Hello all,

this question goes out to all the cruise and Visa experts.^ Does boarding a cruise ship in Martinque (Caribbean route) mean that we will be leaving the US - visa/esta/vwp technically speaking?

We have European passports and use ESTA (90 day permit). Right now we are in the Caribbeans (flight in and out goes through ATL and JFK), we will be staying in St Lucia, Barbados and are going to take the MSC cruise in Martinique in February.

I was 100% sure that flying to Martinique will be considered by the US border protection as returning to Europe (therefore resetting the counter of the 90 days)... BUT I was told at the airport that US border protection considers Martinque as US territory. Now I counted the days including Martinque and this would mean exactly 92 days.



We will just spent 2 nights within the (real) US borders:

1 in JFK on the way to US
1 in ATL on the way back to EUROPE

Why am I posting in the Cruises board?

The cruise (MSC Orchestra) will depart in Martinique heading to the lesser Antilles, British Virgin Islands, Domenican Republic. Will boarding the cruise in Martinque be the same as leaving the US territory and therefore preventing the overstay?

We absolutely do not want to commit a crime or civil offence.

Sorry, not a visa expert but how could Martinique be anything but part of France? Is it Europe? No. Part of the Americas. Maybe that's the catch?

I don't really have an answer for your question, but I would suggest contacting your travel agent or the State Department. If you live in a city with a US Consulate, try there.

I will say that I suspect you'll find that the regulations regarding travel documents will be strictly enforced. As paranoid as this country has become, I would be disappointed if they weren't.

Oh, and, no...Martinique is not, nor has it ever been, US territory.

Whoever told you Martinique is considered or treated as visiting U.S. Territory was absolutely incorrect. U. S. Virgin Islands? Yes. Martinique is an insular province of France.

You may well have to secure another ESTA for your transit and overnight in the USA. But Flyertalk is probably not the definitive place to get proper visa information.

Definitely don't mean to add to your anguish, but the ESTA is not meant to be used as an continually ongoing entry permit. It used to be that people would go to Canada or Mexico for a day or so and then be able to re-enter the U.S. since they had left the country. AFAIK, it has changed to the point of it being necessary to actually make a return trip to your "home country" or other distant country (not Mexico, Canada, or the Caribbean) for more than just a few days before returning to the U.S. Overstaying the 90 days permitted in the ESTA may result in not being able to obtain another one.

How do I know this?
1. A friend of mine was deported upon trying to re-enter the U.S. from Canada for the second time (after the 90 days were "used up") -- assuming that she would be o.k. in that she had exited the U.S. After the deportation (she had left Seattle to go to Vancouver for only a couple of days, she was not allowed back in and was told she could never again apply for an ESTA). After waiting 5 years, she was finally able to apply for and receive a regular 6-month visa.

2. My husband is a German national, and we had the same fear of overstaying the 90 day limit .... at which point we applied for and obtained a 6-month visa for his visits. And this is in spite of the fact that we have been married for over 30 years and I am a U.S. citizen. (And, despite this, it will cost us several thousand dollars to get him a green-card.) We were told that even with the ESTA or visa, all depends on the person you face at Customs & Immigration when entering the U.S., and that no exceptions are generally allowed for overstaying by even 1 day. Since we usually spend the entire winter in Florida, previous to getting him his visa he would always exit the U.S. and fly back to Germany for at least 2 weeks, shortly before the 90 day expiration.

Wishing you good luck! Do not take any chances if you want to be able to legally return to the U.S. in the future. Check with the State Department or a local U.S. Consulate on one of the islands you are visiting.

A couple of questions: If you are already in the Islands, did you fly there from the U.S.? If so, did you receive an exit stamp in your passport? That might make a difference in the tallying of your days within the U.S. How long in total will you be in the Caribbean before boarding the MSC ship? Does the cruise end in the Caribbean or continue on to NY?

Broadly speaking, the clock probably started for you when you flew through ATL and/or JFK and will stop when you fly back to Europe via either airport. Same thing would apply if you flew through the U.S. just to visit Canada and had to fly back through the U.S.

I presume Martinique must be considered an "adjacent island".

See this: http://curacao.usconsulate.gov/visa_waiver_program.html
http://www.visaservices.duke.edu/Tra...ritory.html#q4

Unfortunate but this is U.S. paranoia.

If you are a French citizen, you could argue Martinique (or Guadeloupe or any French possessions in the area) is part of France and thus home territory. This is not available to other E.U. member nation citizens as, AFAIK, these islands are not part of the E.U.

Best thing to do is call on the U.S. consulate and ask.

According to Wikipedia it is part of the EU:
"As with the other overseas departments, Martinique is one of the eighteen regions of France (being an overseas region) and an integral part of the French Republic. As part of France, Martinique is part of the European Union, and its currency is the euro. "

But is is considered as an adjacent island: http://lexpeakimmig.blogspot.de/2011...itory-and.html