Calling it a day with BA
Nov 9, 2019, 7:48 am
#106
Join Date: Nov 2012
Location: Cambridgeshire
Programs: Varies
Posts: 1,298
- inedible food in Club Europe
Often it's quite good. Better than most short-haul EU carriers now. I've tried Lufthansa, AirFrance, KLM, SAS, Finnair and more in recent times.
- total lack of business class seats in Club Europe; why even pay for this service if you can’t eat the food and it’s the same seat as economy? Putting a blocked off seat next to me does not give me any extra room
It does. You don't have someone's elbows in your vicinity. No other short-haul EU carrier offers more legroom or different seats. If they do then it's to the same degree: some 777 or A350 aircraft in unusual operations.
- premium economy is now just economy service; on my flight yesterday from SFO there was no welcome drink, no hot towel, no menus, no curtain closed; it was ‘chicken or beef’ and don’t dare ask what the meal actually is
WTP can be ok, but as more companies ditch true business travel for premium for cost reasons, it's being squeezed every which way as a way to make money (on both sides). So I agree. However, BA's isn't any worse than any other - assuming you're on a newer aircraft.
- BA app consistently doesn’t work; I go in circles logging in to get anything done
It's better than many. ANA, for example, is poor.
- in-app upgrades have not worked for me for months & I have reported this to BA several times; stop offering me upgrades if your IT system can’t support the purchase actually happening
Just phone them. I get a 40-to-60 success rate with upgrades, so not ideal, as there are clear IT issues where non-existent upgrades are offered.
- nearly every time I’ve flown in business class, the cabin crew act like they are doing me a favour by serving me (I’m a younger woman so shouldn’t be in J, right??)
Sadly there's not good consistency on BA's services. On one hand I've had the best service ever from BA over any airline. But, on the other, also the worst. The lack of consistency is a bother for me, too, which comes down to management to train and, realistically, reward their hard-working staff better.
- cleaning service in between long-haul flights is now like short-haul - you have wipe your seat off and disinfect everything
Same on any airline tbh. I've seen sick up the wall on CX. Wet (probably soiled) seats elsewhere. Not saying it's ok, but in an A vs B argument you'll find the same anywhere.
I've been expanding horizons this year, looking at other airlines, have earned status on Flying Blue, Virgin Atlantic, and Star Alliance. And, really, I'm still keener to fly with BA each time. Well, often, not always.
Often it's quite good. Better than most short-haul EU carriers now. I've tried Lufthansa, AirFrance, KLM, SAS, Finnair and more in recent times.
- total lack of business class seats in Club Europe; why even pay for this service if you can’t eat the food and it’s the same seat as economy? Putting a blocked off seat next to me does not give me any extra room
It does. You don't have someone's elbows in your vicinity. No other short-haul EU carrier offers more legroom or different seats. If they do then it's to the same degree: some 777 or A350 aircraft in unusual operations.
- premium economy is now just economy service; on my flight yesterday from SFO there was no welcome drink, no hot towel, no menus, no curtain closed; it was ‘chicken or beef’ and don’t dare ask what the meal actually is
WTP can be ok, but as more companies ditch true business travel for premium for cost reasons, it's being squeezed every which way as a way to make money (on both sides). So I agree. However, BA's isn't any worse than any other - assuming you're on a newer aircraft.
- BA app consistently doesn’t work; I go in circles logging in to get anything done
It's better than many. ANA, for example, is poor.
- in-app upgrades have not worked for me for months & I have reported this to BA several times; stop offering me upgrades if your IT system can’t support the purchase actually happening
Just phone them. I get a 40-to-60 success rate with upgrades, so not ideal, as there are clear IT issues where non-existent upgrades are offered.
- nearly every time I’ve flown in business class, the cabin crew act like they are doing me a favour by serving me (I’m a younger woman so shouldn’t be in J, right??)
Sadly there's not good consistency on BA's services. On one hand I've had the best service ever from BA over any airline. But, on the other, also the worst. The lack of consistency is a bother for me, too, which comes down to management to train and, realistically, reward their hard-working staff better.
