moondog

Since this sub-forum is pretty much a ghost town, I expect this thread to be a slow mover. But, the deal is, with our large number of subway lines in major (and even not so major) cities, subways are often the best way to travel between point A and point B. That having been said, when you have 20+ lines in a given city, transfers are inevitable.

I'm going to kick things off with Shanghai because I live here, but I have some opinions on Beijing that I'll get to in subsequent posts:
1. People's Square was #1 on my "to be avoided list" 20 years ago, and still holds this title
-nowadays, it's usually possible to avoid for any given trip
2. Xujiahui is a close second on the "to be avoided list"
-I actually live within 100 meters of Exits 15/16, which are convenient for Line 9, but Line 11 is an additional 200 meters away, and line 1 is close to 1000 meters
3. I would rank Nanjing Xi Lu as #1 or #2, but the thing is, it's really 3 different stations
4. Transfers between any two lines with numbers >7 are generally pretty good because they are newer, and the planners seemed to get their act in gear around 8 years ago
5. Jing'an Temple (Line 2 to Line 7) kind of sucks, but it's often better than other options
6. Lines 3/4 are annoying in cases when they are above ground, and the transfer lines are below ground
7. Although I rarely go to Pudong, Century Avenue is best designed transfer station in the system

Bluehen1

I'm sure things have changed since I left, but here's what I thought between 2014 and 2016.

1. People's Square - Sucked continuously. Seemed like every connection took forever.
2. Nanjing Xi Lu would be second in my case.
3. Jiangsu Lu was my daily connection for a long time. It always seemed to be crowded and a long walk.
4. Longyang Lu is confusing as the signage isn't great and the Maglev sits between the stations for some of the lines. It used to look like you could use the Maglev station as a shortcut but it was never open to do so.
5. Century Avenue isn't bad as it's pretty well signed, it's just always crowded as hell.

As far as Xujiahui is concerned, I didn't connect there much as it was my "home" station. I lived right outside Exit 14. When commuting from Weining Lu home, I would sometime get off at Jiaotong University and walk the couple of blocks home. I'd also walk over to Xiaojiabang Lu if I needed Line 9 heading east.

moondog

I actually picked my current apartment because our office is on Line 10, and all of my colleagues live on Line 10. Previously, I lived in Xintiandi (awesome apartment/compound), but XTD is boring; Hongqiao Lu (I liked it at first because it felt less urban, but the food options kind of suck); Shanghai Library (I sort of liked that place, but the landlady's dad got sick around the time I was getting ready to do a long US trip, so the dad moved in and we terminated the lease). In any event, when I came back last year, I focused on Jiaoda because I sort of liked the area. I honestly had no idea that Xujiahui exit 15 was 200 meters closer than Jiaoda exit 2, and didn't really care because I had a low opinion of both Xujiahui Station and Line 9 (insanely crowded because lots of people live in Songjiang now and seemed redundant to Line 10 IMO). However, I've recently become a convert. While the crowds are just as annoying as ever, it has better connections to the n/s lines than Line 10 (e.g. Line 10 crosses Line 7, but there is no way to connect between the two), and getting to PVG isn't that painful (though I still usually figure out a way to position myself in Jing'an when going to PVG because I love the #2 bus). Line 9 to Line 2 is also more efficient than Line 10 to Line 2 when going to Lujiazui.

IluvSQ

Agree about People's Square, but since my bank is located there I must visit every trip to Shanghai.
I still get confused about which exits to use - after 15 -20 years of multiple trips per year.
But then, I even have difficulties at simple , non-transfer stations - I have one supplier near
Caohejing Hi-Tech Park station, with only 4 exits, and I still get confused as to which exit to take, and which direction to walk when I get out.

