Workie Ticket

In the last week or so LNER have announced that compulsory seat reservations are in place for all services.

ocprodigy

As have Avanti West Coast and all other major train operators. This is in response to the coronavirus pandemic to maintain social distancing on trains and is most definitely not usual practice. The "new normal" will be interesting to see, but similar to flights I can't imagine a high volume of seats being left empty when demand ramps back up again.

I imagine a lot of it will be down to connecting traffic to other oneworld flights, plus LBA's proximity to MAN (incl. easy transport links). As an airline I'd rather consolidate my passengers into one place if feasible - saves staffing costs as well. Similar to why BA don't serve LPL. Agreed on the sentiment though.

fripperies

True enough, if by transport you mean public transport. Regional airports without a rail link should have been outlawed by planning policy about, ooh I don’t know, about 75 years ago? Or remedied more recently by a less London-centric government.

It pained me when I moved across the Pennines that LBA was only reachable by a grim bus ride or environmentally wrong private car. But on the other hand - what a drive! Twenty-five minutes of largely traffic-free roads through the rural splendour of GOC. Instead of being unwanted extra hassle it’s one of the most enjoyable parts of air travel.

With London Airways pulling out there’s no painless alternative. I can’t stomach the M6-M60-MAN combo, Robin Hood and NCL are convoluted journeys, trains to KGX can be pleasant enough but it’s a hefty price add-on and KGX is not at LHR. As a leisure traveller I can respond to BA ramping up the pain by flying with them less. Pity those who don’t have that luxury.

crazyanglaisy

A real shame. I take this flight about 3 times a year, using Avios, as it's handy for visiting my parents. Much easier than taking the train into London and out again or traveling on from Manchester for me. I'll especially miss the views on landing. Best way to appreciate God's own country.

KARFA

Yes, the classic approach coming in from the south and over the city


Also sometimes it is a bit windy which adds to the fun

Kgmm77

Ah come on, you’re not comparing like with like! You might well only spend 35 mins in the air but considerably more than that on the aircraft taking into account boarding, taxiing etc.

ECR

There was absolutely no scaremongering whatsover in my post and I think it is very unfair to paint it in that light and to suggest it was unnecessary and unhelpful. All I was trying to do was outline why some people may prefer to travel by plane as opposed to train even for point to point traffic. I have travelled on this route point to point both by train and plane in the past and would happy to travel either by plane or train again (although obviously the plane option no longer exists).

All I have said is that in travelling by train you may find yourself having to stand, not that you will or indeed even that it is the most likely outcome - clearly it is not, particularly in these times when rail companies will need to be sensitive to overcrowding.

Booking a seat on a plane is a guarantee that if you are allowed to board you will get a seat as they will not allow standing on plane (I do recall at one point Ryanair suggested safe standing on planes). Of course if the plane is overbooked they will not allow everyone who has booked to board. Booking a seat on a train by no means guarantees that you will get to sit on that or any seat on the train. I have been on plenty of trains in the past where I have had a booked seat only to find the train crammed full and the seat already occupied, and of course the conductor understandably is not interested.

Booking First Class in itself is also no guarantee of a seat. I have in the past had seats booked in first class and the conductor has declassified the train to make it single class and made the seating unreserved because it was busy and they let all the passengers occupy the whole train. Yes I got a partial refund, but I would much rather have had a seat.

I have also been on trains before where I have been able to sit in my seat but they have allowed so many people on the train that they had difficulty closing the doors. On one ocassion people were standing in not only in the aisles, but also standing in between the legs of people who were seated. To have someone standing between my legs so I couldn't move for over an hour of a journey is one of the most deeply unpleasant travel experience I have ever had and not one I would like to repeat.

Of course as I have said in the current circumstances such experiences as those above are very unlikely to occur, and in any event for the vast majority of train journeys you get to sit in your correct seat and the journey is uneventful, even pleasant.