- cleaning service in between long-haul flights is now like short-haul - you have wipe your seat off and disinfect everything
Same on any airline tbh. I've seen sick up the wall on CX. Wet (probably soiled) seats elsewhere. Not saying it's ok, but in an A vs B argument you'll find the same anywhere.
I've been expanding horizons this year, looking at other airlines, have earned status on Flying Blue, Virgin Atlantic, and Star Alliance. And, really, I'm still keener to fly with BA each time. Well, often, not always.
Wow. Way to go, demonstrating your total lack of empathy. I felt ashamed to read this.
Nov 9, 2019, 8:03 am
#107
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Brighton England
Programs: AA Plat, various hotels
Posts: 1,220
Having discussed this thread with my partner, she asserts that she gets worse service from women than men. On a recent flight in club, she received excellent service from the male attendant and a well done was sent.
Nov 9, 2019, 9:15 am
#108
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: NCL
Programs: UA 1MM/*G. DL Gold for one more year.
Posts: 5,305
Why would you want to have status both with Flying Blue and Virgin, when you can earn miles and enjoy benefits on both with Delta?
Nov 9, 2019, 9:18 am
#109
Join Date: Oct 2017
Programs: BAEC Silver, Flying Blue Platinum; Hilton Gold, IHG Diamond, Marriott Titanium, Wyndham Diamond
Posts: 788
Flying Poo status is much easier to earn than Delta, although if the OP is flying that much that wouldn't really be a consideration.
Nov 9, 2019, 1:50 pm
#110
Join Date: Jan 2019
Posts: 92
Why some people get better service than others has long fascinated me. I don't think it has to do with gender - age is the key factor. There are other, often intangible, determinants, such as your perceived gravitas, etc. I regularly observe that older passengers get far more attention than younger ones. Crews are also more likely to accommodate their complaints. These bias are not limited to aviation, although the premium check-in area is one space where this is more obvious. But then again, difficult to judge in the context of BA crews, who are extremely inconsistent and of a low calibre in general.
Nov 9, 2019, 2:10 pm
#112
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: AUS
Programs: BAEC Gold, AA PPro, Hyatt Globalist, Amex Plat
Posts: 7,043
Unfortunately, having that be your view, doesn't actually make is so in the real world 
Agree that is it's often much higher priced than economy, but conversely, minus sale fares, special offers, etc, it's usually (though not always) much cheaper than business. Thus by definition, it's not "somewhere in the middle." For example, we recently flew in business on CX from LAX to DPS. Business class tickets were close to $4k (USD) and Premium Economy tickets on the same flight were around $1.2K (USD). That PE price was of course much, much closer to the price of straight up economy than to business. Again, by definition it wasn't "somewhere in the middle." Had I flown in PE I would have expected the experience to be much closer to economy than to business.
Basically, my operating assumption for PE is better seat, more legroom. Setting expectations much higher than that is a recipe for disappointment IMHO. Choosing to name this class of service "Premium" probably just sets it up to disappoint some, but I'm guessing that naming it "Slightly Better Seat Economy" wouldn't exactly get the Marketing team a promotion/bonus!
Agreed. I've been happy w/AA PE, but again, I tend to set my expectations low. Spend some time on the AA forum and you'll find folks complaining about PE not being good enough there too.
Regards
Basically, my operating assumption for PE is better seat, more legroom. Setting expectations much higher than that is a recipe for disappointment IMHO. Choosing to name this class of service "Premium" probably just sets it up to disappoint some, but I'm guessing that naming it "Slightly Better Seat Economy" wouldn't exactly get the Marketing team a promotion/bonus!
I think American's product is rather ideal: comfy, leather seats, a substantial pillow and good, consistent service throughout. Same with Virgin. Their touch of adding hot chocolate with brandy in a real, full-size mug is cute, relaxing and the kind of extra touch that hits that in between spot (for me).
