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-   -   Home Land security issue (https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/checkpoints-borders-policy-debate/1062099-home-land-security-issue.html)

N965VJ Mar 12, 2010 11:55 am

If the issue is that serious, why hold back four weeks before deciding to publicize it? :confused:

bocastephen Mar 12, 2010 12:02 pm


Originally Posted by ronkramer88 (Post 13560306)
Infrequent lurker, my first post.
Last week coming back fro PVR to PHX I came across a gross violation regarding plane safety. It can definitely bring a plane down.
I called the FBI and said I wanted to put my complaint in writing (because I didn't want it swept under a rug) and they gave me a web site here in Phoenix that he said several agencies who were involved with homeland security issues controlled .Five days later no response of any kind.
If I do not here anything by Monday 4/15 I want to force the issue to the forefront. Where best to do it NY Times, here, CNN, everywhere I can?

Suggestions welcome.

I think you worry too much. Take a chill pill and relax. You don't need to report anything or get involved - and now you've made yourself into a person of interest to the FBI and DHS and they could begin watching you.

Next time, mind your own business - or just stop flying and find another form of transportation if it's so scary.

ronkramer88 Mar 14, 2010 5:26 pm

http://dat.erobertparker.com/bboard/...13#post2892413


As I reported in my PV Mexico post I experienced what I thought was a gross violation of airplane safety. As I also mentioned the second hand baggage search had the monitors confiscate tubes of cosmetics and bath products sold to them at the duty free shops located after the primary screening and in the boarding lounge area regardless that they were told these products would be allowed on the plane.

I bought 1.5 (over 50 oz.) of 86 proof whiskey. I could have legally bought 3L of 151 proof rum. This was handed to me as I boarded the plane and I put it I in the bin over my seat. A few seat in front of me and on the other side that buyer put his booze under the seat in front of him.

During takeoff it came to me what a folly this procedure is. I imagined a bad guy (or guys) could empty these bottles running down the carpet, in the overhead bin and anywhere else fire could get at essential control wiring. A 151 proof makes for a hot fire difficult to put of and I'm sure a lot of smoke which could lead to other terrorist acts?
In any case I called the FBI here in AZ and they gave me an e-mail address to write that would go to a group that feeds this kind of info the agencies that needed to know.
This is the e-mail:


----- Forwarded Message -----
From: [email protected]
To: [email protected]
Sent: Monday, March 8, 2010 11:06:34 AM GMT -07:00 US/Canada Mountain
Subject: Possible Homeland Security Problem

p { margin: 0; }To EVERYONE that this information may concern,

Returning from Mexico last week I realized Duty Free liquor sales are putting all Internationally traveling airplanes in jeopardy.
I bought a 1.5 liter bottle of whiskey which was delivered to me in the jetport and which I stored in the overhead bin. I thought this terribly dangerous.
A terrorist(s) (or any nutcase) could open the bottle(s) at anytime, anywhere in the plane during flight and ignite the fluid. Whether running the liquid down the carpet during takeoff, in the overhead or in the bathroom the resulting fire could be catastrophic.
I purchased a product that was 86 proof but one could also easily buy 151 proof products.
I thought that these purchases were normally kept for you in some forward locker in the plane and delivered to you upon exiting at your destination?

I would appreciate a reply as to your thoughts on this matter.


I have not, as yet, had a response.


Feel free to spread this information to any media in your locale


The cure is simple ALL duty free booze must be stored in a forward closet or bin and given to the passenger upon deplaning.

DevilDog438 Mar 14, 2010 5:40 pm

Might I suggest removing the actual emails from your post.

Other than that, I think I will grab the popcorn and watch the show.

ronkramer88 Mar 14, 2010 6:20 pm


Originally Posted by ND Sol (Post 13563637)
Ronkramer88, did you do a search on this forum to see if the issue you are concerned with has been addressed previously?


I did not.:

I experienced what I thought was a gross violation of airplane safety. As I also mentioned the second hand baggage search had the monitors confiscate tubes of cosmetics and bath products sold to them at the duty free shops located after the primary screening and in the boarding lounge area regardless that they were told these products would be allowed on the plane.

I bought 1.5 (over 50 oz.) of 86 proof whiskey. I could have legally bought 3L of 151 proof rum. This was handed to me as I boarded the plane and I put it I in the bin over my seat. A few seat in front of me and on the other side that buyer put his booze under the seat in front of him.

During takeoff it came to me what a folly this procedure is. I imagined a bad guy (or guys) could empty these bottles running down the carpet, in the overhead bin and anywhere else fire could get at essential control wiring. A 151 proof makes for a hot fire difficult to put of and I'm sure a lot of smoke which could lead to other terrorist acts?

ND Sol Mar 14, 2010 6:22 pm


Originally Posted by ronkramer88 (Post 13575444)
As I reported in my PV Mexico post I experienced what I thought was a gross violation of airplane safety.

I bought 1.5 (over 50 oz.) of 86 proof whiskey. I could have legally bought 3L of 151 proof rum. This was handed to me as I boarded the plane and I put it I in the bin over my seat. A few seat in front of me and on the other side that buyer put his booze under the seat in front of him.