Bluehen1

So, I chose my place, Huijin Plaza, because it was close to everything and there were a fair amount of Western items around. My employer's office was off of Tianlin Road and I could walk there easily from the Guilin Road station. However, once I figured out there was a bus that went from in front of my building to near the office I started taking that because Line 9 was ridiculous. Also, they originally put foreign visitors up in the Courtyard Xujiahui so I could have dinner easily with anyone that was visiting. I also didn't find getting to PVG all that difficult from XJH when I had to do it.

moondog

I find Baidu Maps to be pretty useful wrt identifying optimal exits, but it would be sweet if there was an app (or website) that focused exclusively on subway station logistics.

For example, I now regularly travel between Xujiahui and JA Temple. This is a pretty simple Line 9 to Line 7 drill, and I figured out the proper exits in short order. However, I managed to reduce my average door-to-door time from 30 minutes to 22 minutes via trial and error optimization, including a big tip from a colleague about an elevator near JA Temple Exit 6 that goes directly from the ticket gate level to street level. Few people, even regular commuters, know about this elevator because it is at the end of a hallway behind an ATM machine.

Other optimization examples in the instant case:
-when transferring from Line 9 to Line 7, door #12 gives you the fastest access to the stairway so you can almost certainly get there before the gridlock ensues
-on the way back, anywhere in the middle of the train is fine, but instead of using the stairway, take the escalator up to the ticket gate level, and the elevator back down to Line 9 level; it is within spitting distance of the top of the escalator
-assuming Xujiahui is the destination, you want to be in the middle of the train (can't recall the optimal door number off hand) so you can take the elevator up to the ticket gate level
-morning rush hour honestly isn't that bad --in fact, I manage to snag a seat on Line 7 occasionally-- but, when I find myself near JA Temple in the evenings, I usually plan on hitting the gym and/or eating there because leaving at 6p or 630p is completely nuts
-slightly off topic, I often use Didi on the way back, but wait times have been 30+ minutes since the weather turned cold

Back on topic, if someone were to go to the trouble to collect user generated feedback (i.e. no need to send your own staff out on missions when millions of people are at your disposal) on logistics like these and present it in a clear manner, I would get onboard even if doing so entailed enduring receiving obnoxious push messages. I'm guessing that whoever launched Exploreshanghai had this in mind pre-launch, but they never made it past the "same subway network map you can find on Google" phase.

ETA: When in doubt (in Shanghai), position yourself near even numbered doors because odd numbered doors are often (usually? always?) at the car ends. In addition to increasing your odds of scoring a seat, being in car middles ensures that you won't get stuck in the "nothing to hold onto" zone between cars.

seanpodge

Pretty hard to top Shanghai's People's Square.

Not a fan of the transfer at Dongzhimen in Beijing for the Airport Express Line either.

I was impressed with the transfers coming from XIY heading to my hotel by the South Gate. Two very smooth transfers similar to the platform crossover at Guanglan Rd in Shanghai. (Not quite the same heading to XIY).

Here in Harbin, we only have one transfer station but hopefully at least 2 more will be online in a moth or so.

travelinmanS

I think People’s Square in Shanghai is getting a bad rap on here. It’s not too bad distance wise if you can put up with the crowds. Pre-Covid I had no issues changing from line 1 to 2 coming or going to PVG. I’d even say the line 1 to line 10 transfer at Shanxi South station is worse. The absolute worst in shanghai is Xujiahui line 1 to line 9. Gotta be at least a KM.