Regards
Last edited by scubadu; Nov 9, 2019 at 3:23 pm Reason: grammar
Nov 9, 2019, 3:36 pm
#113
Join Date: Apr 2015
Location: US/UK - and elsewhere
Programs: BA Gold
Posts: 2,563
Having done AA PE and BA WTP a few times I would say the products are at about the same level - but for different (really silly) reasons. For instance, I find the BA WTP seat more comfortable than the 'slab' seats of the AA PE, but the AA pillow is far superior (!). Cabin crew on BA I (usually) find to be more professional - the AA crew seem to have just walked in off the street... . Food - AA provides more, but of course, more is not necessarily better.
Meanwhile, next trip I'll have to suffer BA CW, not least since it was cheaper than WT (or maybe that is what it is worth nowadays!).
Meanwhile, next trip I'll have to suffer BA CW, not least since it was cheaper than WT (or maybe that is what it is worth nowadays!).
Nov 9, 2019, 4:03 pm
#114
Join Date: May 2016
Programs: BA Gold
Posts: 50
Why some people get better service than others has long fascinated me. I don't think it has to do with gender - age is the key factor. There are other, often intangible, determinants, such as your perceived gravitas, etc. I regularly observe that older passengers get far more attention than younger ones. Crews are also more likely to accommodate their complaints. These bias are not limited to aviation, although the premium check-in area is one space where this is more obvious. But then again, difficult to judge in the context of BA crews, who are extremely inconsistent and of a low calibre in general.
My own experience is working with hotel chains rather than airlines, but the logic behind it may remain. But customers of whatever age, gender, wealth tend to nearly always get better service if they have a nature which is positive, smiling and warm. There are always other factors at play, but a relaxed attitude from a customer who is determined to be positive really is evident to hotel staff, and I see no reason why that wouldn't stretch to cabin crew as well. The key factor IMO is the customer's personality and demeanour, not denying what others have witnessed, but I've never seen age as much of a factor from my travels.
Nov 9, 2019, 4:19 pm
#115
Join Date: Oct 2015
Location: NT Australia
Programs: QF WP
Posts: 4,160
I think I must have been unfortunate and have had my forty or so BA flights this year with what seemed like high calibre crew. It's a little difficult to tell in ET as the crew don't get much chance to engage, but I've rarely experienced anything other than a competent and pro-active crew in the WT cabin and on short and long haul business class trips.
My own experience is working with hotel chains rather than airlines, but the logic behind it may remain. But customers of whatever age, gender, wealth tend to nearly always get better service if they have a nature which is positive, smiling and warm. There are always other factors at play, but a relaxed attitude from a customer who is determined to be positive really is evident to hotel staff, and I see no reason why that wouldn't stretch to cabin crew as well. The key factor IMO is the customer's personality and demeanour, not denying what others have witnessed, but I've never seen age as much of a factor from my travels.
My own experience is working with hotel chains rather than airlines, but the logic behind it may remain. But customers of whatever age, gender, wealth tend to nearly always get better service if they have a nature which is positive, smiling and warm. There are always other factors at play, but a relaxed attitude from a customer who is determined to be positive really is evident to hotel staff, and I see no reason why that wouldn't stretch to cabin crew as well. The key factor IMO is the customer's personality and demeanour, not denying what others have witnessed, but I've never seen age as much of a factor from my travels.
i have found the service I receive has improved since I have started proactively offering up a second choice, maybe they recognise I get asked to take an alternative a lot!!
Nov 9, 2019, 4:41 pm
#116
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: UK
Programs: BA Gold / Hilton Diamond / IHG Diamond Ambassador / Marriot Bonvoy Gold
Posts: 2,536
I guess I have come here (one last time) to lament. After three months of solid travel with BA and becoming a newly minted Silver, I’m done. 
