That's a great summation ^

skye1, "A Gathering" can be just as enjoyable as the most mega of mega meets -- and I hope to see you at this gathering in your home town next month.

thanks for the commercial break, dovster ;)
and now back to the thread :)

Wow. It's hard to imagine that someone would really do such a thing.

That would sour me on Do organizing indeed. :(

What can I say? I can't afford to attend Champagne Dos. :mad: :p

I have never heard of someone going so far as to refuse to pay anything (although it may well have happened) but I am familiar with two different things which have happened at past meets:

1. Members either not agreeing to leave a tip, or only leaving a tiny one, and the organizers making up the difference.

2. Members who refused to pay their full share of the bill, based on their not having ordered as much as others. Again, the organizers made up the difference.

I am not saying that I agree with either of these -- I very much don't -- but they are part of the reason why I have decided to organize only "Order what you want -- pay your own bill" events.

Why have I hesitated to plan anything large recently other than a lunch?

1. I've realized that I am not particularly comfortable at the really large events - more than about 35 people, and it feels like a convention where I end up having to cold-talk people at a table.
2. I count many members of FT as friends. While I agree with Willie's comment on page 1 about meeting more people, it's not as much an urgency for me as it was 7 years ago, when I joined FT in a rather turbulent part of my life.
3. Let's call it like it is: there are people who regularly attend the larger general events whom I cannot stand. And if I'm going to spend my time organizing something, I don't want to have them darken my door.

I will probably continue to help organize occasional niche events, such as the roughly annual travelling Cubs Do (this year was an abberation as the road schedule this year was abyssmal), where a lot of the rules and issues discussed above are moot. And there are more people to organize lunches and dinners in Chicago, so I do not have to take the lead as much - which given my work travel schedule is probably a good thing.

First off PAWS UP to Skye1 for his thorough analysis of the varing degrees of F-T events. Maybe add that to the "DO" definition in the glossery. :)

Since this is a retirement thread, I have to disagree with some posters who say you can attend an event with someone who you don't like simply by disappearing into the crowd and hang with those who you do. This is another reason (and perhaps the number ONE reason) why I "retired" from the Mega DO organizing and decided NO MORE Catman DO's.

If I do another big event and it is posted according to the F-T rules ALL Flyertalkers have to be allowed to attend. But what if someone decides to come who I don't get along with, whose attacked me or made fun of me at other FT events in the past? Trust me, I have evidence of this from several well respected Flyertalkers - London DO anyone? (another reason why I am selective on what I organize and what I attend.)

How can I enjoy the event *I* organized when:

1. I'm uncomfortable and fear a scene.
2. People who are friends who I hope can attend can't and won't because someone else is there.
3. The host can't just disappear to avoid drama because there will be someone who seek that person out to make a statement "oh, Catman shook my hand... all is well."

It happened with CMD3. There was too much drama and several fights and several friendships that almost got destroyed because of who came and who didn't come and who was talking to who and who I even shook hands with.

I rather just skip events and avoid any stress or strain. Call me a child, call me inmature a chicken but I have had enough stress in my 41 years of existance.

As I said, the smaller events... the gatherings and if they past 12 FT-ers the "standard DOS" I have no problem putting together. Keep it simple.

I'll see some of you at the San Diego 1K's Soup DOs or some sooner. :)

Catman, I'd never call you any of those things for refusing to carry out an activity which you don't get enjoyment out of :)

If you stop enjoying it, if the situations bring stresses which you don't want to deal with, then stop doing it - I personally don't believe that anyone could ever criticise you for that! While I regret that I'll never be able to attend a Cat Man Doo, I also wouldn't want you to feel forced to organise one which you wouldn't enjoy.

I'm with Nick. This thread is a perfect example of why I'd never attempt to organize a "do".

Dealing with FTers that don't like the menu, don't like the venue, don't like the prices, don't want to pay for alcohol because they don't drink, don't have cash (or a CC), don't tip appropriately. Not to mention don't like the other FTers, or trying to keep away former FTers.

Geez. :(

Happened to me at the recent Cow DO in Buenos Aires.

And I wasn't even an organizer....just the poor schmo at the head of the table who was handed the check.

We had asked for separate checks but the best the restaurant would do was one check for each table of 18...and a calculator. :eek:

But to be fair, the guidelines for how the dinner cost would be split was not finalized beforehand.

So we passed the hat a couple times and I and another helpful FT'er made up the difference.

This can be a major issue so I strongly suggest that anybody planning a DO, Meet, Gathering or event of any size agree before the dinner as to how the meal is to be paid. And make sure the restaurant understands your arrangement beforehand as well.

This I don't have a problem with at all.

Dovster---I certainly didn't mean to imply that it was any less enjoyable, but could understand how what I wrote could be perceived that way. I've attempted a simple edit of my post, and would gladly revise further as needed...just let me know! Thanks!

I am always quite stunned at how often travel-savvy people (as one would think many FTers would be) throw up their hands and whine like babies when certain elements of Do's just aren't done to their pleasure. But, I think that's just the nuts & bolts of event-organizing and social collection in general, regardless of internet board or community title, FT or not.

I think it just reminds us all that some people can be, well, difficult, regardless of their affiliation with FT or not. These people need to realize the "organzing" side of events, and understand that many things have to be done a certain way for valid reasons. Rather than whine about it (as some do), perseverate on the smallest of issues (as some do), or insist on their own exceptions to it (as some do), they should be reminded that no one is holding a gun to their head to make them go. Their choice is simply accepting the Do as is, as offered, or not.

A Do organzier runs a real risk of getting a lot of that flack when they open up the "organzing" process to the masses. Seeking input for the planning process is one thing, and IMHO, best left to a smaller team...since in the "too many cooks in the kitchen" paradigm, the more people you throw into the planning mix, the more you'll have to deal with of that "stuff." IMHO, better to plan it, post your offerings, and people can be grown-ups and simply decide to take it or pass. Do organziers that can clearly post this and adhere to it stand to save themselves from immersion in a lot of that "stuff."

Skye1, there was nothing wrong with your post and you didn't imply that a gathering is less enjoyable.

As chrissxb was quick to see, I was simply using that as a lead in to inviting you to join us at the STL gathering. :)

That is a very good point, as was a point made earlier about not needing to overschedule FTers. To me, a perfect weekend event has a lot of free time. One prepaid planned event on Saturday night, one planned event on Sunday for those not having to catch an early flight, one designated pay-as-you-go meeting point for early arrivals on Friday. Everything else can fall into small self-organizing ad hoc groups, so people can talk in smaller groups and/or go off with the friends they've met from past events, and/or just go explore on their own for a while.