Your lifejacket is underneath your seat (or is it?)
Apr 28, 2019, 3:21 pm
#1
Original Poster
Join Date: Oct 2017
Location: London
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Posts: 753
Your lifejacket is underneath your seat (or is it?)
This is a moderately useless thread as I sometimes start, just before anyone complains. The only reason I'm posting this is to entertain my curiosity.
I sometimes reach down to check if I have a lifejacket underneath my seat, and to my surprise I didn't have one on my flight last week! Flight attendants were a bit surprised and had to do a double take (or maybe it was my accent). I quote: "This certainly is a first"
Out of curiosity, do you check if you have a lifejacket? Was it ever missing?
I sometimes reach down to check if I have a lifejacket underneath my seat, and to my surprise I didn't have one on my flight last week! Flight attendants were a bit surprised and had to do a double take (or maybe it was my accent). I quote: "This certainly is a first"
Out of curiosity, do you check if you have a lifejacket? Was it ever missing?
Apr 28, 2019, 3:28 pm
#2
Join Date: Jun 2014
Location: Leeds, UK
Programs: Mucci, BAEC GGL/CCR, Hilton Diamond, IHG Diamond Ambassador, Stena Gold
Posts: 1,094
This is a moderately useless thread as I sometimes start, just before anyone complains. The only reason I'm posting this is to entertain my curiosity.
I sometimes reach down to check if I have a lifejacket underneath my seat, and to my surprise I didn't have one on my flight last week! Flight attendants were a bit surprised and had to do a double take (or maybe it was my accent). I quote: "This certainly is a first"
Out of curiosity, do you check if you have a lifejacket? Was it ever missing?
I sometimes reach down to check if I have a lifejacket underneath my seat, and to my surprise I didn't have one on my flight last week! Flight attendants were a bit surprised and had to do a double take (or maybe it was my accent). I quote: "This certainly is a first"
Out of curiosity, do you check if you have a lifejacket? Was it ever missing?
Apr 28, 2019, 3:32 pm
#3
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I always check and I'm on about 3 missing so far total, which is going to be sub 1% of all my flights. It has come up before, a few years ago there was the habit of people stealing them on services to yachting locations such as NCE and AGP, plus some Italian school groups seemed to think it was funny to take them. I've seen one lad getting pounced on in Arrivals.
Previously on FT:
"Your life jacket is either beside or underneath your seat" - or is it?
Lifejackets...or lack thereof...
life vests
Previously on FT:
"Your life jacket is either beside or underneath your seat" - or is it?
Lifejackets...or lack thereof...
life vests
Apr 28, 2019, 3:39 pm
#5
Join Date: Aug 2013
Posts: 8,771
Really??
Personally I couldn't give two hoots whether there's one there or not. The chance of me ever being in a position to use one is so minuscule it really isn't worth concerning myself with.
Have there been any ditchings in recent history where lifejackets came in useful? The Hudson flight is the only one I know of and even there I don't think lifejackets saved anyone.
Personally I couldn't give two hoots whether there's one there or not. The chance of me ever being in a position to use one is so minuscule it really isn't worth concerning myself with.
Have there been any ditchings in recent history where lifejackets came in useful? The Hudson flight is the only one I know of and even there I don't think lifejackets saved anyone.
Apr 28, 2019, 3:40 pm
#6
Join Date: May 2012
Location: Ipswich
Posts: 7,543
I always check but never found one missing. I gather it happens more on LCC where apparently some pax think nicking them is a jolly jape.
Given the fast turnaround of their flights, a missing one probably wouldn't get noticed until the next day.
Given the fast turnaround of their flights, a missing one probably wouldn't get noticed until the next day.
Apr 28, 2019, 3:50 pm
#7
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The one off the Kenyan coast and the CHC Helicopters Eurocopter crash off Sumburgh comes to mind too. In fact on helicopter services there have been a number of survivors thanks to life vests, and perhaps the frequent use of survival clothing on the more safety conscious operators. I'm hoping I don't have to do another helicopter ride out of Sumburgh or anywhere else, it really is an awful experience. I take the view that one of the things that led to unnecessary deaths in the Manchester Airtours disaster were basic fairly silly process failure or forgetfulness, people died unnecessarily because they did not pay attention. If something happened to me that a quick check could have prevented, then I doubt my family would ever forgive me.
Apr 28, 2019, 3:54 pm
#8
Join Date: Aug 2013
Posts: 8,771
The one off the Kenyan coast and the CHC Helicopters Eurocopter crash off Sumburgh comes to mind too. In fact on helicopter services there have been a number of survivors thanks to life vests, and perhaps the frequent use of survival clothing on the more safety conscious operators. I'm hoping I don't have to do another helicopter ride out of Sumburgh or anywhere else, it really is an awful experience. I take the view that one of the things that led to unnecessary deaths in the Manchester Airtours disaster were basic fairly silly process failure or forgetfulness, people died unnecessarily because they did not pay attention. If something happened to me that a quick check could have prevented, then I doubt my family would ever forgive me.
Apr 28, 2019, 3:59 pm
#9
Join Date: Jun 2014
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Really??
Personally I couldn't give two hoots whether there's one there or not. The chance of me ever being in a position to use one is so minuscule it really isn't worth concerning myself with.
Have there been any ditchings in recent history where lifejackets came in useful? The Hudson flight is the only one I know of and even there I don't think lifejackets saved anyone.
Personally I couldn't give two hoots whether there's one there or not. The chance of me ever being in a position to use one is so minuscule it really isn't worth concerning myself with.
Have there been any ditchings in recent history where lifejackets came in useful? The Hudson flight is the only one I know of and even there I don't think lifejackets saved anyone.
