Interrogated and Detained at IAH for Photographing
#47
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: IAD
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Posts: 1,780
The OP was posing no threat to aviation security, transportation security, or the airport by taking pictures. But instead of acting rationally, the crack BDO squad decided to harass someone until someone with the authority to detain showed up. It's not at all unlikely that the airport monkeys decided to tell the pigs something untrue, just as a retaliatory action for not bowing down and immediately recognizing their authority.
At any rate, we'll find out if DCA is much better at this game of "harass the innocent public for no reason" soon...
#50

Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: BOS and vicinity
Programs: Former UA 1P
Posts: 3,730
Only really interested in the last part you said. In fact, not only did the BDOs not do anything "blantanly illegal", they did nothing illegal.
And are you serious? All of your argument can be thrown out the window after what you said. So much for freedom and liberty, huh? Punish innocent people because your pissed off at the actions of others. Nice. You win te hypocrite award of the month award. Good job.
And are you serious? All of your argument can be thrown out the window after what you said. So much for freedom and liberty, huh? Punish innocent people because your pissed off at the actions of others. Nice. You win te hypocrite award of the month award. Good job.
The TSOs/BDOs? I said nothing about punishing the TSOs/BDOs. I may not like what they did, but like I said, they have as much right to follow someone around in a public place as anyone else.
The LEOs? Give me a break. They detained, harassed, intimidated, humiliated, lied to about legal questions, intrusively searched, and confiscated property without cause from an innocent citizen. The LEOs families? Give me a break. The ill-conceived actions of a spouse can ruin the other's life up to and including causing the family to be put out on the street; just ask Ruth Madoff. I didn't propose any legal or government punishments for the families, just social shame. Social shame is an incredibly powerful tool that is grossly underutilized these days--if the wife and kids are ashamed that their dad was a bullying cop and were shunned by the community and forced to live incognito, it would give great pause to other cops who were considering bullying citizens.
The events of the OP provide yet more evidence that our once great country has descended to a level as worse or worse than East Germany and the USSR. While many citizens, either in those past places or here, may never encounter such abuse because they keep their heads down and never challenge authority, that doesn't make the abuse right. Call me a hypocrite if you want, but I want my country back.
#51
FlyerTalk Evangelist




Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: DFW
Posts: 30,987
Only really interested in the last part you said. In fact, not only did the BDOs not do anything "blantanly illegal", they did nothing illegal.
And are you serious? All of your argument can be thrown out the window after what you said. So much for freedom and liberty, huh? Punish innocent people because your pissed off at the actions of others. Nice. You win te hypocrite award of the month award. Good job.
And are you serious? All of your argument can be thrown out the window after what you said. So much for freedom and liberty, huh? Punish innocent people because your pissed off at the actions of others. Nice. You win te hypocrite award of the month award. Good job.
All that happened up to the point of TSA employees violating his civil rights was walking around and taking some pictures in a public place.
TSA instigated these problems without cause.
#52
Join Date: Sep 2009
Posts: 3,702
What in the world does that have to do with what I wrote?
#53
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: jfk area
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I spent some time in East Germany 40 years ago when it was still the Deutsche Demokratische Republik. I had a camera with me but took almost no pictures, because our guide reeled off a long list of things it was unlawful to photograph and, to the extent that I could remember the list, there were hardly any scenes that didn't contain something verboten.
The guide, by the way, was a Communist Party hack and otherwise useless: he didn't know where anything was, took us to museums on the days they were closed, etc. He was always leaning out the window asking "Zum Bahnhof?" even though we didn't want to go to the Bahnhof at all.
The guide, by the way, was a Communist Party hack and otherwise useless: he didn't know where anything was, took us to museums on the days they were closed, etc. He was always leaning out the window asking "Zum Bahnhof?" even though we didn't want to go to the Bahnhof at all.
). I took photographs all over EB. At one point using my 400mm (about 18" long) telephone lens I was photographing a harbor and looked up and noticed that I was in front of a police station and a uniformed officer was looking down at me, I just continued to take photographs and wandered along.PS: That same summer I was hassled in Amsterdam by the hippies in Dam square when I photographed the area and in La Defense shopping center when I tried photographing the interior.
#54
Join Date: Sep 2009
Posts: 3,702
Who is innocent?
The TSOs/BDOs? I said nothing about punishing the TSOs/BDOs. I may not like what they did, but like I said, they have as much right to follow someone around in a public place as anyone else.
The LEOs? Give me a break. They detained, harassed, intimidated, humiliated, lied to about legal questions, intrusively searched, and confiscated property without cause from an innocent citizen. The LEOs families? Give me a break. The ill-conceived actions of a spouse can ruin the other's life up to and including causing the family to be put out on the street; just ask Ruth Madoff. I didn't propose any legal or government punishments for the families, just social shame. Social shame is an incredibly powerful tool that is grossly underutilized these days--if the wife and kids are ashamed that their dad was a bullying cop and were shunned by the community and forced to live incognito, it would give great pause to other cops who were considering bullying citizens.
The events of the OP provide yet more evidence that our once great country has descended to a level as worse or worse than East Germany and the USSR. While many citizens, either in those past places or here, may never encounter such abuse because they keep their heads down and never challenge authority, that doesn't make the abuse right. Call me a hypocrite if you want, but I want my country back.
The TSOs/BDOs? I said nothing about punishing the TSOs/BDOs. I may not like what they did, but like I said, they have as much right to follow someone around in a public place as anyone else.
The LEOs? Give me a break. They detained, harassed, intimidated, humiliated, lied to about legal questions, intrusively searched, and confiscated property without cause from an innocent citizen. The LEOs families? Give me a break. The ill-conceived actions of a spouse can ruin the other's life up to and including causing the family to be put out on the street; just ask Ruth Madoff. I didn't propose any legal or government punishments for the families, just social shame. Social shame is an incredibly powerful tool that is grossly underutilized these days--if the wife and kids are ashamed that their dad was a bullying cop and were shunned by the community and forced to live incognito, it would give great pause to other cops who were considering bullying citizens.
The events of the OP provide yet more evidence that our once great country has descended to a level as worse or worse than East Germany and the USSR. While many citizens, either in those past places or here, may never encounter such abuse because they keep their heads down and never challenge authority, that doesn't make the abuse right. Call me a hypocrite if you want, but I want my country back.
they and their families socially branded and ostracized so badly that decent people refuse to interact with them
Yeah, hide behind your claims that it's not governmen punishing them. What you suggest is far worse. And I makes you hypocritical in all that you say.
You not only want to punish the lives if innocent family members, you utterly wantto ruin their lives.
And notice, i am NOT talking about finical compensation, or putting them out on the street.
But if we take what you suggest and implement, I hope everyone in your family never violates a law, otherwise, your life may be ruined.
So wonderful to know that it's legal for two airport monkeys to follow someone around harassing them.
How are the BDOs innocent here? When they were (presumedly) on the phone with the police, they obviously knew that taking pictures in the airport wasn't illegal. What was the concern-- that someone didn't want to bow down to them and kiss their shoes, or stand at attention and raise their right arm up and forward toward them?
The OP was posing no threat to aviation security, transportation security, or the airport by taking pictures. But instead of acting rationally, the crack BDO squad decided to harass someone until someone with the authority to detain showed up. It's not at all unlikely that the airport monkeys decided to tell the pigs something untrue, just as a retaliatory action for not bowing down and immediately recognizing their authority.
At any rate, we'll find out if DCA is much better at this game of "harass the innocent public for no reason" soon...
How are the BDOs innocent here? When they were (presumedly) on the phone with the police, they obviously knew that taking pictures in the airport wasn't illegal. What was the concern-- that someone didn't want to bow down to them and kiss their shoes, or stand at attention and raise their right arm up and forward toward them?
The OP was posing no threat to aviation security, transportation security, or the airport by taking pictures. But instead of acting rationally, the crack BDO squad decided to harass someone until someone with the authority to detain showed up. It's not at all unlikely that the airport monkeys decided to tell the pigs something untrue, just as a retaliatory action for not bowing down and immediately recognizing their authority.
At any rate, we'll find out if DCA is much better at this game of "harass the innocent public for no reason" soon...

