When did it start? I would say it started with Jeff Robertson's hit & run posting when DL's own elites got fed up with it. This came to a head when some FlyerTalkers figured out the truth behind restrictions on double mileage awards. A large proportion of FT quit trusting the SkyMiles management long before the merger was part of the picture.

Jeff seems very nice & personable in person and can make his case quite well to a group of Flyertalkers, but he comes off very differently when he posts. This also underscores the importance of the DL/RWT DO, because it gives a large number of FT members a different window into Delta.

I would add a 4th -- the cold meals in F. My flights in DL F this year have been very underwhelming. Our CO experience has been vastly superior.

Perhaps a better way to express that is that the quality of medium-haul F has declined and is not competitive. From MSP we mostly get short-haul & medium-haul flights.

I do agree with avidflyer's top 3 list.

This is so childish. Focus on the discussions and not the personalities involved & their overall positions. We don't need even more divisiveness by have some persons or persons lobbying to "shun" others.

The "best in class" phrase came into use about the same time they buried one the biggest negative changes affecting NW Plats in a marketing blurb. It was NOT a marketing slogan -- it was a disingenuous response by Jeff Robertson to the NW elites (esp. Plats). We're never going to forget that, at least not for a long time.

Didn't Sarah have "best in class" on her palm?

As a NW flyer for 20+ years and a plat for the last 10 or 12, I am sincerely overjoyed to see that airline gone. There was a corporate culture of blaming the customer for anything that went wrong. If staff were having a bad day, the general rule of thumb seemed to be that they wanted you to share in it. I just chalked it up to the passive/aggressive Upper Midwest culture.

Delta has been a very pleasant surprise, with the exception of the staff at JFK who seem to have collectively gone off their meds. Delta staff generally seem to like their jobs. The SkyClub workers have been especially helpful and gracious, again with the notable exception of JFK. A number of SkyClub workers there really seem to hate their jobs. Their level of unprofessionalism is stunning.

All that said, I still have not figured out the eccentricities of Delta's upgrade policies. As a plat, three times in the last week I was not upgraded until the gate even though 80-90% of the FC seats were available. In one case there were even empty FC seats. Does anyone have insight into this phenomenon? DL's transcon service is also quite lovely: 16 seats in FC instead of 24 with dedicated staff that seems to have special training, including the ability to discuss wine selections.

DL's bureaucracy can sometimes be stiffling. I am tired of being told "the computer did it," "I have no supervisor, there is nothing more I can do," and perhaps the most annoying: the hold message on the plat medallion line that says "now that we have merged, wait times are less." Less than what? I never waited on the NW plat line. The average wait on DL seems about a minute. Saying something so easily disproved is extremely bad form and makes management look like con (wo)men.

The one and only thing I really do miss from the old NW is the Iron Range NW elite call center. They are all pros. I hope DL learns from them rather than shutting them down. If the DL bureaucracy does beat you down, I have found the staffs at the BOS and SFO SkyClubs to be particularly skilled at cutting through it, literally putting you before the computer.

The merger has been rocky, but at least NW has finally been put out of its misery.

They hooked their wagon to the wrong engine!
 

I wonder. I keep shaking my head about Delta's decision to go with their "home-grown" booking engine rather than Northwest's, which, IMHO, was significantly more intuitive, faster and accurate.

I'd even settle for the Delta "look and feel" if the engine behind it worked better.

^ A brilliant way of phrasing this, Rancher. You made me LOL at this thought... and how accurate it might be.

Assuming I'm not already invisible may I ask what constitutes a negative signature? I'm open to feedback - does mine cross that line?

While I believe both were presented with good intentions, I believe that this:
will be more effective than this:
in restoring order. I will make an effort to follow avidflyer's suggestion.

This is what sent me packing, and I haven't regretted it at all. I got tired of hearing devaluations of the FF program referred to as "enhancements." After 11 years as an elite on DL, I quit, and that was before the merger got approved.

As for NW, I was elite on them for 6 years of trans-Pac hell. I have so many memories of snarling FAs, GAs, and other angry personnel. Then there were the beat-up, dingy aircraft with no AVOD. The website and the elite phone agents were great, but nearly everything else was not as good as DL.