I work in Risk Management- it is ingrained in my psyche to check that things are where they are supposed to be........
;D
Apr 28, 2019, 4:04 pm
#10
Join Date: Aug 2013
Posts: 8,771
I should add that I am by nature quite a risk-averse person.
Apr 28, 2019, 4:08 pm
#11
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: London
Programs: BA BLUE BADGE
Posts: 1,323
Really??
Personally I couldn't give two hoots whether there's one there or not. The chance of me ever being in a position to use one is so minuscule it really isn't worth concerning myself with.
Have there been any ditchings in recent history where lifejackets came in useful? The Hudson flight is the only one I know of and even there I don't think lifejackets saved anyone.
Personally I couldn't give two hoots whether there's one there or not. The chance of me ever being in a position to use one is so minuscule it really isn't worth concerning myself with.
Have there been any ditchings in recent history where lifejackets came in useful? The Hudson flight is the only one I know of and even there I don't think lifejackets saved anyone.
Spot on.
I'd rather a parachute under the seat.
Apr 28, 2019, 4:36 pm
#14
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Australia
Posts: 6,338
I realise you are probably joking.. but... for those who DO think this is a good idea (and they are out there)..
Challenges.
1. Getting OUT of the aircraft.
a. How would you open a door?
b. If you COULD get a door open, how would you safely EXIT from a side door into such a fast airflow (without - to use the Military phrase - "counting rivets" down the side of the aircraft) Lets not even think about unusual aircraft attitudes...
Yes, military parachutists exit from the side door of large aircraft, even some jets... but these are aircraft flying unpressurised , at minimum speed, and straight and level. And did I mention the wind deflector that is powered out in front of the exit door? No? It sorta helps...
But OK... lets assume you find a way to safely get out.
2. Have you got the harness on, properly and snugly secure? Any idea how to do that? Any idea how to activate the parachute itself?
a. You found the ripcord/opening device? Great! What altitude are you at? Going to get that canopy open as soon as possible I bet? Really bad idea above, say, 20,000 ft..... without supplemental O2....
b. How are you going to LAND it? What do you WEIGH? (Over 100kg? Good luck!) The heavier you are the worse off... Have you practiced your PLF's? (Parachute Landing Falls)? Do you understand the absolute necessity of landing INTO the wind?
One last consideration. WEIGHT. Parachutes, even Slimpack pilots emergency types, weigh more than a few kilos.... Multiply that by the number onboard.... Just sayin...
Probably best that there is no way to actually jump!!! (Its an interesting exercise to think about it though.....^)
EDIT! (Cos Im having fun thinking this through)
OK.. I think there is ONE scenario where pax parachutes could work. Its dependent on a few conditions being met...
1. The aircraft is low enough to depressurise without problems for the pax. (And so doors can theoretically be opened)
2. The aircraft is over LAND.
3. The pax all have time to work out and correctly put on the parachute rigs.
4. The aircraft is able to fly slowly enough (under 100 knots preferably) and straight and level for LONG enough to allow all to exit.*
5. The pax all manage to safely exit, activate the parachutes, avoid entanglement with each other, and land reasonably intact.
* The second last jump of my basic para course was a "simultaneous double door" exit from a C-130..32 out each side...in.... theoretically 32 seconds (we actually did it a little quicker) That perhaps gives some indication how long it would take to clear out . say, a 777.
The question that springs to mind of course is..if all those conditions were able to be met..is there actually ANYTHING wrong with the aircraft????
Challenges.
1. Getting OUT of the aircraft.
a. How would you open a door?
b. If you COULD get a door open, how would you safely EXIT from a side door into such a fast airflow (without - to use the Military phrase - "counting rivets" down the side of the aircraft) Lets not even think about unusual aircraft attitudes...
Yes, military parachutists exit from the side door of large aircraft, even some jets... but these are aircraft flying unpressurised , at minimum speed, and straight and level. And did I mention the wind deflector that is powered out in front of the exit door? No? It sorta helps...
But OK... lets assume you find a way to safely get out.
2. Have you got the harness on, properly and snugly secure? Any idea how to do that? Any idea how to activate the parachute itself?
a. You found the ripcord/opening device? Great! What altitude are you at? Going to get that canopy open as soon as possible I bet? Really bad idea above, say, 20,000 ft..... without supplemental O2....
b. How are you going to LAND it? What do you WEIGH? (Over 100kg? Good luck!) The heavier you are the worse off... Have you practiced your PLF's? (Parachute Landing Falls)? Do you understand the absolute necessity of landing INTO the wind?
One last consideration. WEIGHT. Parachutes, even Slimpack pilots emergency types, weigh more than a few kilos.... Multiply that by the number onboard.... Just sayin...
Probably best that there is no way to actually jump!!! (Its an interesting exercise to think about it though.....^)
EDIT! (Cos Im having fun thinking this through)
OK.. I think there is ONE scenario where pax parachutes could work. Its dependent on a few conditions being met...
1. The aircraft is low enough to depressurise without problems for the pax. (And so doors can theoretically be opened)
2. The aircraft is over LAND.
3. The pax all have time to work out and correctly put on the parachute rigs.
4. The aircraft is able to fly slowly enough (under 100 knots preferably) and straight and level for LONG enough to allow all to exit.*
5. The pax all manage to safely exit, activate the parachutes, avoid entanglement with each other, and land reasonably intact.
* The second last jump of my basic para course was a "simultaneous double door" exit from a C-130..32 out each side...in.... theoretically 32 seconds (we actually did it a little quicker) That perhaps gives some indication how long it would take to clear out . say, a 777.
The question that springs to mind of course is..if all those conditions were able to be met..is there actually ANYTHING wrong with the aircraft????
Last edited by trooper; Apr 28, 2019 at 5:10 pm