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3 Stranded By Sudden Inclusion On "No-Fly" List

3 Stranded By Sudden Inclusion On "No-Fly" List

Old Oct 18, 12, 11:56 pm
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3 Stranded By Sudden Inclusion On "No-Fly" List

Navy Spouse Can Stay On Base But Can't Fly

Wade E. Hicks Jr. of Gulfport wonders if it's something he said that left him stranded in Hawaii after he was told he had been placed on the government's "no-fly list."

The newlywed, outspoken former host of a radio talk show said he had made arrangements to fly on a space-available basis from San Francisco to Japan to visit his wife, a Navy lieutenant in Okinawa.

"They told me I had been placed on the no-fly list even though the Transportation Security Administration had cleared me to board the plane in San Francisco," he said.

"They looked at all my paperwork and documents no less than four times and told me it was not a case of mistaken identity. (They said) I had the same name, birth date and Social Security number of a person on the no-fly list. My name had to have been entered after I was airborne on the first flight."

"It's about 2,500 miles to the U.S. and about 3,500 miles to Japan," he said. "What am I supposed to do? Swim? I don't know what to do. It's costing me money to stay here and I'm not getting any answers."

Hicks said he's staying on a military base in Hawaii for $55 a night but needs to rent a vehicle to get around. He said he had to walk six miles to a public library to download information to forward to his congressmen.

----

Queens, NY Man Stranded In Austria


For over two weeks Samir Suljovic, of Oakland Gardens, has remained stranded in Austria, where he was on vacation visiting friends and family. The Council on American Islamic Relations has stepped in demanding answers, but so far they say the American Embassy, customs and homeland security have not provided any explanation for why Suljovic, who has no criminal history, canít fly.

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Illinois Probationer Stranded In Mideast

CHICAGO -- An Islamic charity director who must return to the U.S. as a condition of federal probation says he is stranded in the Middle East because he is on the no-fly list.
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Old Oct 19, 12, 9:57 am
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The comments are interesting.

Originally Posted by mbstone View Post
All comments supportive of Mr. Hicks.

Eileen Henderson says "Who does Cair think they are to demand anything! Homeland security will sought it out and until then Cair needs to get over them selves! We just let a terrorist come here in January that tried to kill hundreds of people , security first and foremost!". In another comment she asks "who's the moron?". Good question, Eileen!

Maureen Hough agrees with Eileen. "We didn't start all of this."

I couldn't find any comments on the third article.

I doubt that Eileen and Maureen are the only people happy to throw other people's rights away, especially if those people are Muslim.
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Old Oct 19, 12, 12:40 pm
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Originally Posted by zorn View Post

I doubt that Eileen and Maureen are the only people happy to throw other people's rights away, especially if those people are Muslim.
I am perfectly happy to relieve any of these people of their rights, Muslim or not. I just want it done at the end of a proper public judicial process when the cause has been determined upon the presentation of valid evidence of misdoing. Otherwise, it is just plain wrong.
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Old Oct 19, 12, 1:04 pm
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Interesting last couple of sentences on Hicks:

A TSA spokeswoman referred the Sun Herald to the FBI. A spokesman for the FBI's Terrorist Screening Center said he could neither confirm nor deny Hicks is on a no-fly list. He said only about 500 people in the U.S. are on the list, and freedom-of-speech issues are not enough to put a person on the list.
Implication is freedom-of-speech plus something else might do the trick. I wonder if freedom-of-speech issues play any role in the decision to put someone on the list.

Mike
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Old Oct 19, 12, 2:53 pm
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Originally Posted by mbstone View Post
Navy Spouse Can Stay On Base But Can't Fly

Wade E. Hicks Jr. of Gulfport wonders if it's something he said that left him stranded in Hawaii after he was told he had been placed on the government's "no-fly list."
If I'm reading this correctly, he was being denied space-available boarding on a military flight, by the FBI/DHS no-fly list. Do the military branches check miltary flight pax against the no-fly list?
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Old Oct 19, 12, 3:06 pm
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Originally Posted by sbagdon View Post
If I'm reading this correctly, he was being denied space-available boarding on a military flight, by the FBI/DHS no-fly list. Do the military branches check miltary flight pax against the no-fly list?
It also states that he is free to leave HI, but not on a "commercial" aircraft. I wouldn't consider military flights to be commercial.
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Old Oct 19, 12, 5:52 pm
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He should shut up about his predicament, book a ticket in a different name, check in online, and then Photoshop the boarding pass to match his real ID. It's trivial for him to evade this.

I recall there was also a Canadian on the list who succeeded in flying again by legally changing his name.
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Old Oct 19, 12, 6:48 pm
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Originally Posted by sbagdon View Post
Do the military branches check miltary flight pax against the no-fly list?
From what I have read/understand about this incident...... CBP apparently uses the list when Military flights are heading overseas.

