"You WILL apologize...."
 

Really? I have another great story for your entertainment.

Friday, March 18, about 8:00 am, Newark Airport, Terminal A, satellite 1 (United gates). I had a ticket on the noon flight to Chicago but planned to stand by for the 10 am flight instead. Either way, I had plenty of time and, as usual, was ready for yet another battle with the TSA. I got one!

The TDC, an older heavy-set woman, scrutinized my passport for a little longer than I thought was necessary, so I asked her, "Is it real?" She said that it was and that it was really important that she be sure about that. I said that it really didn't matter if my ID is real -- that what matters is whether I'm carrying any weapons, explosives or incendiaries (the "WEI" that TSA is supposed to be looking for). She disagreed, saying that it's critically important for TSA to be sure of my identity and that, until she was satisfied, I wasn't going anywhere. I laughed at her and said that ID doesn't matter and she's wasting her time. Off to the usual good start!

Well, when I got to the front of the x-ray line, this woman walked over (which she could do because there was another TDC working there) and whispered something to the guy helping shepherd bags into the machine. He, in turn, whispered something to the guy looking at the x-ray monitor. I knew what was coming -- and, of course, I was right: "Bag check." Then, "Is this your bag?" Yes, it was my computer bag, full of all kinds of cords, papers, pens and other small items, even quarters (which I carry for tolls). All of it was just loose in the bag, basically. Never had a problem getting through the x-ray before, but this time I was targeted, obviously. You'll see.

A guy said, "I have to check your bag. Follow me." He carried my bag to a nearby table, and I followed with everything else (not much, really). He unzipped every possible pocket in the bag (lots of them!), then turned it upside-down on the table so that many of my things fell out! Then he started swabbing madly, even a bag of pistachio nuts that he scrutinized for quite a while, until I asked him if he knew what they were. His response, "Do you know what they are? Should I be concerned about them?" Uh-huh. I wasn't losing my cool yet, so he took out all of the papers from my bag (which hadn't fallen out already!) and started reading them, one by one. This was finally too much for me, and I demanded that he stop and call a supervisor. Now the story gets good.

Two supervisors quickly arrived, a woman named Venecia (I think I spelled it right, but this becomes important later) and a nameless man who seemed pretty much asleep at the switch. Venecia got all in my face from the get-go, asking why I wouldn't let the man screen my bag. I said that the TSA's mission of looking for WEI did not include reading my papers. She said that they had "discretion" to look at "anything" they liked, and that I "gave them that right" the moment I passed the TDC. Of course, that's mostly nonsense, and I said so. In my conversation with her, I called her by her name, pronouncing it "Ven-EE-shia." She had a major meltdown at that and said, "My name is "Ven-eh-shia." Then she made clear her unhappiness by calling me "Bruce-ey." Nice! I objected to that, of course, and on we went.

We continued. I told her that not only was the TSA not permitted to "read" my papers, but "that foolish man" turned my bag upside-down and dumped a lot of my stuff out. At that point, Venecia went ballistic and nearly screamed at me, "You cannot call that man names; you will apologize to him or you won't get past this point; you won't be going anywhere today until you apologize." Really? I demanded a screening manager. Venecia said that she is a supervisor. I said that I could see from her three stripes that she is a supervisor but that I needed to see the next level up, a screening manager -- and that, if she refused to call one, then I demanded a law-enforcement officer. She agreed to call a screening manager -- and noted that I don't need an LEO.

While we waited, the other supervisor, the sort-of-sleeping guy, asked for my boarding pass and ID. I said that they were in my bag, which I wasn't allowed to touch. So he walked over and rummaged through my things until he found my boarding pass. Then he proceeded to copy all sorts of information off of it. He did that out of my sight, but I could see him writing.

Finally, Rosemarie, the screening manager, arrived. She is a small, older woman, very pleasant. She introduced herself, and I explained what had been going on in the 20-30 minutes or so I had been there. She assured me that nobody was going to read my papers but they would flip the pages to be sure nothing was hidden inside them. She directed the "foolish man" to go someplace else and asked yet another supervisor (Jessica) to finish searching my bag.

Jessica removed everything from the bag -- and that's really quite a lot; the bag weights a ton -- and meticulously went through the items, swabbing madly. She even opened a small tin of breath mints! She carried the empty bag to the x-ray machine, asking if I wanted to go with her. I declined, preferring to stay with the bag's contents, rather than the empty bag. Finally, I was free to go. Rosemarie asked if I wanted to repack my bag or have Jessica do it. I chose Jessica.

While she repacked my bag -- badly, but she did it -- I told Rosemarie about Venecia's demand that I apologize to the "foolish man," or I wouldn't get past that point and wouldn't fly today. Rosemarie, who seemed pretty sensible start to finish, said that the TSA has no authority to make people apologize. She said that it probably wasn't a good idea to have called the man foolish and that some thoughts are best kept to oneself. I agreed but said that I have the right to believe he's foolish and can express that thought as long as I do it without profanity, without raising my voice and without disrupting the screening process for anyone else. She agreed. So I asked, "Can I go to my plane now, even though I did not apologize and have no intention of doing so?" She said yes. We said good-bye to each other. Never had a harsh word between us. She was very professional.

