Jan 16, 2017, 6:55 am
Last edit by: storewanderer
Older (archived) threads: 2014-16
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- What is EMV contactless?
EMV contactless is a form of contactless/NFC that uses the same security and encryption that is used when inserting a chip card into an EMV-enabled terminal. Other than not having to sign/enter a PIN for smaller transactions, the security is effectively the same as chip and PIN/chip and signature.
In contrast, MSD contactless is an older version that is designed just and only for the United States. This effectively uses much the same flow as a swiped card transaction with the same rules.
- What is CDCVM?
CDCVM stands for Consumer Device Cardholder Verification Method. It's a method of telling the terminal that the customer verified their identity using their mobile device. Terminals that support it will waive the signature/PIN requirement typically in place for larger transactions, potentially saving time at checkout.
More info: https://support.apple.com/en-us/HT202527
- Does EMV contactless need to be supported to support CDCVM?
Typically, yes. (However, there are some exceptions below.)
- Why can't I tap my foreign-issued contactless card at most places in the US?
This is likely because the store does not support EMV contactless. Foreign issued contactless cards typically do not support MSD contactless since other markets have had EMV for quite some time. In contrast, most stores in the US have yet to get the necessary certifications/software for EMV contactless so they are typically MSD-only--if contactless is enabled at all. (See below for a list of stores where your card will likely work.)
- I paid for a purchase with Apple/Android/Samsung Pay and still had to sign for it.
Most likely, the store in question does not have EMV contactless enabled (see above question). However, there are instances where CDCVM does not work even with EMV contactless enabled. Restaurants that allow tip adjust, for example--where the tip amount is written on a paper receipt and entered by the staff later--cannot support CDCVM. It may simply be a matter of the merchant's processor or the POS software in use not supporting it too.
Another common reason is if you used a US-issued AmEx card with a mobile wallet. AmEx currently does not allow EMV contactless support in mobile wallets for these cards, so they always run as MSD contactless. Because of this, CDCVM is not supported (with very few exceptions, as noted below).
Note: if you used Samsung Pay, you may have paid with MST instead of NFC. Since MST emulates the magnetic pulses that the terminal receives when swiping a regular card, the normal magstripe rules apply.
- How can I tell whether EMV contactless was used?
An easy way to tell if you have Apple Pay is to pay with a Visa or MC while in airplane mode. Wallet will then show a transaction amount next to "Payment" for the card that was used. Alternatively, EMV-related information will typically print on the receipt (AID, etc.) if EMV contactless was used.
(Non-exhaustive) list of EMV contactless supporting merchants in the US:
- 7-Eleven
- 99 Ranch
- Albertsons (Safeway, Vons, Pak N Save, Jewel, Acme, Shaws, Star, Carrs, Randalls, Tom Thumb, Haggen, Eagle, Lucky UT/SoCal)
- Apple Store*†
- Athleta
- Auntie Anne’s Pretzels
- Banana Republic
- Costco Wholesale
- CVS
- DuaneReade*
- El Pollo Loco
- EG Group US (Quik Stop, Kwik Shop, Tom Thumb, Turkey Hill) Note: cashier must press "Electronic Payment" to activate NFC
- Five Below*
- Five Guys
- GAP
- Grocery Outlet*
- Harmon's Grocery
- H&M*
- Jolibee
- Kohl's*
- Lush Cosmetics*
- Maverik
- McDonald's*
- Meijer
- Old Navy
- Panera Bread
- PetSmart
- Ray's Food Place
- Round Table Pizza
- Royal Farms
- Red Ribbon Bakeshop
- Sheetz
- Sherm's Thunderbird Discount Markets Inc.*
- Sprouts
- Staples*
- Starbucks*
- Subway
- Walgreens*
- Weis Markets
- All businesses that use Square and support contactless*
- All businesses that use Clover and support EMV†**
- All businesses that use First Data standalone terminals (e.g. FD100+FD35, FD130) with EMV enabled**
* CDCVM support confirmed
** CDCVM support depends on store/restaurant
† CDCVM supported in MSD mode
USA contactless credit/debit/transit (2017 - 2021)
Jan 18, 2018, 11:32 am
#3286
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: FRA/SXB
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Posts: 1,999
In the US, I mentioned a few pages back that the same card causes all sorts of problems with contactless (either "declined", or still prompts for "debit or credit").