Beijing Guomao I remember being a pain as well as Xizhimen line 2 to line 13. Shenzhen has some pretty long connections as far as I remember. HK Central station is also rough going from Island line to the one that goes to the Airport.

moondog

I was planning on completing the (initial) Shanghai part of this discussion before moving on to other cities myself before moving onto Beijing (where my knowledge is a bit stale), but since you mentioned Guomao, I feel compelled to chime in:
1. While Guomao Line 10 to Line 1 isn't especially long transfer in terms of distance, the hallway linking the two is so narrow/crowded that I simply leave the station and go above ground when trying to pull off this drill; sure, this costs me an extra Y3, and I realize that we want to avoid going outside during these winter months, but I will gladly send Y3 to any of our FT bros if doing so prevents them from being trampled
2. Line 6 (in Beijing) is an awesome reliever for Line 1 because it has fewer people, and is faster (i.e. it is dubbed as an "express train")
3. The problem with Line 6 for tourists is that it is not a good way to kick off your Forbidden City experience because it stops near the north gate, which is an exit only
4. But, you guys can take a taxi to Tian'an Men (or Wangfujing if you fancy eating decent food) after morning rush hour, do the drill, and take Line 6 back to your hotel on 3rd Ring, or even 4th Ring

ETA: Today and tomorrow is great time to stock up on DIdi coupons because all of them are priced at Y1. The best coupon is 50% of 5 Express rides. They one is released randomly, and it sells out within minutes. The second best coupon is Y5 off of 7 Express rides. In either case, you can transport yourself, plus 2-3 others from Shaungjing to Wangfujing for around Y9, which is less than the cost of the subway drill

moondog

For those that don't know, the new red subway cards in Shanghai supposedly work in all cities. I don't think they even offer the purple ones any more, but if you have a purple one, you can swap it for a red one for free.

On a semi-related note, when I have spare coins, I often buy single ride tickets, but note that the new (smaller) Y1 coins don't work in the Shanghai ticket machines yet.

IluvSQ

Huh? As a visitor, I always buy single ride tickets, and have always been able to use Y1 coins. Is this something new?

moondog

TMK, the smaller coins started to pop up about 3 months ago. The FamilyMart near my station entrance (there must be at least 5 of them inside Xujiahui Stn) happily lets me swap them for old coins. When doing this drill, I usually bring my y.5 coins along as well because lots of ticket machines seem to dislike them (well, if you have ~10 of them and only need 6 to get a ticket, you'll probably pull it off, even when using the most stubborn machines).

On a semi-related note, I have one of the subway payment apps, but I stopped using it 6 months ago when I realized the extent to which app users gum up the system (e.g. they spend time launching the apps and the QR codes often don't scan very well).

DaileyB

Although I can't really read the directions and instructions, I love the Wuhan subway. It gets you all around town and is clean.

YariGuy

New RMB notes and coins were introduced recently. The notes are a little bit different but don't impact daily life that much. The new 1 RMB coin is smaller than the old one, so vending machines, buses, and whatever take coins have been impacted.

(Maybe they it wasn't recent, but with the prevalence of cashless transactions these days, it's taken me a while to realize they're in circulation).

Cryofern

Subway systems in East Asia are mostly pretty good with this in general - I might even say China has a particular advantage cuz the NIMBY types can't really get a great foothold in an authoritarian system...?
One of the things the others seem to be pointing out are some transfers (especially in the older systems) that are unpleasant to experience, sometimes because of crowding resulting from the difficulty of predicting just how exactly the distribution of population in a city is going to change over a long period of time. My little concrete example is the the intersection of Beijing's lines 5 and 10 at huixinxijienankou - the side platforms of line 10 are directly above and perpendicular to the island platform of line 5, so theoretically it should be a pleasant and short transfer from one to the other (only things like cross-platform transfers are significantly shorter). The issue is that around rush hour, both directions of line 10 and the northbound trains for line 5 are quite full. There's already an imbalance just from that (the trains are about the same size, six carriages with four doors on both sides of each), but it's magnified by the fact that the interval between line 10 trains is like 45 seconds at shortest while the interval between line 5 trains is 90-120 seconds, maybe (? it's been a while; I don't really remember). The result is crowding so severe at its peak that station staff have to open up a corridor outside of the fare gates to give enough space for people to get off line 10 trains

after thinking about that for a while, I understood why some newer interchanges would be ridiculously long and inconvenient when I would have thought it would have been easy to construct them together