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-   Checkpoints and Borders Policy Debate (https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/checkpoints-borders-policy-debate-687/)
-   -   When did TSA update their prohibited items list to include marijuana? (https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/checkpoints-borders-policy-debate/1467453-when-did-tsa-update-their-prohibited-items-list-include-marijuana.html)

GUWonder May 16, 2013 9:45 pm


Originally Posted by SWCPHX (Post 20764084)
Anybody can make a citizen's arrest, that's what store security and loss prevention does. Not advocating that TSA should make arrests, but the idea that they can't is just a fallacy. In most instances, whenever a sworn law enforcement officer makes an arrest for a misdemeanor committed outside of their presence, what they're really doing is taking custody of somebody that has been placed under a citizen's arrest by a private individual.

Everybody can, without consequence, seize another person's illegal drugs in the name of making a "citizen's arrest" if supposedly intending to turn over the seized illegal drugs to law enforcement officials?

SWCPHX May 16, 2013 10:10 pm


Originally Posted by GUWonder (Post 20764533)
Everybody can, without consequence, seize another person's illegal drugs in the name of making a "citizen's arrest" if supposedly intending to turn over the seized illegal drugs to law enforcement officials?

The problem is that the Feds do not recognize possession of any amount of marijuana to be legal. Given that TSA is a Federal agency, they aren't going to allow their employees to just turn a blind eye to Federal law and allow it to be violated.

My guess would be that if a TSA clerk found marijuana on somebody they would have to turn it over to a sworn law enforcement officer for proper impounding as evidence. If the only sworn law enforcement officer present was state or local, I would assume that they would defer to their department's policy on what to do with marijuana if it is for medicinal reasons. If the TSA clerk failed to turn over the marijuana for impounding then arguably the person who had possessed the marijuana could probably file a petty theft complaint (assuming that their possession was medicinal in purpose) but then they'd face the risk of revealing that they were in possession of marijuana. Probably could complain anonymously that so and so TSA clerk stole marijuana and never impounded it though.

Store security/loss prevention people quite often find meth or crack on people that they detain for theft. They hold on to the drugs and give it to the officer when they show up to take the report or take custody of the person being detained.

Bearcat06 May 17, 2013 4:06 am


Originally Posted by halls120 (Post 20764138)
The only true L/E function at TSA is carried out by the FAMS. The remainder of TSA implements/excercises the federal regulatory scheme that governs aviation safety.

Not entirely correct.

TSA does have 1811s that are in fact Special Agents.....just like the FBI/ICE/USMS/DEA/etc.... They are OIG (Office of the Inspector General Office) SA's.....

Bearcat06 May 17, 2013 4:10 am


Originally Posted by SWCPHX (Post 20764612)

My guess would be that if a TSA clerk found marijuana on somebody they would have to turn it over to a sworn law enforcement officer for proper impounding as evidence. If the only sworn law enforcement officer present was state or local, I would assume that they would defer to their department's policy on what to do with marijuana if it is for medicinal reasons.

You are correct sir. When I worked at MCI as a LEO, we got calls from TSA (Contractors actually but you know what I mean) all the time about finding dope during screening or secondary screening....

We had policies and procedures in place to deal with things....up to arresting folks and securing the dope as evidence......

I haven't worked there since 05 so I have no idea what they are doing....but I strongly think its the same deal now as then....

petaluma1 May 17, 2013 6:06 am


Originally Posted by eyecue (Post 20763571)
Just sayin in function only, what TSA does is law enforcement.

Not according to one of your compatriots. TSA enforces regulations, not laws.

Congress made the law establishing DHS/TSA. DHS/TSA then set regulations to be followed at checkpoints.

SWCPHX May 17, 2013 7:07 am


Originally Posted by petaluma1 (Post 20765647)
Not according to one of your compatriots. TSA enforces regulations, not laws.

Congress made the law establishing DHS/TSA. DHS/TSA then set regulations to be followed at checkpoints.

They do both. 3-1-1 is a regulation. Shoes and belts off for screening is a regulation. Laptops out of their bags is a regulation. No guns, explosives, or incindiaries on aircraft are laws.

eyecue May 17, 2013 12:21 pm

it is interesting in DEN now with the new legalization of marijuana. We are obligated to inform local police who are without any leg to stand on. TSA has no way to direct file for that kind of violation of federal laws.

halls120 May 17, 2013 1:08 pm


Originally Posted by Bearcat06 (Post 20765393)
Not entirely correct.

TSA does have 1811s that are in fact Special Agents.....just like the FBI/ICE/USMS/DEA/etc.... They are OIG (Office of the Inspector General Office) SA's.....

true - I overlooked that extremely small group of 1811's. a drop in the bucket compared to total TSA employment.

cestmoi123 May 17, 2013 2:54 pm


Originally Posted by GUWonder (Post 20764533)
Everybody can, without consequence, seize another person's illegal drugs in the name of making a "citizen's arrest" if supposedly intending to turn over the seized illegal drugs to law enforcement officials?

Depends on the facts of the case. Grabbing someone's crack pipe while yelling "police, police!" is a far cry from holding up a dealer at gunpoint and then hiding his stash under a loose floorboard in your house.

mbstone May 17, 2013 3:52 pm

How would a TSA x-ray operator differentiate finely ground MJ from, say, tea or spices?

What would be the probable result of a TSA agent finding a small amount of MJ in LAX, SFO, OAK, or LGB? In DEN or SEA?

If no non-TSA FLEO is available, the local LEOs (with proof of medical status if applicable) would return the MJ to the pax and send them on their way, right?

chollie May 17, 2013 4:00 pm


Originally Posted by mbstone (Post 20768533)
How would a TSA x-ray operator differentiate finely ground MJ from, say, tea or spices?

What would be the probable result of a TSA agent finding a small amount of MJ in LAX, SFO, OAK, or LGB? In DEN or SEA?

IIRC, in the past the MJ that's been found was often in the form of one or more rolled joints wrapped in tinfoil, or concealed in a contraband item like a jar of peanut butter. Seems pretty unlikely to me that a TSO would spot a small quantity of unrolled pot, depending how it's packaged.

See eyecue's post - in DEN, TSA summons the local police, but the local police can no longer take action.

See also the special directive that had to be issued to the Sheriff's office of Alameda County (OAK) to remind the Sheriff that although he disagrees with the law, he still has to enforce it as it stands (ie, not pursue medical MJ possession, even when summoned by TSA.

I think sooner or later TSA is going to summon federal authorities in the jurisdictions you mention, since MJ is a federal crime. Question is, are the local authorities required to detain the pax until the feds arrive or will TSA find other inventive ways to get around the 'no detention' limitation to keep the pax at the checkpoint.

Motivated TSOs could initiate a 'random' secondary, including making copies of the pax ID and BP. If that didn't delay things long enough for a FLEO to arrive, with the ID/BP information, the pax would be easy to find in the terminal.

stifle May 18, 2013 3:02 am

Are USCBP federal LEOs? Could they arrest someone for marijuana possession?

Bearcat06 May 18, 2013 4:06 am


Originally Posted by halls120 (Post 20767803)
true - I overlooked that extremely small group of 1811's. a drop in the bucket compared to total TSA employment.

Just wanted to toss that out there.....

Bearcat06 May 18, 2013 4:06 am


Originally Posted by stifle (Post 20770342)
Are USCBP federal LEOs? Could they arrest someone for marijuana possession?

Yes.... They do it all the time/everyday.....

stifle May 18, 2013 4:36 am

So could the TSA conceivably call them to the checkpoint at an international airport if they found dope in one of their 4th amendment violating searches?


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