I actually tried using it at the Taiwan High Speed Rail kiosk, hit "debit", and it was declined. Probably should have hit credit since it's not a Taiwan-issued card.
Jan 18, 2018, 11:43 am
#3287
Join Date: Nov 2012
Posts: 3,537
No, I just mentioned that it's a debit card, but processes as credit. Essentially, it works the way it should.
In the US, I mentioned a few pages back that the same card causes all sorts of problems with contactless (either "declined", or still prompts for "debit or credit").
I actually tried using it at the Taiwan High Speed Rail kiosk, hit "debit", and it was declined. Probably should have hit credit since it's not a Taiwan-issued card.
In the US, I mentioned a few pages back that the same card causes all sorts of problems with contactless (either "declined", or still prompts for "debit or credit").
I actually tried using it at the Taiwan High Speed Rail kiosk, hit "debit", and it was declined. Probably should have hit credit since it's not a Taiwan-issued card.
Jan 18, 2018, 12:18 pm
#3288
Join Date: Oct 2011
Posts: 266
I went to Costco earlier. I received an alert from Android Pay that it is available to use here. I waited at the register but nothing. I used Samsung pay as usual.
On another note, first time at Costco that I've been asked to see my credit card. Then, she said I could use my credit card or phone to pay. I waa going tap but she pointed to the side like Samsung Pay. Interesting transaction.
On another note, first time at Costco that I've been asked to see my credit card. Then, she said I could use my credit card or phone to pay. I waa going tap but she pointed to the side like Samsung Pay. Interesting transaction.
Jan 18, 2018, 12:19 pm
#3289
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Jan 2014
Location: San Diego, CA
Programs: GE, Marriott Platinum
Posts: 15,508
You talking about the Morena Blvd location? The gas station reopened I think in November, with all new pumps with the big color screens and EMV and contactless readers (unlike Poway which was a mix of old and new pumps the last time I was there). Actual payments are still swipe-only though.
Also, I went to the Carlsbad location recently since that was the first place I saw EMV at Costco. Looks like they never bothered to install mounts at the food court since I was last there, so the terminals are still cashier-facing. Unfortunately this also meant that I couldn't test whether contactless was enabled there. In any case, I'm not sure I should bother checking additional locations for another couple of months; it's probably not a coincidence that I've only heard about locations in WA having it.
Jan 18, 2018, 12:40 pm
#3290
Suspended
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I just returned from a week in Italy. Contactless acceptance via mobile payment is a lot better than it was a year ago, even though Android Pay is not native in Italy. There were even a number of merchants with Apple Pay stickers, which officially launched in 2017. Only two places refused a contactless payment, both museums, citing that, "It doesn't work." Of course, there was the contactless symbol with the LED lights on the terminal in both cases. I coached waiters at a few restaurants through the process as well. I think there are two primary advantages to doing mobile payments in Europe. The biggest advantage is not having to sign/worry about PIN acceptance. The second advantage is it allows one's wallet to stay out of sight for the transaction, which is useful in crowded areas.
It seems to really depend on whether the bank which does the processing of the transactions for the merchants support contactless.
In Spain last year, it seemed to be the same bank doing all the processing within a given area -- city or province. Maybe the merchants all have accounts with the same bank and they get credit card transaction processing with their accounts or maybe the same bank dominates credit card processing in a given region or country and they distribute the same terminals (those wireless terminals) and they all updated to recent models with contactless support.
So it wouldn't surprise me if Italy has a similar situation, with a handful of banks dominating merchant accounts and/or processing.
Given what we've heard about Spanish and Italian banks, with their loan troubles, at least they're forward-thinking on facilitating transactions.
There used to be a time, not too long ago, when you visited these countries that even getting credit card acceptance, especially Amex, could be tricky to find.