Unfortunately the "when will it stop" mantra overlooks the many legitimate issues with DL's operations and treatment of passengers and, also unfortunately, runs the risk of "DL apologist" labeling.

The volume of complaints aren't insignificant and the original poster trivializes their legitimacy. This, also, runs the risk of labeling.

It is not necessary here to regurgitate the litany of issues raised about the "merger" and post-merger airline operations. True, a few of the issues may be "non-issues" or overstated but by and large these complaints have been legitimate, deeply held and overwhemingly ignored by DL management.

Add to this the fact that many of the most vocal critics have a past history of DL mistreatment of its frequent flyers. When Leo Mullen and crew decided to dump on us and expected us to simply smile and take it, we didn't. NW welcomed us and for the most part treated us well. Perhaps more important is that if NW really goofed up on something -- and it did on occasion -- there were identifiable and accessible people of authority who could be prevailed upon to fix it. On this latter point alone DL has failed miserably, even to this day.

True, it's not possible to please everyone all of the time, but DL did not approach this as a merger but more like a hostile takeover. Of particular note is the increasing dilution and, in some cases, elimination of service at traditional NW stations, including its MSP hub. It by and large failed to take advantage of the good things NW could have brought to its operations. For example, you noted the superiority of nwa.com. Systematically DL pretty much sought to trounce on and eliminate the NW culture and embrace its own erroneous one-size-fits-all approach. There are many problems with that but by way of illustration we need only focus on two.

The late Sam Walton wrote that when Wal-Mart expanded north the company learned a few hard lessons, such as why Moon Pies didn't sell at its stores in Wisconsin. Walton wrote that Wal-Mart learned that it had to make regional adjustments in its operational models and history has shown that this has made WMT even more of a giant.

The second is one that asks you to look inside your heart and soul. Imagine two successful career people getting married in their late 30's or 40's. For many years they have functioned reasonably well and have been successful on their own. Into this marriage they bring both their strengths and weaknesses and while they are, in essence, merging they also have so much independent history that it is neither fair or prudent to wipe it out. Fair and prudent people will look to pick up the best attributes of each and will also recognize that there are some areas best left unchanged (just as Sam Walton learned that it didn't make sense to push Moon Pies at Wisconsin Wal-Marts).

In the case of DL's takeover, there was scant little appreciation shown for NW's attributes and its culture as well as attributes and culture of its customers and employees. In some instances even ostensibly good intentions failed. One example: new flight attendant uniforms. On the surface, not a bad thing but then there was the magazine article touting them and how NW FA's were invited to a DL style show replete with hair and makeup tips. More than a few NW FA's were insulted by the implication that they needed help in learning how to dress and fix their hair and makeup. While that probably wasn't DL's intention, the way it was carried out produced that result. In short, another example of insensitivity.

By contrast, take Republic which bought out Frontier and Midwest. Unfortunately, the latter acquisition diluted some of Midwest's distinctiveness (which was on the way out since the prior TPG acquisition) and clearly decimated many valuable YX employees. That said, Republic didn't embark on a venture to conquer one or the other carrier but instead sought to expand its family in a way that respects both cultures. Behind the scenes operations that can be merged for efficiency's sake are being consolidated but, as in the case of the marriage of an older couple, individual cultures are being respected and, where appropriate, blended. In this way the two carriers are becoming stronger individually and together.

The original post suggests that we should all agree on a few things that need fixing and hammer DL about them as a unified front. Who can argue with that? I don't but I must point out that before an attempt is made to fix "things" there must first be an effort made to repair the spirit. Not only should customers and employees of either carrier not have to "give up" anything but the experience should be enhanced by seeking out the best of both worlds and leaving alone the things that didn't need fixing. DL wasted tons of money -- which means higher fares for us -- in unnecessary spending to virtually crush the NW spirit and culture. Before you can fix things, you need to fix the soul.

That journey begins with respect. The original post's tenor not only trivializes the issues with not only what DL has done but how it did it but fails to respect the people who hold those views. The original post suggests that there's a need to eliminate rancor and embrace peace but does so from a posture of both fists being doubled and a spirit of disrespect. In so doing the original poster essentially is spreading the very disease he claims to want to cure. Because of that lack of sensitivity and respect the original post lacks sufficient integrity.

