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Invision and L-3 admit their machines' 30% false alarm rate needs fixing; we pay

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Old Jan 24, 2003, 11:22 am
  #1  
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Invision and L-3 admit their machines' 30% false alarm rate needs fixing; we pay

<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted in the Washington Post:
Conceding that their airport bomb-sniffing machines have failed to work as well as hoped, two companies are asking the federal government to spend millions on new technology that would correct the defects.

InVision Technologies Inc. and L-3 Communications Holdings Inc. are working furiously to develop by next year technology that would enable 1,100 explosives-detection machines to scan checked luggage for bombs with improved accuracy. The additional component would cost $100,000 to $200,000 per machine, adding up to $200 million to the $1.1 billion the government has already spent on the machines, which cost $1 million apiece.

The Transportation Security Administration, the agency in charge of airport security, said it was willing to consider new technology but has not committed to any further purchases.

Chief executives of the firms acknowledged that the performance of their minivan-size machines needed to improve. In a report to Congress in May, the TSA said the scanning devices typically produce false alarms 30 percent of the time, requiring security screeners to open suspect bags and search them by hand. Since then, the agency has worked to improve performance; it now says that in a pilot project false alarms have been reduced to 15 percent. The TSA will not, however, divulge its current figure for the entire nation.</font>
www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A35260-2003Jan23.html

In our never-ending search for that elusive (and probably non-existent) needle in the haystack, these guys admit their machines don't work very well and that we should pony up more money in the hope that more money will make them work.

[This message has been edited by FWAAA (edited 01-24-2003).]
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Old Jan 24, 2003, 12:48 pm
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All this could have been avoided, had they bought the machines that actually worked instead of the machines mandated in a most curious fashion...

<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by FWAAA:
www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A35260-2003Jan23.html

In our never-ending search for that elusive (and probably non-existent) needle in the haystack, these guys admit their machines don't work very well and that we should pony up more money in the hope that more money will make them work.

[This message has been edited by FWAAA (edited 01-24-2003).]
</font>


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Old Jan 24, 2003, 2:04 pm
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<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by Spiff:
All this could have been avoided, had they bought the machines that actually worked instead of the machines mandated in a most curious fashion...

</font>
I think Linda Daschle should pay to fix them.

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Old Jan 24, 2003, 2:10 pm
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how often do they report true alarms?
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Old Jan 24, 2003, 2:34 pm
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More importantly, how often do they not report true bombs (false negatives)?

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Old Jan 24, 2003, 2:40 pm
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I like that idea a lot!!!

<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by tazi:
I think Linda Daschle should pay to fix them.

</font>


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Old Jan 24, 2003, 3:58 pm
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Brilliant! Develop a product that doesn't work, sell billions of dollars worth with full knowledge the product doesn't work, then demand millions more dollars for the fix! It's enough to make you think InVision sells computer software.

Now that the damage has been done and we're stuck with non-working technology, TSA should turn this "concession" around and sue both companies for their failure to provide merchandise fit for purpose, and make them provide the "new technology" for free.
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Old Jan 24, 2003, 6:31 pm
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This thread has also been posted to a new board recently setup in TravelBuzz to address security related topics:

Please use the link below to enter the new board:

http://www.flyertalk.com/travel/ fttravel_forumcgi/forumdisplay.cgi?action=topics&forum=Travel+Safety/Security&number=57&DaysPrune=5&LastLogin=

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[This message has been edited by Radiocycle (edited 01-24-2003).]
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Old Jan 26, 2003, 6:28 pm
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Sounds like something Microsoft would do.
<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by Factotum:
Brilliant! Develop a product that doesn't work, sell billions of dollars worth with full knowledge the product doesn't work, then demand millions more dollars for the fix! It's enough to make you think InVision sells computer software. &lt;IMG SRC="http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/smile.gif"&gt;

Now that the damage has been done and we're stuck with non-working technology, TSA should turn this "concession" around and sue both companies for their failure to provide merchandise fit for purpose, and make them provide the "new technology" for free.
</font>
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Old Jan 28, 2003, 7:47 am
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A friend of mine working for the NSA says they also leak quite a bit of radiation. I would be concerned if I were a baggage screener
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Old Jan 28, 2003, 9:01 am
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Oh...you wanted the radiation shield with that model? No problem, that will be an extra 250 Million.
<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by tazi:
A friend of mine working for the NSA says they also leak quite a bit of radiation. I would be concerned if I were a baggage screener </font>
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Old Jan 28, 2003, 3:57 pm
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<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by tazi:
A friend of mine working for the NSA says they also leak quite a bit of radiation. I would be concerned if I were a baggage screener </font>
I think that someone is pulling your leg on this one. Each machine is tested for this.
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Old Jan 28, 2003, 4:16 pm
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<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by tsadude:
I think that someone is pulling your leg on this one. Each machine is tested for this.</font>
When, where, and how often???

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Old Jan 28, 2003, 6:08 pm
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They slip the machine the answers the day before the test.
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Old Jan 29, 2003, 10:28 pm
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<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by tazi:
A friend of mine working for the NSA says they also leak quite a bit of radiation. I would be concerned if I were a baggage screener </font>
LOY-O-GRAM

TSA fee increased to include a $2.50/segment fee to cover fertility services to TSAers rendered impotent by scrutiny equipment.

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