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Old Dec 10, 2023, 12:09 pm
  #1  
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CityFlyer cabin densification
It looks like BA CityFlyer will densify its E190 which means less legroom, 1 additional cabin crew and may be (unfortunately) the introduction of BoB out of LCY.

https://x.com/tofly_totravel/status/...bWhK-MZBVRzkYg
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Old Dec 10, 2023, 12:17 pm
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Originally Posted by BA6948
may be (unfortunately) the introduction of BoB out of LCY.

https://x.com/tofly_totravel/status/...bWhK-MZBVRzkYg
Do they have the galley space to offer BoB with the densification just out of curiosity?

It seems quite fair to assume it's coming though. They're not designing the densification from 96 to 108 (instead of 100) and paying for another CC's wage (which wouldn't justify the densification) if they can't use the extra hands on deck.
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Old Dec 10, 2023, 12:27 pm
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Yikes...
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Old Dec 10, 2023, 12:30 pm
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Er, how can that make economic sense?
If its true it s triumph of mediocre management over common sense.
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Old Dec 10, 2023, 12:36 pm
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106 isn't as bad as it could have been, Flybe used to have 118 on their 190s. Compared to elsewhere in Europe though, Air France, KLM and Finnair are all 100.

Edit, disregard the Flybe bit, forgot they had the 195.
Last edited by BJ787; Dec 10, 2023 at 2:47 pm
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Old Dec 10, 2023, 12:43 pm
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Originally Posted by camdentown
Er, how can that make economic sense?
If it’s true it s triumph of mediocre management over common sense.
Other European airlines install >100 seats in their E90s and institute the blocking of every other seat in Business so in practice the total passenger count is below 100
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Old Dec 10, 2023, 12:51 pm
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I thought there was an agreement between BA and BALPA that LCY aircraft had to have less than 100 seats ? If this is not the case surely BA would have reduced the seat pitch many years ago.
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Old Dec 10, 2023, 1:08 pm
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I’m surprised that it’s worth upping their cabin crewing costs by 30-40% to install 8 seats which probably won’t sell anyway.
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Old Dec 10, 2023, 1:11 pm
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Originally Posted by BJ787
106 isn't as bad as it could have been, Flybe used to have 118 on their 190s. Compared to elsewhere in Europe though, Air France, KLM and Finnair are all 100.
FlyBe had longer E195s. Max certification for the E190 is 108.
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Old Dec 10, 2023, 1:22 pm
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Originally Posted by Prospero
Other European airlines install >100 seats in their E90s and institute the blocking of every other seat in Business so in practice the total passenger count is below 100
That’s the Star Alliance norm (Swiss, Austrian, Lot…) afaik - vs. the OneWorld norm (BA, Finnair) which doesn’t allow the empty seat in business.
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Old Dec 10, 2023, 1:30 pm
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The higher number of seats could also be useful for the busier leisure focused routes.
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Old Dec 10, 2023, 1:35 pm
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Originally Posted by BJ787
106 isn't as bad as it could have been, Flybe used to have 118 on their 190s. Compared to elsewhere in Europe though, Air France, KLM and Finnair are all 100.
Flybe had the larger/longer ERJ-195.
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Old Dec 10, 2023, 1:55 pm
  #13  
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Originally Posted by EuropeanPete
That’s the Star Alliance norm (Swiss, Austrian, Lot…) afaik - vs. the OneWorld norm (BA, Finnair) which doesn’t allow the empty seat in business.
Sure, an optimist’s point of view is BA may follow the Lufty group, and retain two cabin crew. Setting aside the reduction in seat pitch, from 33” to 30.6”, the E90 is optimised for 27 rows as each row gets a window and no rows have the misfortune of a misaligned window - North American frequent flyers will appreciate this instantly
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Old Dec 10, 2023, 1:57 pm
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Originally Posted by Prospero
Sure, an optimist’s point of view is BA may follow the Lufty group, and retain two cabin crew. Setting aside the reduction in seat pitch, from 33” to 30.6”, the E90 is optimised for 27 rows as each row gets a window and no rows have the misfortune of a misaligned window - North American frequent flyers will appreciate this instantly
I’m not sure that works though? IIRC the CAA’s approach is that if the seat is physically there, you need the crew to cover it. EasyJet had to physically remove seats to get away with sending its 319s out with 3 crew.
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Old Dec 10, 2023, 2:06 pm
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Originally Posted by sigma421
I’m not sure that works though? IIRC the CAA’s approach is that if the seat is physically there, you need the crew to cover it. EasyJet had to physically remove seats to get away with sending its 319s out with 3 crew.
This is correct. If the seat is physically there, it counts towards the requirement for crew members. 106 seats = 3 crew.
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