Here’s why:
- the new ‘wait on the jet bridge for 20-30 mins’ policy (happened LHR to LAX last week); everyone was getting confused, frustrated and some even angry. Boarding had to halted because the entire jet bridge was full and over spilling (A380)
- inedible food in Club Europe
- total lack of business class seats in Club Europe; why even pay for this service if you can’t eat the food and it’s the same seat as economy? Putting a blocked off seat next to me does not give me any extra room
- premium economy is now just economy service; on my flight yesterday from SFO there was no welcome drink, no hot towel, no menus, no curtain closed; it was ‘chicken or beef’ and don’t dare ask what the meal actually is
- BA app consistently doesn’t work; I go in circles logging in to get anything done
- in-app upgrades have not worked for me for months & I have reported this to BA several times; stop offering me upgrades if your IT system can’t support the purchase actually happening
- BA website breaks constantly; every avios or upgrade with avios search ends in ‘Error’
- nearly every time I’ve flown in business class, the cabin crew act like they are doing me a favour by serving me (I’m a younger woman so shouldn’t be in J, right??)
- mold (or mould depending on where you are from) in the bathrooms on those A380’s; yuck
- cleaning service in between long-haul flights is now like short-haul - you have wipe your seat off and disinfect everything
I’d rather fly American these days. There, I said it.
Here’s why:- the new ‘wait on the jet bridge for 20-30 mins’ policy (happened LHR to LAX last week); everyone was getting confused, frustrated and some even angry. Boarding had to halted because the entire jet bridge was full and over spilling (A380)
- inedible food in Club Europe
- total lack of business class seats in Club Europe; why even pay for this service if you can’t eat the food and it’s the same seat as economy? Putting a blocked off seat next to me does not give me any extra room
- premium economy is now just economy service; on my flight yesterday from SFO there was no welcome drink, no hot towel, no menus, no curtain closed; it was ‘chicken or beef’ and don’t dare ask what the meal actually is
- BA app consistently doesn’t work; I go in circles logging in to get anything done
- in-app upgrades have not worked for me for months & I have reported this to BA several times; stop offering me upgrades if your IT system can’t support the purchase actually happening
- BA website breaks constantly; every avios or upgrade with avios search ends in ‘Error’
- nearly every time I’ve flown in business class, the cabin crew act like they are doing me a favour by serving me (I’m a younger woman so shouldn’t be in J, right??)
- mold (or mould depending on where you are from) in the bathrooms on those A380’s; yuck
- cleaning service in between long-haul flights is now like short-haul - you have wipe your seat off and disinfect everything
I’d rather fly American these days. There, I said it.
AA have been superb on the 777-300 for at least 5 years.
As a premium leisure passenger BA simply don’t cut it anymore. They are expensive and provide poor service, dire food, incompetent poorly paid staff, filthy planes and lounges and they are, in my experience in recent years, absolutely 3rd rate.
you will not regret moving away on long haul. Shorthaul is more challenging given their dominance at LHR
Nov 9, 2019, 4:42 pm
#117
Join Date: May 2016
Programs: BA Gold
Posts: 50
I personally think the exact opposite is true, having been on both sides of the curtain. The relaxed and positive passengers are far less likely to complain and more willing to accomodate, for example, being told their meal choice is not available. There are fairly limited options for service recovery in flight as it’s not like you can stop off somewhere and pick up some more champagne etc
Nov 9, 2019, 4:59 pm
#118
Join Date: Oct 2015
Location: NT Australia
Programs: QF WP
Posts: 4,160
I don't know about on board data, but customers who are relaxed and content in hotels frequently do complain and they're potentially far easier to ameliorate because it tends to be a calm interaction. I was talking to a member of security staff at Gatwick Airport last week because I didn't know customers weren't allowed through more than six hours before their flight and I was about nine hours early (long story). She waved me through and I asked what the policy was, and apparently it's "it depends on how you speak to me". There's a lot of truth to that IMO across customer service engagements of all kinds.
Nov 9, 2019, 8:05 pm
#119
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Aug 2000
Location: London
Programs: Hilton, IHG - BA, GA, LH, QR, SV, TK
Posts: 17,008
sadly that's a view not shared by airlines. They're anxious not to cannibalise business-class, while enthusiastically up-selling from economy .
It's called premium economy rarher than business lite for a reason.
That being said, BA could do it do it better while sill maintaining a very clear distinction between the PE cabin and the space through the curtain in business-class. They seem to have agonised over the silliest nonsense, glasses or plastic cups, nuts or no nuts with your drink: the seating is a clear winner, but the rest is lacklustre.