I had no clue that CBP checked folks before they flew out of JBPHH....and I have flown multiple times on AMC flights out of the same place he was trying to fly out of.

Need to ask around perhaps.....
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Old Oct 20, 12, 2:40 am
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Originally Posted by mybodyismyown View Post
He should shut up about his predicament, book a ticket in a different name, check in online, and then Photoshop the boarding pass to match his real ID. It's trivial for him to evade this.
Ehrm... well... one of the first people he's going to talk to when he gets back home is a federal law enforcement officer (CBP) who probably has ways of determining his true identity and the fact that he's on a no-fly list.

I'm guessing that entering the country under these circumstances would cause even more problems for him.
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Old Oct 20, 12, 6:34 am
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Originally Posted by sirdatary View Post
Ehrm... well... one of the first people he's going to talk to when he gets back home is a federal law enforcement officer (CBP) who probably has ways of determining his true identity and the fact that he's on a no-fly list.

I'm guessing that entering the country under these circumstances would cause even more problems for him.
Perhaps this is what should happen. Then he and Phil Mocek can share strategies and attorneys. Mr Hicks has been deprived of his right to travel, effectively stranding him on an island. This constitutes a denial of the right of free assembly. He can't even return home and is effectively exiled because someone, somewhere decided for some reason, known only to them to do it. It can happen to you, to me, to anyone now.

Our First Amendment allows us to freely associate.
Our Fifth Amendment requires due process prior to the government taking darn near anything from us.
Our Sixth Amendment demands the government produce the exact nature and cause of the accusation and requires the government to produce its witnesses.
Our Seventh Amendment allows a trial should the government say this is merely a civil matter where we have in essence stranded a citizen in the middle of nowhere.
Finally, our 14th Amendment restates these.

So, you would have him buy a boat,learn to sail, place himself at risk of life and limb from the perils of the sea? There are no commercial surface passenger vessels off islands to anywhere. His only options appear to be buying a boat or chartering a private airplane at a cost of around $25,000. By the way, CBP Has zero authority here as HI is a US state and interstate flights are domestic. At least for now.

P.S. mr. Hicks is home. Link

Last edited by greentips; Oct 20, 12 at 6:54 am Reason: Hicks made it home
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Old Oct 20, 12, 10:20 am
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Originally Posted by mybodyismyown View Post
He should shut up about his predicament, book a ticket in a different name, check in online, and then Photoshop the boarding pass to match his real ID. It's trivial for him to evade this.

I recall there was also a Canadian on the list who succeeded in flying again by legally changing his name.
Perhaps, but he's turned up the heat, the story went viral, politicians got involved, put pressure on the right people and now he's off the no-fly list. This issue is now back in public attention where perhaps it can be dealt with as deserved.

So I think he did the right thing.
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Old Oct 20, 12, 12:39 pm
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Originally Posted by zorn View Post



Eileen Henderson says "Who does Cair think they are to demand anything! Homeland security will sought it out and until then Cair needs to get over them selves! We just let a terrorist come here in January that tried to kill hundreds of people , security first and foremost!". In another comment she asks "who's the moron?". Good question, Eileen!

Maureen Hough agrees with Eileen. "We didn't start all of this."

I couldn't find any comments on the third article.

I doubt that Eileen and Maureen are the only people happy to throw other people's rights away, especially if those people are Muslim.
Eileen Henderson is lying. The FBI and NYPD money made someone from Bangladesh who wasn't a terrorist into someone willing to do what the FBI and NYPD wanted done.

People who are not "brown" and/or muslim get off the government's Star Chamberesque blacklists faster than innocent "brown" people and muslims. The blacklisting has little to nothing to do with evidence of the blacklisted individual (not) engaging in criminal activity.

Last edited by GUWonder; Oct 20, 12 at 12:46 pm
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Old Oct 20, 12, 7:04 pm
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Issues of whether or not "no-fly" lists are effective; whether there is sufficient due process; and of possible racism have been debated here for years.

Placing someone on the list only after they have completed one or more legs of a round trip, thereby gratuitously causing them to incur significant, additional travel and lodging expense, is a cheap cop trick.
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Old Oct 20, 12, 7:37 pm
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Originally Posted by sirdatary View Post
Ehrm... well... one of the first people he's going to talk to when he gets back home is a federal law enforcement officer (CBP) who probably has ways of determining his true identity and the fact that he's on a no-fly list.

I'm guessing that entering the country under these circumstances would cause even more problems for him.
I understood he is stuck in Hawaii - does he goes through immigration to enter mainland US?

DanishFlyer - who's never been to Hawaii, and don't know how/if immigration differs from mainland US.
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Old Oct 20, 12, 10:53 pm
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Originally Posted by DanishFlyer View Post
I understood he is stuck in Hawaii - does he goes through immigration to enter mainland US?

DanishFlyer - who's never been to Hawaii, and don't know how/if immigration differs from mainland US.
No.
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