ECR

That is a good point. If you count the amount of time sat in your seat on the plane it is much longer than 35 minutes and closer to the length of time on the train. If there are any air traffic control delays due to whether you could be sat on the ground on the plane for hours while the train would have already arrived.

mikem004

If you are going on a long haul flight from LHR, a connecting flight from LBA gives you a protected connection.
A train from Leeds-Kings Cross, then public transport across to Heathrow does not.
You may end up having to book a hotel near LHR, just for peace of mind.

our_kid

It’s not really a grim bus ride - Leeds on the 757 is quick and easy and the Yorkshire Tiger bus is fast and frequent. You can also get to Otley and up to Wharfedale quickly too every hour.

Poor show by BA - was so easy for me this route as I didn’t want to hump across to Kings Cross or take awful Cross Country Trains from Reading.

POUGer

It was a great way to earn 40TP’s and 1250 avios with a cheap POUG @ £49 with a chicken salad and champagne thrown in, often for under £80. LNER will give me 80p back in nectar points for a ticket at the same price. I will certainly miss it.

LBA_flyer

We generally took the last LBA>LHR and stayed over at LHR anyway as it sometimes seemed like the LBA flights were often amongst the first cancelled due to weather IROPS (no data to back that comment up with) and regardless of protection, I want to get to where I'm going as soon as possible and that gave us the chance to do so.

S_W_S

It's a real shame to see this route dropped, though it has been less useful since they dropped the frequency from 3 daily to 1 daily (2 on some days).

Back in March I actually used NCL because the LBA timings didn't work, and I wanted to avoid MAN.

LBA is 45 minutes away by car for me. MAN, NCL and KGX are all approx 2 hours away by train (plus an hour on the tube from KGX, but equally I'd spend an hour in the air), sadly I'm not convinced domestic flights make any sense for me anymore.

kingstontoon

Please. I read your post and I read the post by Confus and yours was absolutely scaremongering and not comparing like-for-like at all. I have travelled all across the country by train on a regular basis for over 20 years and have never failed to have a seat when I've reserved one. I've also never failed to find a seat on the odd occasion I haven't reserved one, because off-peak there are always plenty, and at peak times there are nearly always some because of the way revenue management works on the railway (hint: I may work in this field). There are two trains per hour between London and Leeds all day, and three per hour between London and Manchester. More at peak times. Yes, it's possible you *may* find yourself having to stand in the event of service disruption or if you turn up seconds before departure at the height of the peak, but equally you *may* from time-to-time find yourself denied boarding from a flight. You must be terribly unlucky if you find yourself without somewhere to sit on a long distance train in the UK on a regular basis. This really isn't common, despite what the press may have us believe.

I love flying, I really do, but unless you happen to be making a journey from somewhere close to LBA to somewhere close to LHR, spending two hours in a comfortable train seat beats the hassle of a bus to the airport, security, check-in, boarding, a flight so short that you're straight up and back down again, then the Tube or train into town any day. Yes, the Azuma seats aren't quite as nice as the HSTs and MK4s they replaced but the ability to turn up 10 minutes or less before departure, sit in a nice window seat getting some work done while the world zooms by, maybe a coffee and a sandwich in hand, or a few beers / G&Ts on the way home, really isn't in the slightest bit unpleasant.

I accept the point in your original message about getting on the plane being part of the holiday experience, and that's absolutely right for those making connections. But for point-to-point, the train wins hands down on both comfort and journey time.

ECR

Scaremongering is incredibly strong language to use, and I apologise wholeheartedly if it has been interpreted by anyone in that way which it clearly has been, this was certainly not my intention, and it deeply upsets me to have been accused of this. One again I apologise.

I accept the vast majority of people will never understand why someone would take a domestic flight point to point and I was simply trying to put forward a case why someone might choose to do so. I regret trying to so, and I sincerely apologise if I have offended anyone in trying to do so, again this was not my intention.

I fully accept that train and plane are not like for like - they are not, all that they have in common are they are methods of transport, each of which have their own advantages and disadvantages. You will note that I have agreed with the post from Kgmm77 who pointed out I was not comparing like for like.

I have never said that I find myself without a seat on a train on a regular basis. On many occasions I have but it is not the norm. On the vast majority of train journeys I will of course have a seat and the journey will be pleasant, but on the occasions I don't it can be a deeply unpleasant experience.

You must have been incredibly lucky to have been travelling on trains regularly for 20 years and never on any occasion have found yourself without a seat, I wish I could say the same.