You can stand by your comment all you want as an experienced cruiser. As a new cruiser I think many were led to believe that Carnival put out a good product that was discounted due to the current economy. It is not the cruisers fault for showing up for a paid cruise and having Carnival intentionally hide major defects effecting the cruise.

The point is that on Flyertalk it is quite normal to book a hotel, flight, cruise for cheap and get good service. I don't lower my expectations when I paid for my last two cruises, getting price reductions twice on my last cruise to make it pretty cheap. I expected the same product and that's what I received.

The game on Flyertalk is to find exceptional deals AND to be helpful to others. That is what I have tried to do.

Then Carnival needs to launch another brand instead of calling the Holiday a "Carnival Fun Ship". I get that you don't go to a Courtyard expecting a JW Marriott, but if you've not been on the Holiday before, you'd want some basic expectations met, wouldn't you?

Take a look at Royal Caribbean. Their older ships (Majesty/Monarch) don't have ice skating rinks or onboard surfing, but their core cruise product, from food to service, is pretty consistent across all their ships. Does not seem to be the same case for Carnival.

Really?

Grandeur of the Seas, launched in early 1996, is one of Royal Caribbean's older vessels, but you'd never know it from the ship's sleek public spaces: a grand Art Deco-inspired dining room, the glitzy Palladium Theater and a sweeping six-story atrium.

Some of the cabins, however, are showing signs of wear and tear. Our dresser, for example, was nicked in spots. The stopper in the bathroom sink had corroded, and the mirror was beginning to lose its finish. There was an abandoned towel rack attached to the wall that, oddly enough, had never been dismantled. And the TV screen, about a foot wide, was smaller than a lot of laptops you see today.

None of this is a deal breaker, of course. But I guess I was also struck by what Grandeur of the Seas does not have...

And unless you book a suite, there are no toiletries. That's right: toiletries. I asked for a shower cap and lotion and was told those "amenities" did not come with our cabin class...

There's also no enrichment program...

More unusually there are no alternative restaurants...

As for service, our experience was a mixed bag...

And while our cabin steward was attentive, our stateroom failed to pass my white glove inspection when we first boarded....

I'm no fan of Carnival, particularly after what they did to HAL, formerly our favorite cruise line, and I hope they're doing themselves harm by trying to pass off this ship and cruise as being of the same standard as their others.

I also feel sorry for those who had a bad experience. It was certainly reasonable to expect more than they got. Still, even such generally sympathetic and "soft" reviewers as Cruise Critic enable advance research.

That, to me, is one of the core purposes of FT, and one of its greatest values to me. ^

Cheers,
Fredd

Last comment from me on this subject. I just read Cruise Critic's roll call on the Holiday Jan 31 sailing. Everyone did not have the same experience as MHarris.

I'm new here, but had to post my thoughts. I am a travel agent who specializes in cruises so I hear comments all day long from people about how their past cruises went. Regarding Carnival...I hear everything from "it is a trailer park at sea" to " We absolutely LOVE Carnival." People come from different walks of life and have different expectations. Certainly, no ship should go out in ill form...Two years ago I was on a Holland America sailing and part of the motor stopped working- Still had a great cruise because the service and ship were all in excellent form. I sell more Carnival cruises than the other cruise lines combined...why??? Because people want "the least expensive cabin." Very, very few people call me and ask for a suite or even a balcony...people tell me "who really cares what the room is like, we are never in it anyhow." My response is usually, "You might be IF you got a nice room to enjoy. It is easy to slam Carnival, but when people are calling because they want a 5 night cruise for two for under $500 total, you have to wonder what they are expecting....it won't be the Ritz! I sell a lot of Holiday and Fantasy (out of New Orleans) sailings, and strangely, people don't complain about it. If it is a health hazard it definitely should be reported. There is a great website called Cruise Bruise that reports issues on cruise ships. Take a look at it if you want to see what really happens on ships.

CruisePro, welcome to FT. I hope you'll stick around and continue to share your perspective. Most FTers are savvy when it comes to air travel and hotel stays. Fewer of us are as experienced regarding cruising. This thread certainly illustrates the range. I've cruised but my experience is limited. I've made a few mistakes of my own and avoided many more with good advice, primarily from cruisecritic.com. I know better than to believe advertising is unbiased, but I was a little surprised to discover just how little valuable information can be had from the various cruising magazine (whose titles I cannot recall). To read them is to hear that every cruise on every ship of every line is the perfect vacation.

To the OP, sorry for your loss. Thanks for the warning. I hope your next cruise is 1000% better.

Interesting that you're comparing a ship built in 1982 (Holiday) to one built in 1996 (Grandeur)

I don't hate Carnival. I've been on the Pride and enjoyed it. I think in this particular case the company did not take care of their passengers.