Now, I don't hide behind a handle. My name is out there and if I met the original poster face to face I'd say the same (and perhaps more).

I do wish to acknowledge that not everything DL has done is horrible. In fact, when I left DL my biggest regret was missing the front line people of DL who were largely exceptional until the corporate "no favors, no waivers" bureaucracy crushed them. I also acknowledge that NW was not without faults and it could be ruthless toward many employees who, in turn, passed it along to customers. That said, there was still consistency even on a bad day and an accessible source of redress for the worst sins. Further, while I may appreciate the new seats DL has installed, what difference does it make to have new seats or IFE on planes that go fewer places less often? And the elimination of a domestic Sky Team partner further reinforces the very DL "take it or leave it" customer service modaility which caused us SSM folks to say goobye. I say these things not to pick a fight per se but as a reminder that this isn't just about fixing things but also the spirit.

avidflyer, +1 bazillion.

DL, just please fix your website and low award avail issues...

A signature with a reference to where one can speak their mind and make their voice heard is not negative - not in my book. Sounds like you are doing your part as a united front to fix a problem we find with Delta.

I think this is a strong candidate for #4 on the list of complaints. Besides the website, uselessness of PMUs, and low award availability, DL really needs to do something about JFK. The terminals need to be bulldozed, and the staff collectively replaced. A big job, no question, but the "JFK experience" (poor layout, overcrowding, staff who just don't care) needs to be addressed.

Agree with the OP on most everything else.

This is a very thoughtful post but NOT accurate about what I have said at all. I think you will find if you look at my history here that I do NOT wish to stifle anything, and say so in th e OP and many many times on this board. I am not minmizing anybodys issues what I am saying is address the issues not the posters.

I read your post and I do NOT think you have a problem with anyone on this board. The issues you have are with the airline and that is what we should focus on.

If anything we minimize the importance of the real issues by fighting back and fourth about "whining" and "Apologists" and I do not believe that will accomplish anything other than making FT a a place where people are afraid to post about a problem or a good experience for fear of being labeled. That is wrong on both sides...sorry but I do not see from your post any reason why I should blame ANY posters here for the shortcomings I perceive with DL.

The "boiling down" is not meant to minimize problems but find some of the common ground reasons many are still here on the FT board. There ARE some good things about DL and you called one out; Front line employees. Why is it so bad to admit there are things about DL we like as well as hate? Don't know but blaming anything on somebody's here because they are long time DL customers is wrong just like minimizing the problems other have with DL because they are "NW Whiners is wrong. All I am saying (and did in the op) is if you are bored of the complaints then just ignore them...but DONT minimize the issues based on WHO wrote the post. That is childish and accomplishes nothing.

For clarity: I am NOT for stifling anyone...I am for focusing on the problems that we perceive with the FF program not on each other.

[QUOTE=Dick Ginkowski; True, it's not possible to please everyone all of the time, but DL did not approach this as a merger but more like a hostile takeover. Of particular note is the increasing dilution and, in some cases, elimination of service at traditional NW stations, including its MSP hub.
[/QUOTE]

You think MSP has been gutted? Check out CVG and then you will know what "dilution and elimination of service" is really like.

I think people forget that sometimes how you deliver the message can be just as important as what the message actually is. Posts that begin with how sucky Delta is compared to how great NWA was are naturally starting off on the wrong foot. (As a Floridian this is very similar to the oft said "We do this sooo much better back home in xxxxx" which gets to be like fingernails on a chalkboard in short order).

It would help if the former NWA flyers would realize that things have changed for the pre-merger Delta flyers as well....and not all for the better.

I think it would be more productive to focus on what needs to be changed in the new Delta, than how great things were on either NWA or pre-merger Delta.

Sure there will be some preferences and cultural differences that will result in differing opinions (such as food service and how attentive/or reserved the FA's should be for example), but for the big issues that need to be addressed, I don't think it does us any good to have topics opened up that are combative right at the get go with the other side of this merged airline (regardless of which side is barbing the other).