NPR news story on TSA chatdown or BDO at Boston
Aug 16, 2011, 9:52 am
#1
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NPR news story on TSA chatdown or BDO at Boston
http://www.npr.org/2011/08/16/139643...ough-chat-down
This statement bothered me as I don't see how it is a part of the TSA's mission: "The TSA's George Nacarra says officers who've been doing this sporadically have already proven themselves, by rooting out untold drug smugglers and fugitives, for example."
Unfortunately they had no real rebuttal to the new TSA program, just this:
"Maybe they'll turn out to be great at it, but I wouldn't say they go so far as to inspire a lot of confidence," says Glenn Reynolds, a law professor at the University of Tennessee and a vocal critic of the TSA. Reynolds says behavior detection officers in the U.S. tend to be lower ranking and less educated than the Israelis, and may not be up to the task.
"It would be like deciding that you're suddenly going to do brain surgery in every minute clinic around the country," he says. "You can't just retrain those people who may be perfectly good at dealing with poison ivy and sinus infections to suddenly do brain surgery. I mean, it's just a different level."
This statement bothered me as I don't see how it is a part of the TSA's mission: "The TSA's George Nacarra says officers who've been doing this sporadically have already proven themselves, by rooting out untold drug smugglers and fugitives, for example."
Unfortunately they had no real rebuttal to the new TSA program, just this:
"Maybe they'll turn out to be great at it, but I wouldn't say they go so far as to inspire a lot of confidence," says Glenn Reynolds, a law professor at the University of Tennessee and a vocal critic of the TSA. Reynolds says behavior detection officers in the U.S. tend to be lower ranking and less educated than the Israelis, and may not be up to the task.
"It would be like deciding that you're suddenly going to do brain surgery in every minute clinic around the country," he says. "You can't just retrain those people who may be perfectly good at dealing with poison ivy and sinus infections to suddenly do brain surgery. I mean, it's just a different level."
Aug 16, 2011, 9:55 am
#2
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I forgot to highlight this comment.
"A blue-uniformed Transportation Security Administration (TSA) officer begins with a friendly "Hi, how are you?" and then spends a minute or two peppering passengers with basic questions like where they're going, for what and for how long.
Some travelers may not even speak English, but the behavior detection officers care less about answers than affect."
Not only do I feel it is none of their business where I am going and for what reason I find it amusing that they don't care about the answers. So if we don't answer are we perceived as an risk?
"A blue-uniformed Transportation Security Administration (TSA) officer begins with a friendly "Hi, how are you?" and then spends a minute or two peppering passengers with basic questions like where they're going, for what and for how long.
Some travelers may not even speak English, but the behavior detection officers care less about answers than affect."
Not only do I feel it is none of their business where I am going and for what reason I find it amusing that they don't care about the answers. So if we don't answer are we perceived as an risk?
Aug 16, 2011, 10:07 am
#3
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All of that obviously depends on the competence of the TSA, which is certainly questionable at best.
Aug 16, 2011, 10:09 am
#4
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http://www.npr.org/2011/08/16/139643...ough-chat-down
This statement bothered me as I don't see how it is a part of the TSA's mission: "The TSA's George Nacarra says officers who've been doing this sporadically have already proven themselves, by rooting out untold drug smugglers and fugitives, for example."
Unfortunately they had no real rebuttal to the new TSA program, just this:
"Maybe they'll turn out to be great at it, but I wouldn't say they go so far as to inspire a lot of confidence," says Glenn Reynolds, a law professor at the University of Tennessee and a vocal critic of the TSA. Reynolds says behavior detection officers in the U.S. tend to be lower ranking and less educated than the Israelis, and may not be up to the task.
"It would be like deciding that you're suddenly going to do brain surgery in every minute clinic around the country," he says. "You can't just retrain those people who may be perfectly good at dealing with poison ivy and sinus infections to suddenly do brain surgery. I mean, it's just a different level."
This statement bothered me as I don't see how it is a part of the TSA's mission: "The TSA's George Nacarra says officers who've been doing this sporadically have already proven themselves, by rooting out untold drug smugglers and fugitives, for example."
Unfortunately they had no real rebuttal to the new TSA program, just this:
"Maybe they'll turn out to be great at it, but I wouldn't say they go so far as to inspire a lot of confidence," says Glenn Reynolds, a law professor at the University of Tennessee and a vocal critic of the TSA. Reynolds says behavior detection officers in the U.S. tend to be lower ranking and less educated than the Israelis, and may not be up to the task.
