cant be bothered anymore...
Nov 8, 2003, 3:42 am
#1
Original Poster
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: United kingdom
Programs: BAEC, SPG Gold, Marriott Gold Elite, Hyatt Gold Passport, Tesco clubcard!
Posts: 701
cant be bothered anymore...
If no one wants my help on advice then i will stop giving it... I really cant be bothered anymore.
Its up to you guys, appreciate it instead of moaning!
[This message has been edited by lhrworker (edited 11-08-2003).]
Its up to you guys, appreciate it instead of moaning!
[This message has been edited by lhrworker (edited 11-08-2003).]
Nov 8, 2003, 6:13 am
#3
Join Date: May 2003
Location: London
Posts: 1,666
For what it's worth, LHR, I think you're spot on. Your comments fully reflect my personal experience as no-status, silver, discount and full-fare passenger, staff passenger and observer of ridiculous "elite" petulance many times.
Can't see any justification for expected upgrades - how vulgar - but have always done very well on that count, both as paid and staff pax. Think it's all about the way one relates to people and there's nothing more unattractive than arrogance and bullying, is there?
I also think that if it's a choice between staff and normal pax being upgraded when there are sufficient seats to accommodate the paid pax in their paid cabins, there should be no contest: the staff get it. Makes sound commercial sense to: a) treat your staff well; and b) give customers what they have paid for. The amount of whining and scheming hereon is testament to the fact that many routinely expect more than they paid for and it's not good business.
Finally, the converse view: ask any airline staff entitled to premium cabins how often they have been downgraded when their cabin oversells. Very unpleasant, especially on longhauls. The darkside of the b/p being rejected at the gate!
Can't see any justification for expected upgrades - how vulgar - but have always done very well on that count, both as paid and staff pax. Think it's all about the way one relates to people and there's nothing more unattractive than arrogance and bullying, is there?
I also think that if it's a choice between staff and normal pax being upgraded when there are sufficient seats to accommodate the paid pax in their paid cabins, there should be no contest: the staff get it. Makes sound commercial sense to: a) treat your staff well; and b) give customers what they have paid for. The amount of whining and scheming hereon is testament to the fact that many routinely expect more than they paid for and it's not good business.
Finally, the converse view: ask any airline staff entitled to premium cabins how often they have been downgraded when their cabin oversells. Very unpleasant, especially on longhauls. The darkside of the b/p being rejected at the gate!
Nov 8, 2003, 10:10 am
#4
Join Date: Feb 2001
Location: somewhere north of stateside...
Posts: 4,153
lhrworker, I am a bit (well maybe a bit more than a bit 
) of a lurker on the BA boards, and I have certainly appreciated your insight here on FT. Thank you.
I certainly understand the rationale of BA seating all pax in their ticketed cabins, even if that means putting employees in Club (or even FIRST) to protect the 'premium' classes and BA revenue.
Flying BA through LHR, I have never noticed BA ground staffers loafing about and chatting with one another in the same way as some other airline workers in other parts of the world. You people really do work hard and a long-haul in Club would be a real perk to the job (if, of course, the seat would be available).
As for operationally upgrading random passengers over gold or silver card holders in an oversell situation, this seems to be the heart of the issue, particularly on long-haul flights.
I can understand how the company might view this as revenue protection and an encouragement for more frequent fliers to book themselves into a higher class of service. Creating a culture of the 'expected-operational' upgrade could hurt revenues in the long-term.
At the same time, however, I do think it's important to note that many silvers and golds lay out a good amount of spend to BA each year. When forced to upgrade for operational reasons, it does follow that they might hope BA would reward the favour and in return and give them an upgrade over once-a-year travellers. After all, to the consumer, it makes the most sense to reward your most loyal customers...
That said, some will remain divided on the issue, which is alright... We wouldn't want everyone in the world to agree; that would make for a rather boring life.
lhrworker, I really do hope that you will stick around and continue to post on FT - I appreciate your contributions.
I would just like to also caution you about how you post here, as I wouldn't hope for you to be 'found out' by BA and face any discipline. Even though you are posting on your own time (and that certainly does say something about your committment to BA and your passengers), BA could see you as de facto representing them... just a caution (and I do mean that in the most friendly way possible)
.
