Happy

That is another alternative - that your keeping the card is due to the history of the card, not for the purpose of keeping the FFP alive. And your card is a no fee version.

My post about no need to have a credit card to keep the FFP alive is to debunk the repeated posts in different threads about how UA now making CO miles expire in 18 months so people would lose their miles etc etc etc

Airline programs are extremely generous because not only any activity counts, it even goes by the activity date, not the posting date - so even if your activity is not posted before the expiration date, as long as the activity happened before that, once the activity posts, your account would spring back to life.

eShopping to me is the easiest. There are many other ways such as your transfer something from SPG, or if one has the e-Reward account that is not restrictive - a transfer from e-Reward to participating airline programs also keep the programs alive. A hotel stay, a car rental, a dining out with the dining program, a small donation to charity, even download a tool bar... there is absolutely easy to keep miles alive without having to keep a credit card associated with that program.

Hotel programs though, are a lot harder to keep them alive - HHonor and SPG would deactivate your accounts if you do not have qualified activities in the account for 12 months. And you would lose all unused points.

Luckily HHonor counts reward redemption as activity. SPG let you spend $10 in hotel dining without staying at the hotel. Of course the activity on the affinity cards always would keep the accounts alive but again one does not need to have an affinity credit card to keep programs alive.

Marriott and Hyatt are very generous not to enforce the rules and accounts seem to stay alive forever.

IHG group (Priority Club) does not have expiration on its points.

Happy

If I go freely spend $$$ to stay at FS, MO, Pen or whatever luxury hotels that fancy my mind, I would not even bother to save the measly a few thousand dollars airfares by trying to gather miles here and there and frequent FT. The $10K a week spend in luxury hotels are just so "unfitting" to the mentality of scrambling miles and points on FT...

Who are you kidding?

We dont need / or even want the luxury hotels - a good, mid to top tier hotel is just fine for our purpose - such as a lowly JW Marriott, a Grand Hyatt or a Park Hyatt, an InterContinental or even a Crowne Plaza, would fit our needs perfectly. For our HKG trip, the hotel stays would spread out among the lowly Crowne Plaza, Renaissance, JW Marriott, W hotel, and may be throwing in Grand Hyatt which has a ridiculous rate of $700 a night.

Since I dont have to pay for it, that suits me better.

Though I am semi-heartedly entertaining the idea to stay at THIS Ritz Carlton for a night on our upcoming HKG trip...
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti...Hong-Kong.html

It is just 70K Marriott Reward points, FYI. As a comparison, JW Marriott is at 35K.

If we must make a choice between staying in luxury hotels or flying the luxuriously way - definitely the latter. For our airfares often run into the Several Tens of Thousands a year if we have to pay. Luckily our needs are humble enough that a good 3 to 4 star hotels are just fine. We are perfectly satisfied with a mix of Park Hyatts and ICs with Marriotts and Crowne Plaza/Holiday Inns. I have no interest to learn about how others would spend on their luxurious digs.

Seriously, who cares about your financials? Not sure a spread sheet is even needed for a few FFPs and hotel programs. As for financial matters, a spread sheet probably is too crude to manage it.

freezone

?? Why RIP for Citi?

UA Fan

Citi credits card could be very easily churned. They stopped in Nov 09. I made Liftime gold on AA with 95% from Citi.

UA Fan

I would actually have done this rather than SPG as the minimum transfer amount is 2.5K. However I have had trouble getting miles to post and found it unreliable. Has it been easy for you?

Happy

Yes. I renewed my husband's UA account by going through UA eShopping portal and bought a $5 GC at Sears or K-Mart - forgot which one but any store under Sears Holding Company can use any other stores' Gift Card.

If I remember correctly you can also download an iTune for 0.99 - about the cheapest way if you use iTune.

I did that about 6 weeks before the expiration date. After 3 weeks the points still have not posted, I emailed UA to inquire and was told it would take 6 to 8 weeks but NOT to worry as the date it mattered was the Activity Date, not the Posting Date. At the end of 5 weeks the 5 points posted and the account got another 18 months life from the date of activity. Easy Peasy.

Register the dining program is another easy way. Dining points post rather quickly from what I read.

BTW, if you are a few miles short on a future award, the e-Shopping is a good way to top up in anticipating future usage.

I have transferred some MR pts to BA account for the 50% bonus but the increment is 1K and I dont want to transfer an extra 1 K just to make up 101 pts short fall for the possible awards in the future. So I checked out BA's eShopping. Lo and behold, it has Sears and at 4 miles per $ spend no less! I bought a $5 GC 3 days ago just to test it. If it works well I would buy enough to make up the 100 miles short fall for an award in the unforeseeable future. I learned this lesson from a friend's miserable experience - he was short of 35 UA miles for an award to China and had to buy 1K at high cost - purchase cost, one-time process fee and the 7.5% excise tax... while he could have done something long before as he knew he would claim such an award at least 3 or 4 months before the trip.

Happy

Hear Hear.

UA Fan

when I did such things, transaction would never even show up. I have had to fight for each thing and I am so tired of it. I am just nervous of getting an agent who is super strict and refuses to give credit due to lack of evidence.

I still do eshopping b/c I love being to go straight to the online purchase booth, pick up my stuff and leave. No lines, no time wasted looking for the item. Some transactions post and I consider them a bonus. If it does, I just do not have the time and will to fight. I even select airlines that give less miles/dollar if they are prompt and reliable. CO was good, NW & US were nightmares.

robyng

Are the Starwood and Hilton AMEX cards MR cards? If not - best I can recall - when you cancel a MR card - you lose your points. So you have to transfer them out so you won't lose them. I am reluctant to transfer points to anywhere unless I have a a particular reward in mind. Robyn

robyng

I guess you haven't explored some areas of FlyerTalk. Like the Luxury Hotels forum. Where there is a ton of information about luxury hotels around the world. And the best ways to get various deals and perks at various luxury hotels (like stay 2 nights - get 1 free - free breakfasts - free room upgrades - etc.). My father went to Seattle a few years ago - and it actually would have been cheaper for him to stay at the Four Seasons in Seattle but he chose to stay at a Hampton Inn instead . Just because one has the ability to throw money out the window doesn't mean it's a prudent thing to do financially .