"It would be like deciding that you're suddenly going to do brain surgery in every minute clinic around the country," he says. "You can't just retrain those people who may be perfectly good at dealing with poison ivy and sinus infections to suddenly do brain surgery. I mean, it's just a different level."
Last edited by goalie; Aug 16, 2011 at 10:22 am
Aug 16, 2011, 10:28 am
#5
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The behavior detection depends on analyzing your bodily reactions while answering the questions, not the actual answers. If you refused to answer you would presumably be subjected to additional screening, since your level of risk could not be ascertained during questioning.
The only way to get a real answer is to run experiments with passengers/FTers both refusing to answer and answering "I won't answer," and identifying the different outcomes.
I would be much more willing to cooperate or comply and not be stone-faced-silent if any arbitrary acknowledgment (verbal, non-verbal, hand gesture, whatever) that someone spoke at you was sufficient for this layer of "screening". I have no problem speaking to TSOs; I do have a problem with discussing anything of substance beyond aiding screening of my baggage and with providing them personal information, using my (not their) definition of personal.
Aug 16, 2011, 11:01 am
#6
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My personal favorite:
Huh? "We can't do this but we're gonna, just 'cause we feel like it."
And as for the drug smugglers, even if that were the mission of the TSA, why didn't the journalist ask them to put some numbers around it? "Untold" is not a number. What about a hit rate?
This piece is not particularly insightful.
Mike
"We are not making any assumption that we can do this," Nacarra says. "It may be that we have to seek other qualifications in our workforce, but that's the reason for a pilot test like this. This is just the beginning."
And as for the drug smugglers, even if that were the mission of the TSA, why didn't the journalist ask them to put some numbers around it? "Untold" is not a number. What about a hit rate?
This piece is not particularly insightful.
Mike
Aug 16, 2011, 7:36 pm
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Go here and learn "I do not understand," "Goodbye" and "Write it, please."
Aug 16, 2011, 7:58 pm
#9
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We should answer them like Dave Chapelle playing Little Jon:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9WVmWKB9xjU
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9WVmWKB9xjU
Aug 16, 2011, 8:27 pm
#10
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http://www.npr.org/2011/08/16/139643...ough-chat-down
This statement bothered me as I don't see how it is a part of the TSA's mission: "The TSA's George Nacarra says officers who've been doing this sporadically have already proven themselves, by rooting out untold drug smugglers and fugitives, for example."
This statement bothered me as I don't see how it is a part of the TSA's mission: "The TSA's George Nacarra says officers who've been doing this sporadically have already proven themselves, by rooting out untold drug smugglers and fugitives, for example."
This is one more reason not to answer any questions other than name and date of birth. See Miranda v. Arizona and later rulings whereby if you know you have the right to refrain from making statements that can be used against you, however innocent you are, and you make any statements that could in any way be construed as being an untold drug smuggler, fugitive or scofflaw who doesn't pay their parking tickets, then you will be a "told" drug smuggler, fugitive or scofflaw and miss your flight.
I would only give my address if I had someone watching my house to root out a drug smuggler, fugitive or thief who might be working at the airport or has accomplices tip off.
My personal favorite:
Huh? "We can't do this but we're gonna, just 'cause we feel like it."
And as for the drug smugglers, even if that were the mission of the TSA, why didn't the journalist ask them to put some numbers around it? "Untold" is not a number. What about a hit rate?
This piece is not particularly insightful.
Mike
Huh? "We can't do this but we're gonna, just 'cause we feel like it."
And as for the drug smugglers, even if that were the mission of the TSA, why didn't the journalist ask them to put some numbers around it? "Untold" is not a number. What about a hit rate?
This piece is not particularly insightful.
Mike
Aug 16, 2011, 11:48 pm
#11
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I forgot to highlight this comment.
"...Some travelers may not even speak English, but the behavior detection officers care less about answers than affect."
Not only do I feel it is none of their business where I am going and for what reason I find it amusing that they don't care about the answers. So if we don't answer are we perceived as an risk?
"...Some travelers may not even speak English, but the behavior detection officers care less about answers than affect."
Not only do I feel it is none of their business where I am going and for what reason I find it amusing that they don't care about the answers. So if we don't answer are we perceived as an risk?
TSA: "Where are you going today?"
