Originally Posted by brenkarch
(Post 13520329)
Unfortunately, I was unaware that airlines could have their own requirements for travel contradicting U.S. and Thai law. Thai consulates in NYC and DC by phone, The U.S. State department http://travel.state.gov/travel/cis_p.../cis_1040.html , two travel books, and a half-dozen travel forums said that while proof of a ticket out of Thailand is a good idea, it is rarely checked or enforced. I made a mistake, and tried to correct it, but was told that even if I had an ongoing ticket, it would not matter.
Delta is telling me that even with proof of onward travel, I will not be able to enter Thailand without a pre-arranged visa if their flight is greater than 30 days. |
Originally Posted by waltinsocal
(Post 13519970)
Why not buy the ticket in advance and eliminate the possibility of this mess?
|
Hmmh...
it seems like DL's issue is that the OP *has* a return flight booked with them, but it's outside of the 30 days (the plan as I understand it is to leave and then later return). I wonder if they would be more pleased if the OP had only a one-way DL flight and the onward travel ticket (that is a very common situation--unlike the OP's which is a bit more unusual). |
http://www.timaticweb.com/cgi-bin/ti...buser=DELTAB2C
According to DL, a one way ticket to Thailand won't work unless you have a pre-arranged Visa on your passport. Hopefully, the above link works. It is from DL's own website and seems to only mention 30 days. |
From Delta's website:
Visa required, except for A touristic stay of max. 30 days: - for holders of normal passports, being nationals of the U.S.A.(except passports issued in the Marshall Islands); Additional Information: - All passports must be in good condition. - Those travelling to Thailand with a visa issued prior to arrival, are permitted to travel on a one-way ticket. OP, have you tried to change your return to within the 30 days and then change it again once you get to Thailand? Or why not change your departure airport to KUL and leave from there? At this point, I would try pretty much anything as the last couple of days have probably cost you quite a bit. Or you can fly into NRT and then leave from there - Japan does not require visas for 90 days. |
Two things:
The part about Thai immigration being lax is just not correct/current. I have been in and out of BKK a hundred times or more since 2004 and until about 18 months ago there was no problem. There was a crack down at that point and they started asking more often for (1) your incoming boarding pass and (2) your departing itinerary, because foreigners living in Thailand were buying refundable tickets out of BKK, going through immigration to plane side and then heading back through immigration as if they had just arrived. This was a known way to get repeated tourist visas, and the prior government was willing to let this happen. The part about how DL interprets the Thai requirements is complete BS. Hey DL, guess what, you're completely wrong about this, no other airline interprets the rules this way. As someone who has had to deal with the departure from the prior lax treatment at Thai immigration, I can tell you that ANY airline ticket out of Thailand within 30 days is sufficient. Hey DL, have you ever considered that people live in places other than the US and they might be getting on a plane to BKK to go to their home in SE Asia? Not everyone is heading there on a sub-30 day vacation!
Originally Posted by brenkarch
(Post 13520329)
Unfortunately, I was unaware that airlines could have their own requirements for travel contradicting U.S. and Thai law. Thai consulates in NYC and DC by phone, The U.S. State department http://travel.state.gov/travel/cis_p.../cis_1040.html , two travel books, and a half-dozen travel forums said that while proof of a ticket out of Thailand is a good idea, it is rarely checked or enforced. I made a mistake, and tried to correct it, but was told that even if I had an ongoing ticket, it would not matter.
Delta is telling me that even with proof of onward travel, I will not be able to enter Thailand without a pre-arranged visa if their flight is greater than 30 days. Edit: Didn't mean to say Thai Consulate and US State Department told me that enforcement was lax. That was obviously the guidebooks and forums. |
This is very odd - before I lived in Dubai I bought a round trip showing a year long stay in Dubai, but has separate tickets onwards to the Seychelles, Mauritius and Australia. They let me board with no issue.
|
Originally Posted by brenkarch
(Post 13519152)
I just spent about 50 minutes on the phone with corporate customer care in Atlanta. At first he was very nice and agreed to get me on a flight tomorrow, but the deeper he dug the more he defended Delta's actions. He was nicer but in the end he came around to the exact same conclusion as everyone else there. He claimed Delta does IDB for all pax with tickets more than 30 days return to Thailand w/o a visa. This is clearly bunk but I wish there were some way to prove it.
