Go Back  FlyerTalk Forums > Travel&Dining > Travel Safety/Security > Checkpoints and Borders Policy Debate
Reload this Page >

Another drunk passenger, another dispatch of fighter jets

Community
Wiki Posts
Search

Another drunk passenger, another dispatch of fighter jets

Thread Tools
 
Search this Thread
 
Old Jan 8, 2010 | 5:24 pm
  #16  
10 Countries Visited20 Countries Visited30 Countries Visited20 Years on Site
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: SXB
Programs: FB Silver, BD Gold rememberer, IHG Diamond Ambassador, Hilton and Marriott Gold, Accor Gold
Posts: 2,604
Originally Posted by YVR Cockroach
I'd like to see it happen (with me or anyone I care for not on the said a/c, of course) and see the reaction after.
You'd be disappointed: I guess collateral damage has entered the general public's state of mind.

It will be a dramatic accident, of course.
Richelieu is offline  
Old Jan 8, 2010 | 5:35 pm
  #17  
FlyerTalk Evangelist
10 Countries Visited
20 Countries Visited
 
Join Date: Nov 1999
Programs: FB PLT again afater a decade as plebian
Posts: 22,940
Originally Posted by thesaints
Control surfaces are very delicate (ever noticed NO STEP ?)
Sidewinders are heatseeking so will go for the engines.
YVR Cockroach is offline  
Old Jan 8, 2010 | 5:40 pm
  #18  
20 Countries Visited1M20 Years on Site
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: San Francisco, CA
Programs: DL PM/MM, Hilton Silver, SPG+, Hertz PC
Posts: 7,911
Originally Posted by YVR Cockroach
Sidewinders are heatseeking so will go for the engines.
which are found where on a jetliner ?
thesaints is offline  
Old Jan 8, 2010 | 5:40 pm
  #19  
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: FrostByte Falls, Mn
Programs: Holiday Inn Plat NW gold AA gold
Posts: 2,157
Originally Posted by Richelieu
You'd be disappointed: I guess collateral damage has entered the general public's state of mind.

It will be a dramatic accident, of course.
Suspect that an incident like that would pretty much put an end to most commercial aviation (non cargo). The political fallout from an incident like that would have people being led away in handcuffs especially since many folks don't know that the Posse Comitatus Act was repealed.
AngryMiller is offline  
Old Jan 8, 2010 | 5:41 pm
  #20  
FlyerTalk Evangelist
20 Countries Visited
1M
40 Nights
15 Years on Site
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Marriott or Hilton hot tub with a big drink <glub> Beverage: To-Go Bag DYKWIA:SSSS /rolleyes ☈ Date Night:Costco
Programs: Sea Shell Lounge Platinum, TSA Pre✓ Refusnik Diamond, PWP Gold, FT subset of the subset
Posts: 12,523
Originally Posted by Flaflyer
It's the new heavy handed version of Scared Straight. For only $10,000/hour.

Fighter pilot on bullyhorn: "Hey drunk. Promise to join AA or we will shoot down your plane."
Now, now, some sources claim the per flight hour cost of an F-16 is only ~$7,000.

Look at all the money we saved by not sending F-15s at $30,000/hour this time!
N965VJ is offline  
Old Jan 8, 2010 | 5:44 pm
  #21  
20 Countries Visited1M20 Years on Site
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: San Francisco, CA
Programs: DL PM/MM, Hilton Silver, SPG+, Hertz PC
Posts: 7,911
Originally Posted by N965VJ
Now, now, some sources claim the per flight hour cost of an F-16 is “only” ~$7,000.

Look at all the money we saved by not sending F-15s at $30,000/hour this time!
Best thing would be to rebuild the Nike coverage, so that a plane is always within reach of a missile. Radio triggered self destruct, like we have on experimental rockets would work too. Let TSA be in charge of the control room
thesaints is offline  
Old Jan 8, 2010 | 5:45 pm
  #22  
FlyerTalk Evangelist
10 Countries Visited
20 Countries Visited
 
Join Date: Nov 1999
Programs: FB PLT again afater a decade as plebian
Posts: 22,940
Originally Posted by thesaints
which are where ?
The sensitive controls such as ailerons are towards the wing tips. Flaps, which generally tend to be nearer the center of the a/c aren't necessary for basic flight control. The a/c should be able to survive and engine being blown off (or rather, peel away as a result of being blown off) but definitely not two.

