 5:02 pm
#30
Original Poster
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: Southern California
Programs: Alaska MVP 75K, Delta Plat, Bonvoy Ambasador, Hilton diamond.
Posts: 527
AF is happy to book the award for me if I want it...
...out of curiosity, does Delta charge the same YQ on AF metal as FB members pay?
...out of curiosity, does Delta charge the same YQ on AF metal as FB members pay?