I understand in the other thread that there were a few personal knocks against you and were I in your shoes, they wouldn't have made me feel good either. In those circumstances, though, I usually find it is most helpful to just shut the computer down and wait a few hours before posting... trust me, you come out the better person in the end.
Take care.
) of a lurker on the BA boards, and I have certainly appreciated your insight here on FT. Thank you.I certainly understand the rationale of BA seating all pax in their ticketed cabins, even if that means putting employees in Club (or even FIRST) to protect the 'premium' classes and BA revenue.
Flying BA through LHR, I have never noticed BA ground staffers loafing about and chatting with one another in the same way as some other airline workers in other parts of the world. You people really do work hard and a long-haul in Club would be a real perk to the job (if, of course, the seat would be available).
As for operationally upgrading random passengers over gold or silver card holders in an oversell situation, this seems to be the heart of the issue, particularly on long-haul flights.
I can understand how the company might view this as revenue protection and an encouragement for more frequent fliers to book themselves into a higher class of service. Creating a culture of the 'expected-operational' upgrade could hurt revenues in the long-term.
At the same time, however, I do think it's important to note that many silvers and golds lay out a good amount of spend to BA each year. When forced to upgrade for operational reasons, it does follow that they might hope BA would reward the favour and in return and give them an upgrade over once-a-year travellers. After all, to the consumer, it makes the most sense to reward your most loyal customers...
That said, some will remain divided on the issue, which is alright... We wouldn't want everyone in the world to agree; that would make for a rather boring life.
lhrworker, I really do hope that you will stick around and continue to post on FT - I appreciate your contributions.
I would just like to also caution you about how you post here, as I wouldn't hope for you to be 'found out' by BA and face any discipline. Even though you are posting on your own time (and that certainly does say something about your committment to BA and your passengers), BA could see you as de facto representing them... just a caution (and I do mean that in the most friendly way possible)
.I understand in the other thread that there were a few personal knocks against you and were I in your shoes, they wouldn't have made me feel good either. In those circumstances, though, I usually find it is most helpful to just shut the computer down and wait a few hours before posting... trust me, you come out the better person in the end.
Take care.
Nov 8, 2003, 11:58 am
#5
Join Date: Oct 1999
Location: Don't know....
Programs: BA LTG, SQ TPPS, CX DMP, AA EXP, Bonvoy LTT, ALL PLT, Hilton DM
Posts: 4,010
lhrworker,
i've read your many posts with great interest. there are always two sides to a story. you've explained your point of view which is someone who deals with many passengers a day. there are bound to be some bad apples but i hope you don't think that represents all travelers.
i'm a traveler, and i hope you read and understand the traveler's point of view before jumping on people's posts. for example, as hfly mentioned, BA sometimes mails out their new cards very late. we have 3 gold memebers in our household and we all got them late before. i can tell you for my family, we are not using out of date cards on purpose to try and cheat any system.
i do hope you stay. you do offer good insight to how things work. i hope in return travelers will be able to offer you the view from the other side of the desk.
i've read your many posts with great interest. there are always two sides to a story. you've explained your point of view which is someone who deals with many passengers a day. there are bound to be some bad apples but i hope you don't think that represents all travelers.
i'm a traveler, and i hope you read and understand the traveler's point of view before jumping on people's posts. for example, as hfly mentioned, BA sometimes mails out their new cards very late. we have 3 gold memebers in our household and we all got them late before. i can tell you for my family, we are not using out of date cards on purpose to try and cheat any system.
i do hope you stay. you do offer good insight to how things work. i hope in return travelers will be able to offer you the view from the other side of the desk.
Nov 8, 2003, 1:04 pm
#7
Original Poster
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: United kingdom
Programs: BAEC, SPG Gold, Marriott Gold Elite, Hyatt Gold Passport, Tesco clubcard!
Posts: 701
no offence taken but i just want people to appreciate what i have to say, i am only on here to help out and give people the info that the dont have to the time to get or what to ask for at the airport....
Remember... this is in my own time now and i m not at work!!
Thank you for your appreciation. I do hope you all find my posts informative and i have found people have found them spot on!
Thank you if you think they are!!!
I agree that not all card holders are the same but there are a majority out there!!
