Conformance times at T5 on long haul
Dec 5, 2019, 2:53 am
#16
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One of the differences between flying and taking the Eurostar is that a 35 minute conformance means people's bags can be offloaded (or not loaded in the first place) without delaying the flight. Of course, people still make conformance and then fail to turn up at the gate, but I'm sure it helps.
It is of course possible that someone would have checked the bag on time, then "wandered" and missed conformance which would mean possibly needing to offload their bags if they miss boarding, but I think that the vast majority of people narrowly missing conformance must be HBO?
Dec 5, 2019, 2:58 am
#17
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I’ve heard quite a few stories of people who have missed their booked Eurostar being re-accommodated free of charge on the next service. It can’t be relied upon but my impression is that they are somewhat more flexible than any of the UK airlines anyway.
Dec 5, 2019, 3:10 am
#18
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Fair point - but the bag drop would still have needed to be made 60 minutes before the expected departure time. When people arrive at conformance 32 or 33 minutes before departure, the "fate" of their bag has already been sealed?
It is of course possible that someone would have checked the bag on time, then "wandered" and missed conformance which would mean possibly needing to offload their bags if they miss boarding, but I think that the vast majority of people narrowly missing conformance must be HBO?
It is of course possible that someone would have checked the bag on time, then "wandered" and missed conformance which would mean possibly needing to offload their bags if they miss boarding, but I think that the vast majority of people narrowly missing conformance must be HBO?
Dec 5, 2019, 3:23 am
#20
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I guess I prefer the idea of a hard cut-off as the risk lies with me to make that, but agree with the UT comment about an 'at your own risk' approach: if you arrive HBO at an empty FW at 10am for a EU flight departing A20 its a 'whats the rush' situation. Whereas a 747 departing from C will probably already be materially loaded... I guess we live in a 'lowest common denominator' world, but those of us who know T5 better than our own offices know its never that black and white.
Dec 5, 2019, 3:31 am
#22
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Last edited by fluffymitten; Dec 5, 2019 at 3:36 am
Dec 5, 2019, 5:11 am
#24
Join Date: May 2015
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I can recall one situation where I was on the final bus, they closed the gate at 18 minutes to departure, but for some reason the bus didn't leave immediately. Someone rushed to the gate a minute later, and I could see what was going on from the bus. From the body language of both passenger and agent, the passenger was kept offloaded even though it would have been possible to get them on the bus with only a few seconds of further delay. Now that doesn't happen often, it's the only time I've seen this so clearly, and usually agents try to be flexible. But 20 minutes certainly can be a real deadline.
"I was only a minute late, people were still queuing on the airbridge. I could have boarded without causing a delay"
However, if the GA has closed the flight for boarding in the DCS system then it is not a trivial action to re-open boarding and board another pax. The DCS system would have started calculating final load sheets, information would have been set to the crew and load controllers.
It might seem that GAs are not being flexible but in some cases the flexibility is not possible.
Dec 5, 2019, 8:24 am
#25
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The Eurostar situation is a bit more fluid since "conformance" for Business Premier passengers and Carte Blanche holders is 10 minutes. My personal record is 12 minutes on a busy Friday early evening. Staff weren't impressed but they rushed me through at eye-watering speed and I wasn't the last to board -- they held the train for a couple of minutes for people who'd gone through the normal channel at STP.
To come back on topic, there is indeed a difference between a flight at A20 and a C53 which you'd struggle to reach from the FW 35mns before take-off, let alone form the normal queue... But gates change, and we all know BA's renowned IT struggles on the best of days so really. Smallest common denominator sounds like a good benchmark.
To come back on topic, there is indeed a difference between a flight at A20 and a C53 which you'd struggle to reach from the FW 35mns before take-off, let alone form the normal queue... But gates change, and we all know BA's renowned IT struggles on the best of days so really. Smallest common denominator sounds like a good benchmark.