.

I was gently trying to make the point that, using RCCL as the example you cite, there is useful information available to compare ships before one sails, and that according to the Cruise Critic reviewer ships and service vary on RCCL too.

It's the same reason FTers compare planes. Flying experiences on UA, our airline of choice, can vary significantly depending on the type of plane, not to mention old vs. new C config.

Coincidentally, we enjoyed our one Carnival cruise on the Pride as well. Passengers also were a little younger and generally tended to be more appreciative (and less fussy) of the cruise experience, which itself was positive.

I agree that Carnival appears to be offering a sub-standard experience in this instance, certainly not one that would entice customers to sail with them again. I wish the disappointed posters better experiences in the future.

Cheers,
Fredd

True enough. A comparison to Carnival Inspiration might be in order, as it was built the same year and both Grandeur and Inspiration have undergone major refurbishments in the last few years.

Again, I wasn't comparing Carnival vs. RCCL ships. I was simply questioning the earlier statement that "their [RCCL] core cruise product, from food to service, is pretty consistent across all their ships..." and by doing so trying to point out the value of advance research.

I stand by what *I* said. "Features" vary by ship (pay per meal restaurants, ice skating, putt putt, etc), but from the Voyager of the Seas to the now departed Sovereign of the Seas, the food and service are pretty consistent. Down to the exact same menus!

Nothing awe inspiring, but no brown water either.

If Carnival sticks a fork in the Holiday (sooner the better), this conversation would be pretty much moot.

Even though share prices are down, Royal Caribbean has a lot of cash on hand; I am not worried at all about their financial prospects. I can see many other travel companies going away before RCI.

On the bright side, if you own 100 shares of RCI stock, you are entitled to on board credit; this might be a great time to buy.

Stand, lean, or sit as *you* wish, but I still suggest potential customers do some research before choosing a cruise line, an itinerary, or a ship.
It's great you're so impressed with the consistency of RCCL, unlike this cruiser:

The Grandeur of the Seas offers spectacular savings over the latest Royal Caribbean ships, up to 40% less, a great attraction for blue-collar laborers and those who cannot afford the pricier cruise lines.

The Grandeur of the Seas is an even better bargain because it's located at Norfolk, Virginia, making it a one-day pickup truck drive from West Virginia. Upon arrival at the parking lots, we were greeted by a phalanx of fat women sporting shiny gold teeth, barking orders at us like Marine drill sergeants.

Riding on these low-cost cruises is a great way to re-connect with the bottom 10% of your high school graduating class, and these cruises are perfect if you want to get away and let your hair down.

Dining is very casual on the Grandeur of the Seas. At lunch one day, Janet and I were treated to a woman picking a at her bloody scab from her brand new shoulder tattoo while her kids ran from table to table. Thankfully, the dining tables are round so that passengers who chew with their mouths open were not able to toss food particles all the way across the tables, and they landed harmlessly in the bread baskets.

As frequent Royal Caribbean customers, we were surprised at the noticeable decline in staff quality, with cabin stewards who could not even speak rudimentary English. Janet asked for an extra pillow, and our steward disappeared for several minutes (ostensibly to ask what the word "pillow" meant), and returned, telling us to call a number. She called and requested an extra pillow, was promised one, but it was never delivered.

After observing the staff in action, we strongly suspect that the Grandeur of the Seas is on-the-job training for the larger Royal Caribbean ships...

Read the rest of the review here. It's a hoot, albeit a little cruel.

I've been on the Grandeur, in 2004 or 2005. It was fine. Also been on the Voyageur, the Sovereign, the Majesty, the Enchantment, the Navigator, the Radiance, and the Adventure.

So, unlike googling reviews, I can speak from experience. The food, service, and basic amenities across the RCCL fleet, from the old ships (Sovereign, Majesty) to their newer ships (Adventure, Navigator) are pretty consistent. Consistent for the last 7-8 years. In some cases too consistent (same meals/menus over the last couple of years).

There isn't a single ship in the RCCL fleet i wouldn't hesitate to book. Unlike Carnival and their ancient, POS Holiday class ships.

Back on topic: I still think Carnival did not do the right thing with their treatment of their guests on the broken down Holiday.

Agreed re Carnival.

I remain a strong advocate of researching thoroughly before selecting a cruise line, ship, and itin, and that most certainly includes short bargain-type cruises out of "secondary" ports. There's a wealth of information out there, and we read a large variety of anecdotal reviews when available, whether of cruise lines, hotels, or restaurants in sources as FT, Cruise Critic, and Trip Advisor to get a sense of what we might expect.

You're obviously something of an RCCL fan and I have no experience with them whatsoever, so I'd factor your positive review in if considering that line. Again, my suggestion is to do one's own due diligence.

Cheers,
Fredd