I would never divulge any "inside" company information or mention anything that would not have already been made public knowledge one way or another.
[This message has been edited by lhrworker (edited 11-08-2003).]
Remember... this is in my own time now and i m not at work!!
Thank you for your appreciation. I do hope you all find my posts informative and i have found people have found them spot on!
Thank you if you think they are!!!
I agree that not all card holders are the same but there are a majority out there!!
I would never divulge any "inside" company information or mention anything that would not have already been made public knowledge one way or another.
[This message has been edited by lhrworker (edited 11-08-2003).]
Nov 8, 2003, 1:06 pm
#8
Original Poster
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: United kingdom
Programs: BAEC, SPG Gold, Marriott Gold Elite, Hyatt Gold Passport, Tesco clubcard!
Posts: 701
Just to clarify... the only people that get first are people that have that as their staff category. These people ar flight deck, CSDs, senior management and board memembers..
Us normal paupers are lucky to get J!!!
Us normal paupers are lucky to get J!!!
Nov 8, 2003, 5:24 pm
#9
Moderator: UK and Ireland & Europe
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Biggleswade
Programs: SK*G, Lots of Blue Elsewhere
Posts: 13,611
lhrworker - I for one certainly do appreciate your posts. It's normal that for operations as complex as BA's, there are differences in applications of procedures and policy, and having differing frontline experiences, from different perspectives, is excellent information, especially for the scum (blue, discount-Y) traveller like myself
I appreciate your presence here.
I appreciate your presence here.
Nov 9, 2003, 4:55 am
#11
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: On the X26 bus to and from LHR
Programs: BA Blue. 19695 Lifetime TPs
Posts: 2,316
So do, I and all front-line advice. And I am certainly not one of those who goes in card-first (nose first, that's me!). I was merely observing that my clients (bless them) still pay full fare J and BA (bless them) still upgrade me from that to F from time to time. Which was not what the insider view was. I guess, as with all u/g matters, there are as many experiences as flyers. Peace and love (England just beat Wles!!!)
Nov 11, 2003, 6:00 am
#13
Join Date: Dec 2003
Posts: 55
<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by lhrworker:
If no one wants my help on advice then i will stop giving it... I really cant be bothered anymore.
Its up to you guys, appreciate it instead of moaning!
[This message has been edited by lhrworker (edited 11-08-2003).]</font>
If no one wants my help on advice then i will stop giving it... I really cant be bothered anymore.
Its up to you guys, appreciate it instead of moaning!
[This message has been edited by lhrworker (edited 11-08-2003).]</font>
But, as I dont get much time to lurk here these days, I tend to have a marathon post reading session and having read most of your recent posts this morning I want to let you know, in the kindest, most well meaning way possible, that you can come accross as being abrasive and your writing style makes people feel defensive and "rubbed up the wrong way"
If we were all honest about it, I think we would all conclude that being a Silver/Gold isnt as fantastic a perk as it could be and that BA have some policies that for reasons best known to themselves tend to alienate their best customers. But LHR Worker, there are good ways and bad ways of giving this news to people. Study the style of people like Merry and Maws22, they manage to convey similar messages to your own without getting people upset.
I appreciate the time you take to post and find your information valuable and I would like to thank you for this. But please do yourself the justice of moderating your writing style.
Rhys.
Nov 11, 2003, 6:20 am
#14
Join Date: Mar 2003
Programs: BA - GGL GFL
Posts: 1,777
<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by Rhys UK:
Well, firstly I find your posts quite intresting and hope you will continue to be an active member of the board.
your writing style makes people feel defensive and "rubbed up the wrong way"
But LHR Worker, there are good ways and bad ways of giving this news to people. Study the style of people like Merry and Maws22, they manage to convey similar messages to your own without getting people upset.
</font>
Well, firstly I find your posts quite intresting and hope you will continue to be an active member of the board.
your writing style makes people feel defensive and "rubbed up the wrong way"
But LHR Worker, there are good ways and bad ways of giving this news to people. Study the style of people like Merry and Maws22, they manage to convey similar messages to your own without getting people upset.
</font>
Please do continue to contribute, but perhaps its worthwhile re-reading what you've posted and imagine how a customer who spends £10s or £100s of thousands of pounds with BA might feel.