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Originally Posted by bocastephen
(Post 9856022)
I read this case before, but what authority does the TSA posses to physically prevent someone from taking their items and leaving? If the police are not yet there, and someone picks up their bags and chooses to leave the checkpoint, the TSA does not have the right to physically block or touch the person, as they have no police authority.
Therefore, if you tried to leave and a screener grabbed you, then you could have that screener charged with assault and battery, no?
Originally Posted by civicmon
(Post 9856093)
Not entirely, he did go through airport security but at no time was he under any sort of detainment order. If he threw his hands up and said "forget it" and left, he's legally free to do so, they can try and stop him but he walks towards the exit, their ability to do anything ends there. Police can do something but that's another story.
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Originally Posted by Cee
(Post 9856158)
Probably. We are not to physically try to stop a passenger from doing anything. In this case (most likely), if he were to have grabbed his stuff and headed out, a breach would have been called.
If he headed out of the airport and never went into the "sterile" area, what would have been breached? |
Originally Posted by Oxb
(Post 9856169)
If he headed out of the airport and never went into the "sterile" area, what would have been breached?
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Originally Posted by Good Guy
(Post 9855189)
While it is no wonder, it is still unprofessional. I've learned over the years that sometimes you just have to let things roll off your back. usa18dca, how old is your friend? How was it established by the TSO's that he was a minor? Did he volunteer the info? The TSA took his picture and photocopied his DL and BP? Cee, OOTPYLTH, is this a normal practice?
Originally Posted by Wally Bird
(Post 9855454)
Nothing to do with the LEOs, if the LEOs want the information they'll demand it themselves. The TSA has 'incident reports' they are supposed to fill out, although the why and how are apparently SSI. Seems obvious to me that in this incident it was pure retaliation and intimidation, something many TSOs are notorious for.
Unprofessional ? Of course, no surprise there either, and not the first time FAT has featured in this forum.
Originally Posted by jcwoman
(Post 9855485)
This detail seems to have been missed by the responders here, and I think it makes a difference in the story. Maybe the OP can confirm this because it's a little fuzzy. Did the TSA tell the young man to wait for the LEO's to show up or did he wait there on his own? If they did tell him to wait, wouldn't THAT be unlawful detaining since they never actually called the LEO's?
Originally Posted by abmj-jr
(Post 9855658)
I'm going to call BS on this one. It is obvious that the OP is referring to FAT, yes. They are normally just about the most laid-back, easiest-to-deal-with group I see in dozens of screenings around the world each year. I suspect the individual in the op may have contributed to his problems with attitude - reference the "tub-stacking ***" remark. I agree with lawdawg. This was a pretty minor problem that escalated for reasons we do not know.
FAT is indeed the most laid back, easiest to deal with group...just not that shift that night...most of them were rude.
Originally Posted by FWAAA
(Post 9855990)
I'm guessing the kid wasn't actually detained by anyone from the TSA. All they did was refuse to clear him to the sterile area and take their sweet time summoning the LEOs. The kid probably could have exited the checkpoint streetside rather than sit around waiting for LEOs, but he didn't.
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Originally Posted by Cee
(Post 9856185)
He was already in the sterile area.
BTW, where does the sterile area begin? Entrance to the security checkpoint, the exit, the WTMD, some other point? |
Originally Posted by Oxb
(Post 9856224)
Okay, I misunderstood. I thought that he had not made it in.
BTW, where does the sterile area begin? Entrance to the security checkpoint, the exit, the WTMD, some other point? |
Originally Posted by bocastephen
(Post 9856104)
Maybe I missed this in an earlier discussion - but can you cite this? Either someone is under arrest or free to go. One or the other. If you're under arrest, you must be charged or let go.
