ssk1127

With ATL, MEM, DTW, and MSP surrounding it, there's no reason to have a true hub at CVG, as there's no longer a need to serve smaller midwest/southeast markets from there. As a business destination, it's still very valuable to DL, and the retention of flights to most major markets likely reflects an ongoing desire to maintain it as a focus city to retain a fairly solid business and O&D travel market.

Been There Before

Every airline in the 20th century has tried to win NYC. The fact is, no airline will ever have a lock on NY. AA has long had a substantial presence in NY and has a beautiful billion dollar terminal at JFK. And as everyone knows, CO controls Newark. The reality is that even though Delta may have the largest number of flights at LGA and JFK, (including the Delta Shuttle) it is not the preferred provider for most New Yorkers or international travellers. Delta (with the eastern acquisition) once controlled the east coast and accounted for 70% of the traffic between south florida and NYC. Jet Blue ate their lunch, and continues to do so domestically with a new modern terminal at JFK and a reputation for better customer service and quality (new aircraft, ptv,etc). UA and USAir seem to have a very small presence in New York.
Furthermore, many international travelers often choose to fly international airlines over domestic carriers as many of those carriers offer a better product. We all know that DAL's terminal operations (PanAm Worldport) and LGA terminals (main and the original Marine Air Terminal) are ancient and run down. This makes it impossible to compete with the international airlines flying out of Terminal 4 at JFK or AA's new terminal. To me this is not the end of the world as I, in a somewhat nostalgic way enjoy the PanAm terminal, but Delta could do a much better job with customer service and ground operations in NYC.

Delta has spent a fortune in the last ten years with billboards at every major sporting venue, taxi-top ads, telephone booth and bus stop advertisements. I'm not sure that this is money well spent.

Dieuwer

I once was stuck at the Marine Air Terminal because of IROPS: I missed the last flight to BOS (at 9.30 pm). It was an horrible experience. NEVER EVER will I fly via LGA again.

BF263533

ATL is toooooooo crowded.

Toooooo many misconnects.

Toooooo many time no gates to park the plane.

Airports that I avoid - ATL - PHL - EWR.

BF263533

Go back to 1970 and United had about 50 flights a day. TWA also had a large number of flights from PIT. US Air eventually forced them out.

Jiatong

Ah, but in the NFL, when a team relocates, all the other NFL owners get a check from the new team. delta has its super Hub in ATL to collect all the $ from the regional hubs. & maybe they should buy a few snow plows, or put the plows on the front of the computer maintenance trucks.

dgxoxo

Adding nonstops with superior service to major financial centers will be a huge step in winning NY. I'm thinking, at the minimum, Hong Kong, Shanghai, Mumbai, Dubai and Sao Paolo.

Oh, and a new terminal at JFK would be nice...

mjcewl1284

Build a huge hub? Under NW, DTW WAS its biggest hub. Seeing that DL has added DTW-HKG, DTW-HND now, doesn't seem like DTW is going anywhere.

It boggles my mind why people think DTW should be dehubbed. It not only provides a great gateway to Asia and Europe, but in terms of connections, it makes total sense to keep DTW. For example, it's hard to fly from Asia to the east coast on UA unless you're going through ORD. For people on the east coast flying from Asia, getting home means arriving before midnight since you'd go through LAX, SEA or SFO, take a flight to another UA/CO hub (right now it looks like EWR, IAH are popular picks), then I'd be able to get home, at around 10-11 pm). With DTW, I get home on the east coast 4 PM at the very latest and I don't need to go through another hub. Why would it make any sense for anybody living on the east coast to go through LAX, SEA, SFO from Asia?

BizJet

But you can go through ORD to get home earlier. On UA, NRT/HKG/PVG/PEK are all served out of ORD, so the only Asian destinations that DL-DTW has that UA-ORD doesn't, AFAIK, are ICN and NGO (and soon HND).

Colin

Chicago area: 10M people and growing
Detroit area: 4M people and shrinking

ClipperDelta

Chicago area: UA, AA, and multiple foreign flag carriers
Detroit area: DL pretty much has the whole market to itself....

cptlflyer

Going, but not gone. I'm not defending CVG's future, but let's dispel the myth that it's already de-hubbed. It's a heck of a lot smaller than it once was, but DL still has a hub operation there... however numbered its days may be.

MSP is actually more affected by snow than DTW.

Except for Asia, which is where the major growth and profits are right now. Aside from the recent plan to add-back a few weekly ATL-PVG flights, the road to Asia on Delta still runs through DTW, NRT, or to a lesser degree, SEA.

DLNYC

We already have Sao Paolo, but I agree DL could work on improving its network in the future. As another poster mentioned, DL does have a hard time competing with the international carriers. The fact is, many NYers pay for premium tickets, and it only makes sense they would pay for the best experience. DL's fleet of 763s and some international 752s just doesn't cut it. That said, the planned (and long overdue) conversions to flat beds will go a long way in helping DL "win" NY, though competing with the Asian carriers will still be a stretch.

cptlflyer

A few important facts to consider:

- The Detroit/Windsor Metro Area is closer to 6M people

- Airlines aren't concerned with total population, they are concerned with the travel market. All people do not have the same propensity for travel, and the DTW travel market has not shrunk even if the population has.

- 6M is still a LOT of people, and with DTW being much more efficient as a hub operation (excess capacity, new "built-to-spec facilities"), it's pretty ideal for any airline to use as a hub.

- DTW is in a very unique position in terms of catchment area. Given the geography of Michigan, the catchment area of DTW is quite large and much larger than most Midwest airports. Whereas with other airports, the farther away from the airport you go the closer you get to another hub, the farther from DTW you go in Michigan, you don't get closer to anything else. That results in a catchment area for DTW of closer to 12M (in total population).

JimboM1391

Does anyone think that STL would be a viable option for a Delta hub? It's right in the middle of the country and still has the infrastructure from the TWA days. Sure it needs some upgrades, but it could work.