Cathay Pacific 2017 first half results - HK$2.05b loss
Aug 14, 2017, 10:06 pm
#31
Join Date: Jan 2011
Posts: 2,346
The banks! Probably a few banks, including commercial banks, given the size of their hedge. Commodities used to be the most profitable division for GS!
Aug 14, 2017, 10:16 pm
#32
Join Date: Aug 2011
Posts: 1,421
yes
this is HKG
CX is making tonnes of money- and can make more- its HKG....
the model is not wrong, CX should not become an LCC
those who bet on the fuel are wrong.
if CX had not bet on the fuel... my they would have destroyed HX by now....
the only people who say CX's model is wrong are competitors - well of course the competition is going to say the opposite of what is needed especially when CX is thrashing them - QF....
this is HKG
CX is making tonnes of money- and can make more- its HKG....
the model is not wrong, CX should not become an LCC
those who bet on the fuel are wrong.
if CX had not bet on the fuel... my they would have destroyed HX by now....
the only people who say CX's model is wrong are competitors - well of course the competition is going to say the opposite of what is needed especially when CX is thrashing them - QF....
Aug 15, 2017, 7:13 am
#33
Join Date: Jun 2015
Location: New York
Programs: AA, CX, Hyatt, Marriott
Posts: 1,484
Surprisingly, for china-NA transfer market, CX have done quite a good job. Even the NA-China direct flight supply have increase unprecedently, CX can still keep the market.
The below link show that the number of people transfer via HK in the US-China market has not changed while KE and NH drop significantly.
Below link is in Chinese.
http://news.carnoc.com/list/414/414227.html
The below link show that the number of people transfer via HK in the US-China market has not changed while KE and NH drop significantly.
Below link is in Chinese.
http://news.carnoc.com/list/414/414227.html
The pie charts that show passengers taking connecting flights outside of Mainland China, revealed 20% connecting in 2014 dropped to 14% in 2016. This is my point - people prefer to take direct flights from Mainland now. But I do agree with you on that CX did a job good in keeping the same number of passengers (about 300k) from 2014 to 2016, despite this trend.
The CN-NA via HKG route PEY is still very competitive, IMO. The level of service at CX PEY is equal to or better than domestic First with AA, so I could not complain at all.
Last edited by andersonCooper; Aug 15, 2017 at 7:43 am
Aug 15, 2017, 11:46 am
#34
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So, it depends how you interpret those numbers and see the numbers behind the numbers. Cathay is struggling.
Aug 16, 2017, 2:28 am
#35
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https://www.bloomberg.com/news/artic...s-announcement
CX IT woes extends to its financial reporting...
CX IT woes extends to its financial reporting...
Aug 16, 2017, 2:34 am
#36
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Finally http://www.hkexnews.hk/listedco/list...0170816199.pdf
HK$2 billion loss...(way worse than 1.2....)
HK$2 billion loss...(way worse than 1.2....)
Aug 16, 2017, 2:54 am
#38
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Aug 16, 2017, 3:35 am
#39
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(From 2016 Annual Report)
The cash flow hedge reserve of the Group is expected to be charged to operating profit or transferred to relevant assets
as noted below when the hedged transactions affect profit or loss or the relevant assets are recognised.
Total
HK$M
2017 (3,980)
2018 (2,899)
2019 (216)
2020 231
2021 238
Beyond 2021 771
Total (5,855)
So they've used up 81% of their annual expected hedging loss in 2017 1H...?
The cash flow hedge reserve of the Group is expected to be charged to operating profit or transferred to relevant assets
as noted below when the hedged transactions affect profit or loss or the relevant assets are recognised.
Total
HK$M
2017 (3,980)
2018 (2,899)
2019 (216)
2020 231
2021 238
Beyond 2021 771
Total (5,855)
So they've used up 81% of their annual expected hedging loss in 2017 1H...?
Aug 16, 2017, 8:33 am
#40
Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: HKG
Programs: BA(GGL) QF LTS CX AM, Hilton Diamond, PPL(A)
Posts: 1,654
Also suggesting that Cathay Dragon be converted to an LCC is ludicrous as KA provides crucial feeder and cargo capabilities to the group. More insane thought by some analysts is how CX should merge with Air China - I think the cross shareholding structure is fine as it stands today.
Malaysia Airlines 'Aggressively Hedging' on Forecast Oil Will Rise to $70 (Bloomberg)
Aug 16, 2017, 8:58 am
#41
Join Date: Jul 2014
Location: SFO/HKG
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Aug 17, 2017, 12:08 am
#43
Join Date: Jul 2016
Location: HK
Programs: CX DM, IHG G, Hyatt Explorist, Marriott Silver
Posts: 39
Although i take some comfort in the fact that CX would have made a healthy operating profit had it not been for the big loss from fuel hedging, I worry what the actual loss will mean for the future of the company. Cost cutting will hurt the image, drive away premium passengers, and it risks becoming "just another airline" that no longer wins awards. i wonder if the management will recognize that their premium model is not flawed, and simply try to stay the course to work its way out of the fuel losses?
Also they should publicly name and shame the idjut who signed them up for those irreversible fuel contracts! That guy should not simply be rotated out to another cush job in swire group. He should be strung up and never work again!
CX passengers (and flight crew, pilots, etc) are all suffering because of him!
Also they should publicly name and shame the idjut who signed them up for those irreversible fuel contracts! That guy should not simply be rotated out to another cush job in swire group. He should be strung up and never work again!
CX passengers (and flight crew, pilots, etc) are all suffering because of him!
Aug 17, 2017, 12:22 am
#44
Join Date: Jan 2011
Posts: 2,346
This sort of colonial-era management style is the biggest problem with CX, in my opinion.
Aug 17, 2017, 12:23 am
#45
Join Date: Oct 2016
Posts: 291
Although i take some comfort in the fact that CX would have made a healthy operating profit had it not been for the big loss from fuel hedging, I worry what the actual loss will mean for the future of the company. Cost cutting will hurt the image, drive away premium passengers, and it risks becoming "just another airline" that no longer wins awards. i wonder if the management will recognize that their premium model is not flawed, and simply try to stay the course to work its way out of the fuel losses?
Also they should publicly name and shame the idjut who signed them up for those irreversible fuel contracts! That guy should not simply be rotated out to another cush job in swire group. He should be strung up and never work again!
CX passengers (and flight crew, pilots, etc) are all suffering because of him!
Also they should publicly name and shame the idjut who signed them up for those irreversible fuel contracts! That guy should not simply be rotated out to another cush job in swire group. He should be strung up and never work again!
CX passengers (and flight crew, pilots, etc) are all suffering because of him!