Last edited by Kiwi Flyer; Aug 24, 2010 at 12:12 pm Reason: merge consecutive posts
#55
FlyerTalk Evangelist




Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Chicago
Posts: 11,678
But the LEOs were pigs (and I use that term intentionally and specifically to refer to those LEOs that did this) who should be terminated, stripped of their pensions, sued for everything they are worth, they and their families through out on the street, and they and their families socially branded and ostracized so badly that decent people refuse to interact with them.
The TSOs/BDOs? I said nothing about punishing the TSOs/BDOs. I may not like what they did, but like I said, they have as much right to follow someone around in a public place as anyone else.
That makes them not innocent? Does the 1-year old know what daddy does for a living?
#57
Join Date: Aug 2010
Posts: 25
I'm sorry that the OP had to go through all that. 
IIRC, airports are not really "public" areas, or are they? Some of the airports that I've been to are operated by airport authories that are considered private corporation. What if the airport authority puts up "No Photography Inside" signs at the entrances? (which my local supermarket has)
I remember watching FoxNews(don't judge me
) yesterda and they were talking about Texas or some other state where it is illegal to photograph law enforcement officers on duty. I only saw 30 seconds.... what was that all about?

IIRC, airports are not really "public" areas, or are they? Some of the airports that I've been to are operated by airport authories that are considered private corporation. What if the airport authority puts up "No Photography Inside" signs at the entrances? (which my local supermarket has)
I remember watching FoxNews(don't judge me
) yesterda and they were talking about Texas or some other state where it is illegal to photograph law enforcement officers on duty. I only saw 30 seconds.... what was that all about?
#58
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: Newport Beach, California, USA
Posts: 36,062
I'm not so sure. Making a false police report is illegal. I don't know what they told the police that resulted in the OP's detention, but calling the police because they were made suspicious by the OP engaging in the clearly legal and constitutionally-protected act of photography clearly crosses a line. First, as has been pointed out time and time again, photography in an airport is legal, photography of a checkpoint is legal, and photography of TSOs is legal. Using someone's taking photographs and, particularly, outside the sterile area as grounds for interrogation and detention is, almost certainly, unconstitutional and illegal. Second, given the number of TSOs who have posted here about how they don't "want" to be photographed, it is at least reasonable to infer that, with respect to the IAH TSOs, the whole escalation was retaliatory. That, too, is illegal.
#60

Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: BOS and vicinity
Programs: Former UA 1P
Posts: 3,730
Social shame is probably the most civilized and palatable form of mob justice. But what else are we left with? Given the choice between deterring abuse by shaming a couple of families out of town (Houston in this case) or putting up with endless abuse by police, I'll take the lesser of the two evils. Particularly since I think it would work pretty quickly at making cops think twice before doing this sort of BS.

