We should demand incontrovertible video proof from Dovster.

I don't post here very much but I lurk quite often.

I am not sure if I would say that I favor unions or nonunions environments but rather it depends on the particular situation. That said, I would say that unions, even in a good situation, will protect workers that should not be protected due to misconduct. I have spoken to union workers and heard their stories where they were safe and couldn't be fired for cursing their manager, for not doing a particular task when it would have saved the company money because it wasn't in their job description, or they took an intentional nap but were safe because they did not take their work boots off and that had to happen (per their CBA) in order to be fired. I don't understand why this happens but it seems that often times unions only care about themselves and little about the good employees or the company. On the other hand management will take advantage of the employees from time to time but I think that this is far less frequent than in the past due to litigation and the 24 hour news cycle (and the various Internet web sites that repot poor company actions). The other thing is that if an employee doesn't like how they are being treated or what they are being payed then they always have the option to seek employment elsewhere and resign.

I guess what I am saying is that IMHO unions can had their place but I think that their time has past and they now do more harm than good. There are a couple of exceptions but they aren't truly beneficial as a whole.

The DL aircraft are much cleaner both in F/J and Y IMHO compared to AA aircraft. I haven't flown DL since November, but I flew BOS-ATL-BOS in F (73H and 757) and both were spotless on the inside. Contrast to an AA 738 (not the ones delivered 2009-2010, older 1998-2001 deliveries) or any 757 in the fleet and the DL AC was noticeably cleaner.

FWIW, when I flew BOS-LHR last month on AA 763, the union TWU/ground based workers were standing around on the jet-bridge and in the J-class galley during boarding. My seat had a business card folio from the passenger before me along with menus from the inbound flight. This is just my observations, but DL aircraft seem cleaner to me overall.

I think DL does a better job of refreshing the carpet and seat covers. But that's a function maintenance/techops not ground cleaning. I pretty consistently find crumbs, trash and drink rings on/in the F seats.

It is interesting how the unionization of Delta flight attendants creates strong feelings among people on both sides. Here's why:

Everyone knows the effort to start a flight attendant union at Delta has implications that extend beyond Delta. This labor group is among the only large labor groups at a major airline that is not unionized. Delta's ability to keep the flight attendants from unionizing has long been viewed by those oppose unions as a key wall stopping the union movement. A successful effort to unionize this group will be highly symbolic and will be noticed far and wide. It will be a very major victory for the labor movement. It will energize labor thoughout the airline industry and beyond.

As is evident by ever-declining union roles. This will make a big difference. :rolleyes:

And yet, even with its non-union workforce, Delta went bankrupt @:-)

But the emerged from it with out gov't help

NW was fully unionized and went bankrupt. Which airline still exists today? Your point?

Little to none.. as usual.

NWA is alive and well. It's just called the NeW Delta. You do know who is running the show don't you?

Well, if the NW people are running DL, someone should tell the SkyMiles and social media people at DL. One of the few advantages that NW had over DL were in the social media and FFer areas. Now, we get little official interaction on FT as well as FFer program management that is either unwilling or unable to make the program more valuable to both company and customers. I wish your assertion were true, but sadly, I believe you are mistaken.

DL management's hostility to unions (and/or customers) didn't spare DL from being a bankrupt airline in more ways than one.

While Andy and I tend to disagree I do have to agree with him here...DL is forced to pay union type wages in order to keep the union at bay regardless of the fact that their staff isn't unionized, the fact that both Management and Union's agreed to such generous compensation packages is partially to blame for what's occurred in this industry many many times before (suppliers also have a significant share of the blame too)....DL without a union has pretty much been forced to follow the others while having no say at the bargaining table

I get your point but one could argue which airline financed bankruptcy theirself and only used it to force concessions....there was plenty wrong at both airlines and while Management & Unions hated each other at NWA they BOTH agreed the pax should come first....management and front line staff at DL are having a secret love affair and view the pax as someone who could get between them....neither system is perfect (having lived through CHAOS I can attest to that, and now that I'm the 3rd wheel in the DL/Staff relationship I can attest to that too)