And then there are the area specific travel forums here. I have learned an enormous amount pre-trip about some areas I've been to - especially Japan (the regulars over at that forum possess an amazing wealth of information).

Most long haul front of the plane tickets aren't a few thousand dollars these days - they're a heck of a lot more. Again - why throw money out the window if you can spend a few hours arranging your spending to avoid it? FWIW - I have pretty much been doing things the same way for years. But have had to figure out what to do in light of the AMEX/CO split. Make some decisions. Change some things around a bit. There are a lot of us here in that position.

FWIW - I'd check over at the Luxury Hotels forum before considering a one night stay at the RC Honk Kong. If there's a late check in and an early check out - spending money or points on the stay may be a waste of either.

Finally - the CC churning game may be hitting some speed bumps. I was looking through the new Chase CO/UA cards this afternoon - and ran across this language in the T&C of one of them:

If applicable, Chase cardmembers who currently have or have had a Chase credit card in any Rewards Program associated with this offer or have received a similar bonus offer, may not be eligible for a second Chase credit card in the same Rewards Program, or for any bonus offer. Chase cardmembers currently receiving promotional pricing, or Chase cardmembers with a history of only using their current or prior Chase card for promotional pricing offers, are not eligible for a second Chase credit card with promotional pricing.

Robyn

Dr Jabadski

Now back to our original programming.

The point of the OP is that one cannot sustain 500,000 miles per year on an ongoing basis.

These are just a few of the many comments on this thread indicating that folks have done this for a year or in the past year to year and a half. And I’ve done the same thing. But that still doesn’t address the original question: doing it year after year after year.

These are some of the comments indicating that it can be done year after year. But most evidence points to tightening and restricting of these lucrative offers.

I’ll reiterate that it’s nearly impossible for an individual (not a couple) who is not a business owner to obtain 500,000 miles a year for more than 2 years consecutively. My post above was written 2 days ago, on 8/1. I did a churn-o-rama/apply-o-rama last night 8/2. 4 apps, SPG Business (via a referral exchange from here, thank you FT) approved instantly, 15K limit. Citi AA Business (different business) – “system error, you’ll be contacted”, called today, being evaluated. AmEx Premier Gold Rewards, we’ll let you know in 10 days, called today, approved. Chase Prioity Club, “to be reviewed”, called today, spoke with first reconsideration person, declined due to too many credit inquires (9) in past year, too many recent new accounts (4) with Chase and others in past few months, too many accounts closed in too short a time (less than 1 year). Asked for supervisor, went over everything again, all the usual stuff we all try, discussed moving credit limits or closing a card, they’ll review it again. My credit history, other than lots and lots of credit card accounts, is impeccable. The point is that churning and repeat bonuses are much more difficult now than in the past.

Clearly both Chase and Citi, the major players in this game, have made churning much more difficult. All issuers have made obtaining repeat bonuses more difficult. There are only a limited number of these programs in existence and there will be fewer with airline consolidations.

I am absolutely NOT trying to be argumentative and I apologize if my posts come across that way. I’m sincerely interested in if this is possible or if those who claim it is possible are being overly optimistic based on what’s been possible during the past 1-2 years.

500,000 miles per year per person is easy for a year or 2, almost anyone can do that. Year after year after year, different story. Although, as the OP wrote: I'd love to be shown differently .

Thank you FT.

beltway

No, they are Starwood and Hilton cards.

Also, you're somewhat mistaken about Amex MR accounts: you forfeit points only if you close your only MR card. If you don't have another MR card & are closing to avoid an annual fee, you can also switch to a no-fee card & keep your points.

Chase put the brakes on rapid-rate churning with T&C like that starting in 2009. As I said earlier, you can still churn Chase cards -- just have to do it more slowly.

robyng

Apart from anything else - I think it's important to distinguish between miles/points that are scattered all around in 6 or 10 different programs - and those that are concentrated in programs where you might actually use them. A lot depends on where you live - and where you want to go. Robyn

brasov02

Excellent summation of the discussion. ^
We've concluded that 500,000+ miles is relatively easy for the credit worthy for the first couple of years. But as Dr. Jabadski pointed out, it's the claim that some make that it is "easy" to do year in, year out indefinitely that I find difficult to believe.
And maybe I should also fine tune my original conclusion by saying for me I do not see a way of keeping up that kind of pace based solely on credit card bonuses. Would love to know how others are doing it after those first easy 2 or 3 years, but there just aren't that many cards left which I haven't already received a bonus from. Although I am hoping I can still churn the AA cards every couple of years. That would help nicely. (I was turned down due to not being a first-time cardholder when I applied last fall but that was only a year from my previous approval. I'm going to give it another shot here pretty quick and see if this magic "18-24 months since last approval" theory I've been hearing about will work for me.)
Congrats to those who are actually doing it. I know how it's done in the beginning but would love to see any detailed list of how one has done it after the 3rd year or so. (WARNING: I WILL eagerly plagiarize any or all of such lists if I can profit therefrom. (is that a word?)

hqly2001

What's with the need to get AA miles?
You could;ve redeemed 300kMR for 450k BA miles vs. 125k AA miles and you could redeem the miles with OW partners or even on AA. Why give up almost 4x the point?