What's With Checking IDs at Federal Court But Not Comparing to a List?
Jun 14, 2012, 2:08 am
#16
Moderator: Manufactured Spending
Join Date: Jul 2011
Posts: 6,580
) that the ID and BP match; decide for yourselves how that charade "enhances" security.This is one thing that actually makes sense. If they didn't do it, anyone on the list could buy a ticket under a different name.
The accuracy of the list is a whole other issue.
Jun 14, 2012, 7:53 am
#17
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Salish Sea
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Every kid in kindergarten learns that if someone has something of yours, you're in their power. Until they return it. Police (and lately hordes of other uniformed types) use the same trick; hand them your ID (DL, passport etc.) and you are now under their control and, unless you're willing to abandon it, you're also immobile.
Been that way for decades, first thing a cop will demand is ID. People don't know that in most stop-and-identify* states you are only required to identify yourself verbally. Of course if you do decline to show physical ID then you are immediately deemed guilty of Contempt of Cop, thereby guaranteeing things are going to go downhill real fast.
* not applicable to traffic stops although the same immobility occurs when the cop walks away with your DL
Jun 14, 2012, 8:05 am
#18
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Boston
Posts: 821
Well, the idea is to make sure that the name you gave the airline to compare against the list is actually your real name.
This is one thing that actually makes sense. If they didn't do it, anyone on the list could buy a ticket under a different name.
The accuracy of the list is a whole other issue.
This is one thing that actually makes sense. If they didn't do it, anyone on the list could buy a ticket under a different name.
The accuracy of the list is a whole other issue.
http://nathanbarry.com/no-fly-list/
Jun 14, 2012, 4:22 pm
#19
Moderator: Manufactured Spending
Join Date: Jul 2011
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Jun 14, 2012, 9:04 pm
#21
Join Date: Feb 2011
Posts: 642
Jun 15, 2012, 12:53 am
#22
Moderator: Manufactured Spending
Join Date: Jul 2011
Posts: 6,580
There are people who can make convincingly genuine fake passports for a couple hundred dollars. Does that mean that CBP should no longer check passports? After all, this defeats the entire alleged reason for checking them.
Jun 15, 2012, 5:45 am
#23
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: DCA
Posts: 239
Didn't want to start a new thread, but why does the Pentagon now have a body scanner to scan people ENTERING the building, in response to a shooting, 2 years ago, that occurred outside the building?
http://wtop.com/120/2903898/New-body...rs-at-Pentagon
http://wtop.com/120/2903898/New-body...rs-at-Pentagon
Jun 15, 2012, 6:12 am
#24
Join Date: Nov 2008
Posts: 3,657
Spending a great deal of time at the checkpoint, with one (or more!) dedicated individuals checking a security measure that can be trivially circumvented, seems to many observers (including this one) to be a waste of money. One could take that money and use it in better ways (e.g. assigning the TDC to other screening duties in order to improve accuracy and/or speed).
Jun 15, 2012, 7:21 am
#25
Join Date: Feb 2011
Posts: 642
Producing a fake boarding pass is far, far simpler than producing a fake passport. An ordinary office computer with basic image editing tools can do the job; the marginal cost of producing such a boarding pass is trivial.
Spending a great deal of time at the checkpoint, with one (or more!) dedicated individuals checking a security measure that can be trivially circumvented, seems to many observers (including this one) to be a waste of money. One could take that money and use it in better ways (e.g. assigning the TDC to other screening duties in order to improve accuracy and/or speed).
Spending a great deal of time at the checkpoint, with one (or more!) dedicated individuals checking a security measure that can be trivially circumvented, seems to many observers (including this one) to be a waste of money. One could take that money and use it in better ways (e.g. assigning the TDC to other screening duties in order to improve accuracy and/or speed).
Jun 17, 2012, 3:30 am
#26
Join Date: May 2003
Location: GEG
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Posts: 5,027
Requiring ID at federal courthouses is not only pointless security theater, it's against the Constitution. The Sixth Amendment guarantees criminal defendants the right to a public trial. If someone is on trial for something politically incorrect or heretical, IMO many would-be spectators might fear official reprisals and might well be deterred from viewing the trial because of the ID requirement.
Robert John Foti challenged the courthouse ID requirement (1); and, in 2007, the 9th Circuit Court of Appeals tossed the case without providing any significant explanation as to its reasoning. End of constitutional right.
It's also superfluous to require ID at courthouses and other federal buildings, because these places have cameras, and presently or Real Soon Now the cameras will be tied to some database and will be able to discern and log your identity.
To the credit of the U.S. Marshals Service, one time I forgot my Valid Government ID at a federal courthouse but was able to convince them of my identity by other methods. Thank you USMS for not always being mindless automatons.
(1) Foti v. McHugh (docket); (unpublished opinion)
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Robert John Foti challenged the courthouse ID requirement (1); and, in 2007, the 9th Circuit Court of Appeals tossed the case without providing any significant explanation as to its reasoning. End of constitutional right.
It's also superfluous to require ID at courthouses and other federal buildings, because these places have cameras, and presently or Real Soon Now the cameras will be tied to some database and will be able to discern and log your identity.
To the credit of the U.S. Marshals Service, one time I forgot my Valid Government ID at a federal courthouse but was able to convince them of my identity by other methods. Thank you USMS for not always being mindless automatons.
(1) Foti v. McHugh (docket); (unpublished opinion)
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Last edited by mbstone; Jun 17, 2012 at 4:01 am
Jun 17, 2012, 10:30 am
#27
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: DFW
Programs: AA EXP, MR Gold, HH Gold
Posts: 926
Ditto on the military ID checks, too. I don't want to go into too much detail about suspected security lapses I've noticed there, but unless they're scanning the ID, they'd never notice if my ID was expired. Heck, they'd probably never notice me entering with a DL.