Passenger: "No. No. Okay." *smiles nervously*
- will they be perceived as a threat?
If someone who speaks no English ignores the question, or speaks in an uncommon language -
TSA: "Where are you going today?"
Passenger: "Mae'n ddrwg gen i." *smiles nervously*
- will they be perceived as a threat?
This has got FAIL written all over it.
Aug 17, 2011, 5:21 am
#12
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Or if someone who speaks very little English gives a confused answer -
TSA: "Where are you going today?"
Passenger: "No. No. Okay." *smiles nervously*
- will they be perceived as a threat?
If someone who speaks no English ignores the question, or speaks in an uncommon language -
TSA: "Where are you going today?"
Passenger: "Mae'n ddrwg gen i." *smiles nervously*
- will they be perceived as a threat?
This has got FAIL written all over it.
TSA: "Where are you going today?"
Passenger: "No. No. Okay." *smiles nervously*
- will they be perceived as a threat?
If someone who speaks no English ignores the question, or speaks in an uncommon language -
TSA: "Where are you going today?"
Passenger: "Mae'n ddrwg gen i." *smiles nervously*
- will they be perceived as a threat?
This has got FAIL written all over it.
Aug 17, 2011, 5:53 am
#13
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This statement bothered me as I don't see how it is a part of the TSA's mission: "The TSA's George Nacarra says officers who've been doing this sporadically have already proven themselves, by rooting out untold drug smugglers and fugitives, for example."
I didn't realize they were combining their agency with the DEA. Uhm, I thought their original mission was to root out terrorists?
There's some mighty scary stuff going on within that organization. I'll start with saying that someone may soon be finding out that there's some people within that agency that really belong in an asylum for the criminally insane.
I didn't realize they were combining their agency with the DEA. Uhm, I thought their original mission was to root out terrorists?
There's some mighty scary stuff going on within that organization. I'll start with saying that someone may soon be finding out that there's some people within that agency that really belong in an asylum for the criminally insane.
Last edited by svenskaflicka; Aug 17, 2011 at 12:50 pm
Aug 17, 2011, 6:26 am
#14
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Stephen Glain recently wrote that "the legacy of American militarism is a national security complex that thrives on fraud, falsehood and deception". But DHS/TSA takes it to a new level by attempting to do it domestically to a larger extent instead of limiting itself to international angles of the same.
The TSA could not thrive in the absence of fraud, falsehood and deception. The voodoo "security" of "behavior detection" of terrorists (if that is even to be their primary target) is just another sign of how DHS/TSA is attempting to thrive by exploiting fraud, falsehood and deception.
"A supine or complicit Congress" and Presidents afraid of being called "weak" on "security" or of being called on engaging in "appeasement" dare not challenge DHS/TSA in any meaningful way. That in conjunction with an ignorant, apathetic and/or paranoid populace has enabled this latest DHS/TSA scheme. What a pitiful shame that now this BDO scam has been accepted as a normal way of doing who knows what at airports.
The TSA could not thrive in the absence of fraud, falsehood and deception. The voodoo "security" of "behavior detection" of terrorists (if that is even to be their primary target) is just another sign of how DHS/TSA is attempting to thrive by exploiting fraud, falsehood and deception.
"A supine or complicit Congress" and Presidents afraid of being called "weak" on "security" or of being called on engaging in "appeasement" dare not challenge DHS/TSA in any meaningful way. That in conjunction with an ignorant, apathetic and/or paranoid populace has enabled this latest DHS/TSA scheme. What a pitiful shame that now this BDO scam has been accepted as a normal way of doing who knows what at airports.
Last edited by GUWonder; Aug 17, 2011 at 12:08 pm
Aug 17, 2011, 6:39 am
#15
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This statement bothered me as I don't see how it is a part of the TSA's mission: "The TSA's George Nacarra says officers who've been doing this sporadically have already proven themselves, by rooting out untold drug smugglers and fugitives, for example."
I didn't realize they were combining their agency with the DEA. Uhm, I thought their original mission was to root out terrorists?
There's some mighty scary stuff going on within that organization. I'll start with saying that someone may soon be finding out that there's some people within that agency that really belong in an asylum.
I didn't realize they were combining their agency with the DEA. Uhm, I thought their original mission was to root out terrorists?
There's some mighty scary stuff going on within that organization. I'll start with saying that someone may soon be finding out that there's some people within that agency that really belong in an asylum.