In the end he said my best bet was to completely rebook a new itinerary that showed a *Delta* or Delta partner flight out of Thailand within 30 days. I asked if it had to be the same itinerary. He said it would be safest to do that. Basically he punted me back to reservations and said I should restate my case there, and gave me no guarantee I wouldn't be denied again. Ugh. The only concession was that he gave me vouchers to cover the $400 ($200 x 2 pax) lost on the cancellation fee. Cold comfort. Any ideas how to proceed? Is there anyone higher up to talk to? He claimed the only way to escalate beyond him was in writing. He just contradicted himself. If the statement that the Delta's decision to not allow anyone, with more than 30 days return ticket, without a visa eveb if they bought a separate ticket out of Thailand within 20 days, why will Delta allow you with another ticket purchased through Delta? |
Originally Posted by brenkarch
(Post 13519521)
I just got off the phone with another member at corporate customer care. Not very nice person, same result. Now going to try higher ups.
I would love to even *get* to the point where I'm arguing with Delta about the onward ticket. But I'm not. Right now they are denying me the right to board any flight to Thailand for more than 30 days w/o a visa. They claim they can only rely on IATA information, and IATA says "Visa required, except for a touristic stay of max. 30 days." That's what comes up on their computer screens, that's what they stick to. Yes, the Thai consulate in LA (but notably not NY or embassy in DC) says something about requiring an onward flight. But it doesn't state that it has to be with the same airline. So if I could just argue with Delta about the onward flight issue, then I would be set. But I'm not even getting that far. Ugh. About to draft a letter. The ticket out if Thailand doesn't have to be on Delta or its partners. |
Once the OP has a ticket out of Thailand in hand, and delta still denies him boarding, Delta will be breaking a contract it made with the OP when the OP purchased his ticket.
To the OP:
If the airline is arbitrarily denying you travel, FAA can intervene. I have seen this happen before when a friend of mine bought a consolidator ticket from a travel agent. The travel agent declared bankruptcy before the date of travel and did not pay the consolidator. The airline cancelled their reservation for non-payment. FAA intervened and forced the airline, Air France, to honour the ticket. |
Originally Posted by waltinsocal
(Post 13520401)
Now if what you just posted is true, that truly stinks. I guess that is DL's way of insuring that DL does not contribute in any way to an overstay, although I do not believe your visit with an onward ticket would have constituted that.
Again, at this point, OP, I'd fly another airline. DL is so far in the wrong on this one and you've gone through far too much to justify continuing to try and get someone to acknowledge reality. I'd politely ask for a refund and take your business elsewhere. As someone who has done exactly what you did without so much as a peep, your actions have been entirely reasonable. I cannot imagine a real airline hassling you to this degree, so I'd move on... |
Would it be possible for the OP to change his return flight to within thirty days, board the flight, then call DL to change his return ticket? I'm not familiar with changing DL return flights after flying the outbound segment, but theoritically, this would be a solution that may only result in a change fee, and if flexible with the dates, he could be able to find a similar fare basis for the return.
The OP does have 2 vouchers right? |
Are some of you so dishonest and wanting to win an argument that you are selectively editing out waht Timeatic says, and ignoring what has already been posted on this forum?? TTT, forget to post this line, which makes the rest of your post without merit?? *******- It is strongly recommended to hold documents for next
destination as passengers may be subject to random checks.********* whcih in case you have ignored or do not understand means that if one has proof of onward journey, it is not Delta's business? |
A few more comments regarding this situation which now seems to have gotten way out of control.
1. Delta was correct in denying you boarding based on your original documentation. As I mentioned in an earlier post an actual eticket is the only acceptable proof of travel. And the OP has subsequently admitted to not having this information at check in. 2. If you have an eticket for onward travel within 30 days of arrival you should not be denied boarding. It does not matter on what airline you are traveling out of Thailand. If the OP is still intending to travel I would request him/her to PM me their PNR and the eticket number for the onward travel so I can have his information reviewed by the department that would be responsible for Ok'ing the documentation and if acceptable note the record so the GNV agents can see it and avoid issues at check in. I cannot comment on what took place at time of original check in however I will say that in my own experience if a passenger does not have the correct information they can be denied boarding legally. However, we always try to work with them and provide options for them to be able to travel - this includes changing dates, issuing a new ticket, advising them to buy an OAL ticket, etc - so it seems that the agents in GNV may not be familiar with all of the options and caused this situation to escalate. Again, OP please PM your info if you still want to travel and we can try an resolve this matter today. |
Originally Posted by hfly
(Post 13521955)
Are some of you so dishonest and wanting to win an argument that you are selectively editing out waht Timeatic says, and ignoring what has already been posted on this forum?? TTT, forget to post this line, which makes the rest of your post without merit?? *******- It is strongly recommended to hold documents for next
destination as passengers may be subject to random checks.********* whcih in case you have ignored or do not understand means that if one has proof of onward journey, it is not Delta's business? In any case, I was simply providing context for the situation. This is what Delta's agents are looking at when making the determination on whether the OP can or can't travel. Again, I think the easiest way for the OP to handle this would be to change the return trip to return out of KUL and simply purchase a ticket for travel from BKK to KUL (or wherever). |
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