Jan 18, 2018, 2:17 pm
#3291
Join Date: Oct 2014
Programs: Skymiles
Posts: 3,251
Yep.
Also, I went to the Carlsbad location recently since that was the first place I saw EMV at Costco. Looks like they never bothered to install mounts at the food court since I was last there, so the terminals are still cashier-facing. Unfortunately this also meant that I couldn't test whether contactless was enabled there. In any case, I'm not sure I should bother checking additional locations for another couple of months; it's probably not a coincidence that I've only heard about locations in WA having it.
Also, I went to the Carlsbad location recently since that was the first place I saw EMV at Costco. Looks like they never bothered to install mounts at the food court since I was last there, so the terminals are still cashier-facing. Unfortunately this also meant that I couldn't test whether contactless was enabled there. In any case, I'm not sure I should bother checking additional locations for another couple of months; it's probably not a coincidence that I've only heard about locations in WA having it.
Jan 18, 2018, 2:20 pm
#3292
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I believe so (not that it matters much since I think Costco effectively pays nothing for Visa transactions). Last time I was there they only handed the terminal to me because it wouldn't allow PIN bypass for my UNFCU credit card.
Jan 18, 2018, 4:29 pm
#3293
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: SAN
Posts: 1,171
That wouldn't work out too well, remember that MasterCard debit cards can only run as debit at Costco.
I haven't been to the Carlsbad Costco food court (usually only go to that one if I need gas on my way to LA/Orange County), but Morena Blvd and Poway both have customer facing MX915s at the food court. Both have outdoor food courts.
I haven't been to the Carlsbad Costco food court (usually only go to that one if I need gas on my way to LA/Orange County), but Morena Blvd and Poway both have customer facing MX915s at the food court. Both have outdoor food courts.
Jan 18, 2018, 5:53 pm
#3294
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That wouldn't work out too well, remember that MasterCard debit cards can only run as debit at Costco.
I haven't been to the Carlsbad Costco food court (usually only go to that one if I need gas on my way to LA/Orange County), but Morena Blvd and Poway both have customer facing MX915s at the food court. Both have outdoor food courts.
I haven't been to the Carlsbad Costco food court (usually only go to that one if I need gas on my way to LA/Orange County), but Morena Blvd and Poway both have customer facing MX915s at the food court. Both have outdoor food courts.
Jan 18, 2018, 6:00 pm
#3295
Join Date: Oct 2014
Programs: Skymiles
Posts: 3,251
Costco doesn’t use it though. They probably just mostly get Visa cards. Also, that seems to be a totally non standard setup. Every Costco here has them mounted properly.
Jan 18, 2018, 9:39 pm
#3296
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: SJC
Programs: AA, AS, Marriott
Posts: 6,065
That's definitely true. When I was in Spain last year (just on a layover before flying home so not as many data points) card acceptance was much higher than say 10 years ago, and there was no issue with making a mobile payment.
Jan 18, 2018, 9:49 pm
#3297
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Programs: GE, Marriott Platinum
Posts: 15,508
Jan 19, 2018, 10:03 am
#3298
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Aug 2001
Location: RSW
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When I was in Spain couple of years ago, the bookstore chain Casa de Libros gave me an emphatic No! on tapping, and the supermarket requires a 5 euro minimum on credit cards.
Jan 19, 2018, 4:01 pm
#3299
Join Date: Oct 2015
Location: Northern Virginia
Posts: 1,592
At Target last night, I managed to crash the PIN pad...by scanning my REDcard barcode. The cashier and I had to move to another till. 
Jan 19, 2018, 6:56 pm
#3300
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Programs: GE, Marriott Platinum
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There's a gelato/coffee business here with Square that I think is swiping all chip cards; the EMV/contactless reader looks like it's there only for Apple Pay. I don't know whether this is all that common or not.
In any case, I wonder if 100% EMV use is going to be unrealistic for the US any time soon--if ever--and that maybe we should focus on skipping past it.
In any case, I wonder if 100% EMV use is going to be unrealistic for the US any time soon--if ever--and that maybe we should focus on skipping past it.