I went to the Red Carpet Club and changed my flight to 10 am, which I could still catch, then I walked to the gate. On the way, I passed the "foolish man," who was guarding an exit at that point. I walked up to him and observed that I was going to my flight even though I had not apologized and wasn't going to. He said, and I quote, "You're the man. You really got what you wanted today." I knew he was being sarcastic but decided to play along, agreeing that I'm really pretty cool and the fact that I didn't apologize is the coolest part. Unknown to me, Venecia was listening to this exchange from inside the TSA's little room along the corridor to the gates, and she burst out to glare at me. I decided that I really didn't have time to engage her once again, so I just glared back and walked to my gate.

I hope these clowns have trouble sleeping at night -- but, unfortunately, they probably sleep like babies.

Bruce

"you have no idea how to defend a nation. All you did was weaken a country today, "

:D

I believe we have heard of Venecia previously:

http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/trave...ml#post7743806

If it's the same one, it seems as if she has let her one success in life go to her head.

The power trip some of these TSOs are on is just staggering.

Yet another disgusting story of the total monetary waste that is the TSA. :mad: Harass, inconvenience, humiliate, subjugate, & dominate appears to be their credo.

Interesting. I didn't remember her name, but I remembered the incident.

Bruce

<sigh> Terr:rolleyes:rism Supp:rolleyes:rt Agency indeed. It's hard to stomach the fact that not only do we pay for this with our taxes but also with per-ticket fees.

And if she is the same one, in 4 years she has not risen in rank in the TSA. I wonder why......

There certainly seems to be an element of class warfare going on. Nobody mentions it, but those traveling by air, at least those who fly fairly often, tend to be at a higher rung on the societal ladder than the screeners. Not that this makes the flyers any better humans, but on the flip side, resentments held by the screeners certainly come into play at times esp in the form of "payback" that OP got.

Human nature at its finest. Next time you go there, prepare to get groped roughly.

There's a fine line between asserting your rights when it's important, and waking the dragon or dragoness when you don't have to.

So obviously you're going to write in about the idiotic parts of this but you should right in about RoseMarie as she's the type of supervisors you want to keep running into when the idiotic people do their thing.

I certainly hope that I gave Rosemarie appropriate credit. She was really the sanest person in the room, myself included! :)

Bruce

I have met many female screeners and LTSOs at EWR, as well as a few managers. I must say that the majority of the females I have encountered at EWR over the past few years appear to have some sort of attitude issue. (And as a female I have most likely received patdowns more often from females at EWR than you - assuming of course from your name that you are male!) The times I have however asked for a manager I was actually pleased with the outcome.

I have no doubt that those screeners with attitude know that they are doing jobs that are basically pointless for little pay, and are likely resentful that the people they process are going places they themselves will never see.

I also have no doubt about that.

Bruce

"I am sorry.... you are a foolish man working for a foolish agency".. would have shown the proper amount of contrition.

This is, sadly, the least offensive of the explanations.

I have no doubt that at least a percentage of those screeners with attitude couldn't care less what their social position is - they work for the TSA because it offers them endless opportunities to show people their true colors.

"I apologize for offending you with the truth."

Maybe you'll call me naive, but if you had gone in with a better attitude, things might have gone smoother for you. A positive mindset goes a long way. You expected a battle and you got what you wanted. I agree that the TSA are incompetent bullies, and the woman with the name issues sounds like a nut job, but you engaged first when you ridiculed the older woman examining your passport. It was just "a little longer" than you expected, so why be so impatient and ask a purposefully sarcastic question? Could it be, in your negative looking-for-a-fight mindset, that you incorrectly assumed she was being slow for the express purpose of holding you up? Maybe she's just old and slow. You could've taken our passport without saying anything and gone on your merry way.

I'm afraid I must concur with the idiot... you are indeed the man! Good on you for sticking up for yourself, and may you receive much karma for hopefully clearing the path of idiots that others might also have to negotiate.^

I forgot about that story. I have to say though, that the Kudos for this TSO is a little misplaced. The battered woman in question asked for help, and like any normal person, help was provided. If she had asked any of us for help, we would have done whatever was needed to get her to safety too. So, yeah, not impressed.

TSA started it and then further aggravated it with retaliatory actions. Plus with TSAs actions the OPs comments and actions are justified. Personally the OP was being nicer then what i would have done as i would have been all up in multiple clerks faces for there actions. TSAs mandate was to keep WEI off airplanes not go snooping in violation of the 4th amendment.

Aha.

Welcome to Flyertalk SilentCat. Brand new I see.

;)

Is it me, or are the TSA/DHS trolls coming out of the wood work lately.