Dec 5, 2019, 8:57 am
#26
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different at T4
not relevant to BA, but since we've got onto Eurostar 'cutting it tight' examples, gives me a chance to add my own record - getting off the Hertz shuttle bus at T4 at T-13 minutes on a Sunday evening, with no status - HBO, I ran to security which was dozens deep, begged the lady at Fast Track to let me through (which she did, even being nice enough to tell me the gate) and made it to the gate (KQ for NBO) at T-7, where I was the last to board. I was a rather sweaty mess though....
Dec 5, 2019, 11:38 am
#27
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I remember once scanning my boarding pass at T5 fast track security at something like T-35:30 after an accident on the M25 had caused issues. I got to the (A) gate with plenty of time to spare, I think they hadn’t even started boarding by the time I got there. While I am sympathetic to the idea of conformance, I do think there are very clear differences between the family of four departing long-haul from a C gate with loads of checked luggage, and the single business traveller who clearly knows his/her way round the airport and is departing short-haul from an A gate without checked luggage. I like the EuroStar idea - as long as the passengers do not have any hold luggage, what do BA have to lose by letting them try their luck?
I have had some close shaves at other terminals/airports where conformance would have meant missing the flight; the most memorable are one at T2 (being dropped off at departures by an Uber at T-7; my pulse was slightly elevated when I got to the gate) and one in CPH (dropped off by the taxi at T-14 and having to get to a non-Schengen gate; memorable because the helpful SAS app told me “flight boarding” as I was getting into the taxi in central Copenhagen). I actually generally try to be at the airport an hour before; but I also think that occasionally missing a short-haul flight is, on the balance, more time efficient than always having an excessive buffer of several hours, so I fully accept the risk and responsibility here.
I have had some close shaves at other terminals/airports where conformance would have meant missing the flight; the most memorable are one at T2 (being dropped off at departures by an Uber at T-7; my pulse was slightly elevated when I got to the gate) and one in CPH (dropped off by the taxi at T-14 and having to get to a non-Schengen gate; memorable because the helpful SAS app told me “flight boarding” as I was getting into the taxi in central Copenhagen). I actually generally try to be at the airport an hour before; but I also think that occasionally missing a short-haul flight is, on the balance, more time efficient than always having an excessive buffer of several hours, so I fully accept the risk and responsibility here.
Dec 5, 2019, 12:14 pm
#28
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One key factor here is the use of bus gates, where there is pressure on the gate staff there to close up at 20 minutes and no later, and the wording on the FIDs (display screens) underlines the fact that the gate will close 20 minutes before departure.
I can recall one situation where I was on the final bus, they closed the gate at 18 minutes to departure, but for some reason the bus didn't leave immediately. Someone rushed to the gate a minute later, and I could see what was going on from the bus. From the body language of both passenger and agent, the passenger was kept offloaded even though it would have been possible to get them on the bus with only a few seconds of further delay. Now that doesn't happen often, it's the only time I've seen this so clearly, and usually agents try to be flexible. But 20 minutes certainly can be a real deadline.
I can recall one situation where I was on the final bus, they closed the gate at 18 minutes to departure, but for some reason the bus didn't leave immediately. Someone rushed to the gate a minute later, and I could see what was going on from the bus. From the body language of both passenger and agent, the passenger was kept offloaded even though it would have been possible to get them on the bus with only a few seconds of further delay. Now that doesn't happen often, it's the only time I've seen this so clearly, and usually agents try to be flexible. But 20 minutes certainly can be a real deadline.
Dec 5, 2019, 12:16 pm
#29
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This actually happened to me a few weeks ago. I got to the gate T-18, and was offloaded as the last bus had already left. I had no idea it was a bus gate and it was the first time I had experienced for myself the 20 min cut off. Had I known it was a bus gate, I would have got to the gate with plenty of time!
Dec 5, 2019, 7:08 pm
#30
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This actually happened to me a few weeks ago. I got to the gate T-18, and was offloaded as the last bus had already left. I had no idea it was a bus gate and it was the first time I had experienced for myself the 20 min cut off. Had I known it was a bus gate, I would have got to the gate with plenty of time!