During takeoff it came to me what a folly this procedure is. I imagined a bad guy (or guys) could empty these bottles running down the carpet, in the overhead bin and anywhere else fire could get at essential control wiring. A 151 proof makes for a hot fire difficult to put of and I'm sure a lot of smoke which could lead to other terrorist acts?
In any case I called the FBI here in AZ and they gave me an e-mail address to write that would go to a group that feeds this kind of info the agencies that needed to know.

I would appreciate a reply as to your thoughts on this matter.

The cure is simple ALL duty free booze must be stored in a forward closet or bin and given to the passenger upon deplaning.

If you would have done a search as I previously suggested, you would have seen that this has already been discussed. This risk has already been assessed.

And as for carrying on 151 rum, that is prohibited. The assessment has been made that anything in unopened bottles over 70% alcohol is a hazardous material. The cure is to keep the rule as it currently is with respect to duty-free and to change the rule to permit liquids back on board in greater than 3.4 oz.

AngryMiller Mar 14, 2010 6:27 pm

Delete post please.

ND Sol Mar 14, 2010 6:35 pm


Originally Posted by ronkramer88 (Post 13575727)
I did not.:

If you would have taken the time to do so, then you would have saved yourself the time you spent going down this rabbit trail and the time the rest of us spent on replying to your previously undefined threat. And on top of that, you are causing government agencies to spend their time on this when they have better things to do. So now our tax dollars are being wasted because you did not research the issue. :rolleyes:

fairdinkumbrad Mar 14, 2010 6:48 pm

hahaha what a nutcase!

conspiracies, secret squirrel behaviour, the x files, paranoia and duty free molotov cocktails...

bocastephen Mar 14, 2010 7:15 pm


Originally Posted by ronkramer88 (Post 13575727)
I did not.:

I experienced what I thought was a gross violation of airplane safety. As I also mentioned the second hand baggage search had the monitors confiscate tubes of cosmetics and bath products sold to them at the duty free shops located after the primary screening and in the boarding lounge area regardless that they were told these products would be allowed on the plane.

I bought 1.5 (over 50 oz.) of 86 proof whiskey. I could have legally bought 3L of 151 proof rum. This was handed to me as I boarded the plane and I put it I in the bin over my seat. A few seat in front of me and on the other side that buyer put his booze under the seat in front of him.

During takeoff it came to me what a folly this procedure is. I imagined a bad guy (or guys) could empty these bottles running down the carpet, in the overhead bin and anywhere else fire could get at essential control wiring. A 151 proof makes for a hot fire difficult to put of and I'm sure a lot of smoke which could lead to other terrorist acts?

Please do everyone a huge favor and avoid future travel at all costs.

Scubatooth Mar 14, 2010 7:31 pm

sorry 151 is not allowed by the airlines. most duty free shops if they have high proof the shelves are marked as such. normal liquors wont light off with out being mixed with other items, so no normal whiskey wont light.

Ari Mar 14, 2010 9:28 pm


Originally Posted by ronkramer88 (Post 13575444)
I could have legally bought 3L of 151 proof rum.

Welcome to flyertalk. ^

Did you actually see them selling 151, or is this just speculation that it could happen if a store sold it?

ronkramer88 Mar 14, 2010 10:48 pm


Originally Posted by Ari (Post 13576516)
Welcome to flyertalk. ^

Did you actually see them selling 151, or is this just speculation that it could happen if a store sold it?

Speculation. Thank you for the welcome in any case.

avsfan733 Mar 15, 2010 12:04 am


Originally Posted by ronkramer88 (Post 13575444)
In any case I called the FBI here in AZ and they gave me an e-mail address to write that would go to a group that feeds this kind of info the agencies that needed to know.

I had some friends in college who worked on the college ambulance crew. They actually had a pool of what they called 'frequent floppers' who they would transport on a monthly or better basis. I am pretty sure the FBI has a similar list. For you, and people like my old senile neighbor who called the FBI to tell them I was a terrorist because I flew to much.

Complaints like this that are trivial (but the complainer takes VERY seriously) waste real law enforcement time that could be spent actually keeping us safe. Such asinine attempts to keep us safe from an invisible enemies actually very actively make us less safe. :rolleyes:


Originally Posted by ronkramer88 (Post 13575444)
The cure is simple ALL duty free booze must be stored in a forward closet or bin and given to the passenger upon deplaning.

If I am delayed deplaning so FA's can hand out duty free liquor, your going to have bigger problems than somebody trying to light your rug on fire...


Originally Posted by bocastephen (Post 13575937)
Please do everyone a huge favor and avoid future travel at all costs.

Or at least warn us in advance so we can avoid the forthcoming chaos.

PhlyingRPh Mar 15, 2010 12:15 am

I have read OP's complaint and have ascertained that the only danger to international flights comes from the occasional crazed individual who might want to make himself some Bananas Foster en-route to his destination.

I am much more concerned about nervous or racist passengers spying on, and pointing out the behaviour of their fellow passengers on flights - those are the real nut cases that need to be held accountable by whatever means necessary, whether on the flight itself or at a time they least expect it later on.


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