All the more reason to keep your cell phone in record mode when going through the checkpoints, if you had her screaming at you on record and submitted it to the OIG, I think someone would have had to go through retraining. I highly doubt that requiring a passenger to apologize to a TSO is SOP.

Just make sure that the state allows recordings without permission.

Mr. Ellliott

That I don't know. I'm merely extending a sincere, warm welcome to someone who appears to be a brand new Flyertalk member

;)

That's disappointing. If I screamed at my customers, there would be no "re" training or "re" anything for that matter Same goes for most of us here I assume.

There's something to be said for picking your battles. The passport thing that apparently started this episode off I would have let slide, but that's just me.

However, there can be NO EXCUSE for the retaliation that occurred. If a passenger is acting snippy (in the opinion of the passport peruser), you as a TSA clerk are in the wrong job if you can't let it go. If you pursue this further to get even, you and whoever participated in the "getting even" should be summarily fired. You don't belong in that job and you are a danger to every person who runs into you.

Do you really think the OIG would take any meaningful action against a screener who screamed at a passenger? I'd like to think so but my confidence of that is very low.

It actually sounds like an accurate assessment of the situation... Sorry to say.:rolleyes:

I don't think Rosemarie was particularly professional either. She has no business telling you how to behave in public, not to mention the fact that you behaved in an absolutely appropriate way - right down to calling the guy foolish.

As for Venishia, you should really escalate with her.

Yes, PhlyingRPh, brand new. I'm also newly United Elite.
The way I read the OP's story, he got picked on after the passport check because he made fun of the woman checking his passport. That looks like he started the battle. I agree that the retaliatory picking on is inexcusable, and he appropriately stood up for himself, but the OP really could have let the first woman's slowness slide. It doesn't appear she was being belligerent, just took longer looking at his passport than he thought necessary. Doesn't seem there was any need for him to make it personal and get snide with her. If he had a little patience, I don't think the bag checkers would have whispered about him and targeted him.

America's a funny place. Some of us go out to vote. The votes elect whoever. The whoever pass laws, for a variety of reasons, only one of which is to represent the wishes of the citizens. The laws become regulations. People are hired to enforce the regulations. People who don't like the laws that these elected people pass the express their disagreement in confrontations with those enforcing the regulations. Feelings get hurt on every side. The whole thing really appears like a vehicle on bald tires that only gets someplace with a LOT of waste energy.

But hey, this is "the best society in the world". Gives a person an interesting perspective to judge all the other ways of doing things.

And people are ready to FIGHT TO THE DEATH to preserve this way of life.

In addition to the welcome, congratulations also appear to be in order, on becoming an Elite on United.

No doubt about it. I could have let her study my passport for as long as she liked, and I was not in a hurry. I had 4 hours until my flight and 2 hours until the flight I wanted to stand by for. Really, I was trying to help her to understand why checking IDs is silly. I was not angry or impatient about anything. I figured if I'm going to have to stand there, I might as well have a meaningful conversation, too.

I readily admit that I approach every encounter with the TSA ready, willing and able to fight. I learned from experience that you better be ready because fights happen all too often with thugs and bullies.

In my initial post (and the title of this thread), I focused on the demand for an apology because that struck me as the most inappropriate event of the whole encounter -- even worse than the retaliation or turning my bag upside-down for no reason. The notion that one person -- with some low level of authority -- can compel another to mouth certain words against his or her will is about as offensive as you can get. It carries undertones of slavery. I'm not Venecia's slave, and I'll be damned if I'm going to follow her orders to say what she demands, especially when I think the opposite. No way. Not in this lifetime.

Bruce

^

I agree, from experience that fights with TSO's and others in uniform can break out at any time and for absolutely no reason whatsoever other than they get off by ordering other people around. Sometimes they pick the wrong person.

That's awesome.

Another way to look at this situation is to realize how easily a group of TSO's at a checkpoint can be diverted from their primary mission.

If these TSO's were professional, they would have not taken the actions they did. Not necessarily because of courtesy to the OP, but based solely on security reasons. Resources and attention were diverted to a person who wasn't a threat. If the OP had been working as part of a team, the others would have possibly had an easier time getting something through the checkpoint.

This is what you get when you give a bunch of burger flippers a badge.

That's hardly fair.

The TSA is what you get when you give badges to a bunch of people who aren't even qualified to be burger-flippers.

The ones who might have the technical skills to flip burgers all have attitude problems, and the ones who don't have attitude problems don't have any actual skills.

Great Job, Bruce!

I hope you send in a complaint to EWR, but I'm sure it'll fall on deaf ears -- or file a complaint via the constituent services of a local congress-critter -- I did this once when a complaint fell on deaf ears and Senator McConnell's office did a great job handling it.

Now I have Senator Rand Paul's constituent services :)

SDF_T

Please share my story with Sen. Paul. It will give him more anti-TSA ammunition.

Bruce

Bruce, we still need to make a date with our C:rolleyes:ngresscritter...