Under what statute can the police hold someone for 48hrs without charging them? Is this is a state statute? How long may police hold suspects before filing charges? If the police have probable cause to believe a person has committed a crime but have not yet brought formal charges, they may detain him or her in custody only for a short period of time (generally 24 to 48 hours). After this short period the police must release the person or bring formal charges and take him or her before a judge. However, he or she may be rearrested at a later date if the police obtain sufficient evidence. They are under arrest but charges are not instantly filed the second handcuffs go on as charges are filed by the DA based on police recommendations. The DA and Judges review the cases and if the evidence warrants then formal charges, bail and court dates are established. If my statement you quoted wasn't clear, I apologize but my point was that the TSA cannot detain people, police can but it requires that a crime is committed and some idea that the person arrested is the offender, neither of which occured with this guy but my statement was in a general sense. |
Originally Posted by law dawg
(Post 9855938)
Don't know how, but the OP stated it and I took them at their word.
Originally Posted by NoClu
(Post 9855892)
They likely knew his age by looking at his DL.
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Originally Posted by law dawg
(Post 9855968)
http://vlex.com/vid/20254460
If the passenger is "not free to leave," then what is he other than detained? |
Originally Posted by Cee
(Post 9856308)
Once you physically enter the WTMD/your bags physcially enter the xray.
The third possibility is that a breach does not occur so long as a TSO observes the passenger and bags. I have been allowed to take my bags (with forbidden object) from the sterile area to the checkin area. Was that a breach, or did the fact that I was being watched by a TSO make it ok? Clearly uncleared people & bags can start past the checkpoint in the sterile area and leave. Does the fact that someone leaves without the TSA's blessing make it a breach? |
On a related note
Is there any prohibition against adults carrying on mini-bottles of liquor in the Freedom Baggie as long as they fit and are under 100ml?
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Originally Posted by civicmon
(Post 9856382)
http://www.abanet.org/publiced/pract...d_charges.html
I can't believe you really don't know this. What do you think they do with criminals that they arrest overnight? They don't always see a judge at 3am. |
Originally Posted by SJCFlyerLG
(Post 9858035)
Is there any prohibition against adults carrying on mini-bottles of liquor in the Freedom Baggie as long as they fit and are under 100ml?
One could bring more than 100mL in a container if one was carrying prescription booze (like this): "Be careful driving or operating machinery until you know how Dehydrated Alcohol Injection affects you. This medicine may cause dizziness, drowsiness or loss of coordination in some people." :D |
no..but....
Originally Posted by SJCFlyerLG
(Post 9858035)
Is there any prohibition against adults carrying on mini-bottles of liquor in the Freedom Baggie as long as they fit and are under 100ml?
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Originally Posted by usa18dca
(Post 9854156)
So my friend flew out of this mid sized Northern California city last month...It's one of these "Oh XXXXXX, it's so dead there no one ever really goes there anymore cities" All I can say is between BFL and MCE.
Anyways he was catching the last flight out of there to Vegas and as he went through the security screening process they searched his bag and came across six miniature bottles of booze (This met the 3.3 restriction and was in a clear plastic bag) Unfortunately for my friend who was underage however obtained it legally while in Europe the previous day and had even the receipt of the purchase in Europe which sucks for him though. He texted me as the TSA was searching through his bag and I told him to immediately call or ask for the LEOs if they were illegally detaining him after the security screening. So he waited 35 minutes before the LEOs actually showed up at the security checkpoint and he waved them over, apparently the LEOs were not called over for that reason so they asked the TSA what was up and they smugly acted like they made the biggest bust ever according to my friend, he also said the TSA screener immediately said "alcohol" as the bag was going through the x-ray machine. After another 20 minute wait with the LEOs who let him go after my friend made the valid argument that the TSA had no authority to detain him because only the LEOs are allowed to deal with federal enforcement regarding possession of alcohol in a minor not the tub stacking ...*****(his words). After the TSA took his picture of him, the BP and Drivers License they sent him on his way and he ultimately missed the flight and as he was exiting the security area he saw the TSA people go "oh he missed his flight...just perfect" then the other guy laughed...this is UNPROFESSIONAL and I told him to contact his local congressman and whine about how TSA is abusing their so called power. What was the correct protocol in this situation? He wanted to know. California liquor laws would apply to the situation. At best they would confiscate the booze. At worst jail him as underage. But again its California state issue with local enforcement. |
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