FWIW, the DHL A300 that was hit by a SAM at Baghdad in 2003, according to wikipedia, managed to land despite total loss of hydraulic flight controls, not too different to UA 232 (DC-10) at SUX. Evidently, it survived this:

YVR Cockroach is offline  
Old Jan 8, 2010 | 5:50 pm
  #23  
20 Countries Visited1M20 Years on Site
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: San Francisco, CA
Programs: DL PM/MM, Hilton Silver, SPG+, Hertz PC
Posts: 7,911
Originally Posted by YVR Cockroach
The sensitive controls such as ailerons are towards the wing tips. Flaps, which generally tend to be nearer the center of the a/c aren't necessary for basic flight control. The a/c should be able to survive and engine being blown off (or rather, peel away as a result of being blown off)...
Let's say the a/c could survive an engine blown off. All the mechanical actuators have to reach the wing tips and they pass near the engine.
thesaints is offline  
Old Jan 8, 2010 | 5:55 pm
  #24  
10 Countries Visited20 Countries Visited30 Countries Visited20 Years on Site
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: SXB
Programs: FB Silver, BD Gold rememberer, IHG Diamond Ambassador, Hilton and Marriott Gold, Accor Gold
Posts: 2,604
@AngryMiller

I must confess not knowing a lot about the KE7 flight shot above the USSR airspace, but I seem to remember airlines still decided to fly over the Russian airspace after that, so I guess you're overly optimistic (I'd love to be, as well) by predicting it would be a hard blow to the air travel industry.
Richelieu is offline  
Old Jan 8, 2010 | 5:56 pm
  #25  
 
Join Date: Mar 2000
Location: YVR
Posts: 9,998
Originally Posted by YVR Cockroach
What does the USAF have in the way of air-to-air armaments anyway? Sparrows, Sidewinders, AMRAAM, or just plain ol' 20mm cannon?
Would it matter?

I seem to recall that the military aircraft eventually dispatched on 9/11 had no armaments fittes (or if they did, no facility to activate them.)
Ken hAAmer is offline  
Old Jan 8, 2010 | 5:59 pm
  #26  
20 Countries Visited1M20 Years on Site
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: San Francisco, CA
Programs: DL PM/MM, Hilton Silver, SPG+, Hertz PC
Posts: 7,911
Originally Posted by Ken hAAmer
Would it matter?

I seem to recall that the military aircraft eventually dispatched on 9/11 had no armaments fittes (or if they did, no facility to activate them.)
If they are loaded, they are active.
thesaints is offline  
Old Jan 8, 2010 | 6:02 pm
  #27  
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: CLT
Programs: Choice Hotels/FFOCUS
Posts: 7,259
Except for the fighters ^to this crew.
coachrowsey is offline  
Old Jan 8, 2010 | 6:06 pm
  #28  
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: FrostByte Falls, Mn
Programs: Holiday Inn Plat NW gold AA gold
Posts: 2,157
Originally Posted by Richelieu
@AngryMiller

I must confess not knowing a lot about the KE7 flight shot above the USSR airspace, but I seem to remember airlines still decided to fly over the Russian airspace after that, so I guess you're overly optimistic (I'd love to be, as well) by predicting it would be a hard blow to the air travel industry.
The wreckage of that flight went into the ocean. The Soviets did their best to intercept remains, wreckage, etc so as to keep it away from the press. Some remains and wreckage did wash up on the shores of Japanese northern islands. You bring down an airliner in CONUS and you'll have serious problems. Also flight 007 was owned and operated by the S. Koreans so except for the few Americans on board it was a Korean problem.
AngryMiller is offline  
Old Jan 8, 2010 | 6:08 pm
  #29  
FlyerTalk Evangelist
10 Countries Visited
20 Countries Visited
 
Join Date: Nov 1999
Programs: FB PLT again afater a decade as plebian
Posts: 22,940
Originally Posted by Ken hAAmer
Would it matter?

I seem to recall that the military aircraft eventually dispatched on 9/11 had no armaments fittes (or if they did, no facility to activate them.)
IIRC, one of the pilots after UA93 was said to have considered ramming the a/c as the plane was unarmed. Moot point as the a/c was crashed before interception.
YVR Cockroach is offline  
Old Jan 8, 2010 | 6:11 pm
  #30  
FlyerTalk Evangelist
10 Countries Visited
20 Countries Visited
 
Join Date: Nov 1999
Programs: FB PLT again afater a decade as plebian
Posts: 22,940
Originally Posted by Richelieu
@AngryMiller

I must confess not knowing a lot about the KE7 flight shot above the USSR airspace, but I seem to remember airlines still decided to fly over the Russian airspace after that, so I guess you're overly optimistic (I'd love to be, as well) by predicting it would be a hard blow to the air travel industry.
All the 3 air-to-air shootdown incidents I referred to earlier happened over 26 years ago, so most people here (I wager) were very young if even born. KE7 was flying over prohibited Soviet airspace. Some airlines, notably JL and maybe SK, have long had trans-Siberian flights through Soviet airspace throughout the Cold War (sm).
YVR Cockroach is offline  


Contact Us - Archive - Advertising - Cookie Policy - Privacy Statement - Terms of Service -

This site is owned, operated, and maintained by MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. Copyright © 2026 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Designated trademarks are the property of their respective owners.