corporate-wage-slave

It's a phrase from Aquinas, meaning a level of superstitious detail unworthy of analysis: "How many angels can dance on a pinhead". It became popular more recently because GB Shaw used the phrase in Saint Joan.

Lucanesque

Every day is a learning day - thanks c-w-s

Jimmie76

My main problem with the Zodiac/Super Diamond seats is the foot coffin. That and the fact that out of London going to BOS there is only a choice of three airlines; VS, DL or BA.
On VS the flight arrives too late for connecting to ACK and so would require a night in BOS.
On DL the flight time is a little early for me but not too bad the hard product though is a killer with a large foot coffin.
On BA there is an outbound flight that works timewise, no foot coffin and two overnight options for the return leg (used to be three before the A380).

eefor jfp

I fly transatlantic three or four times a year. After Lufthansa gutted their economy earnings, I tried BA. Liked the program and the ability to upgrade from WTP to biz for 10,000 or 12,500 Avios one way. Fast forward a few years and UUA s pretty much dead (I have very specific dates and cities I need that never seem to be available) so I went from WTP to paid discounted J and switched to AA and IB for westbound and a mix for eastbound.

That was my norm for several years. But with all the issues BA has been having lately, I began to look around. In the end, I ended up trying SkyTeam this month since they had a competitive fare. I must say that Alitalia had some very positive things (very nice lounges in Rome, good seats, awesome crew, fantastic baggage handling) and some just OK things (food and wine). It certainly wasn't perfect but there were more positives than negatives. My return flight on Delta is today, so I will report back tomorrow.

All that to say, BA is no longer my only go-to airline by any means but my next trip in June is going back to oneworld with a mix of AY, AA and BA. Bottom line is that I won't pay much of a premium to fly any airline but there are still lots of factors that go into a choice of any single ticket (FF benefits, lounges, seats, convenience, connections, etc.) Meaning I'm not totally transactional these days but loyalty to an airline / FF program is certainly no longer my number one factor.

capin

The cat is out of the bag, Cruz has 'fessed up -

"2016 was a year of change across BA. It has also been a year to acknowledge a new reality, created by two opposite forces. On one side, a significant increase in economy short and long-haul low cost seats with old (easyJet) and new (Norwegian) competitors forcing us to think about our long-term strategy towards price-sensitive consumers. On the other side, we’re also competing with both the traditional Gulf and Asian carriers as well as the reincarnated US carriers, forcing us to think about our competitive response; our product, particularly onboard, has fallen behind."

T8191

Thanks, capin, for that Cruz extract. The decline, or lack of improvement, in CW was certainly a major factor in our move to AA. OK, we can cope with CW using a 2-4-1 to somewhere 'nice' once a year, but the rest if the time we really can't be bothered with the BA CW experience.

Add to that the UuA issue, as eefor jfp highlighted above. I would rather pay cash, ex-DUB, with AA ... and accrue more TPs in the process

capin

Over the past couple of years, I have flown J on EK, EY, AY, QF, AA, RJ, QR and BA and in Y on TG, AA, BA Delta and KLM.

I'd rank the carriers I've flown on in J in this order -

1.QR
2.EY
3.EK
4.QF
5.AA
6.AY
7.RJ
8.BA

QR, EY and EK are just fantastic.

QF really surprised me. I flew them in combination with EK. QF (LHR-DXB) and EK (DXB-BKK). The 380 was a little outdated but the food, drink and service was great. One of the crew showed me how to use the little "cinema" at the front of the upper deck, I really enjoyed it up there.

AA have a really good offering in J TATL but I find their crews to be a bit inconsistent and sometimes a little rude.

AY, I flew BKK-HEL on the A350. Another good airline, great lightening fast IFE.

RJ were OK. I flew in row 1 of their 787. LHR-AMM-BKK return. The service was nice, food was OK. Price was an amazing 996GBP.

BA. Outdated cabin, poor food, iffy IFE, pay to book a CW seat, poor cleaning yet really expensive. Poor lounges at LHR compared to EK, EY, DL, QF, CX, JL and QR hubs and indeed outstations.

and the carriers I've flown on in Y in this order -

1. TG
2. DL
3. AA
4. BA
5. KLM


TG were a revelation on the A380 LHR-BKK, Nice crew, nice food, good drinks, free reservation for an exit row seat for a non status passenger (me!).

AA treat me really good with my BA gold, they block the seat next to me and upgrade me to MCE more often than not.

DL, The crew noticed I was tall and moved me to an exit row. The lounge in Atlanta is really nice.

KLM, 3-4-3 777 ATL-LHR-ATL, unbelievably cramped. A horrible experience.

HIDDY

A link would be appreciated.

Especially after the earlier false information posted on here about what Willie Walsh said.

orbitmic

It was posted in that same thread on the IAG 2016 figures to which you contributed! That was AC's message to employees.

http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/27952218-post30.html

T8191

Perhaps they have a different approach to British OWE Seniors in F/J? Or perhaps we're just comfortable with the 'American way' and don't get seized up over it.

Sadly, I can't persuade the OH to go East, so most of the other carriers you mention aren't, sadly, an option. And we NEVER fly Y, except on a short UK connection!

NickB

According to reports on the AA forum, the issue does affect 789s too, albeit to a lesser degree. While it is a problem, it can be avoided by judicious selection of seats as some seats are not paired to other seats and therefore unaffected.

capin

I avoid Y if at all possible but sometimes, need must.

Something I've noticed about AA is that they have great crews operating out of Charlotte, Always excellent customer service. Not sure if this is because they are ex-US airways crews or just southern hospitality in general.

Flights to SE Asia over Christmas were pricey in Y and J. I picked up a TG flight for 570GBP and was dreading it. However, free exit row seat selection, nice food, great IFE, nice drinks and great service. I was really impressed.

You're missing out going east, the value is incredible on the middle east and Asian airlines.

Ber2dca

American flight attendants tend to have a very peculiar "local government" type attitude. It's not always plain 'how dare you to expect me to do anything' rudeness but even at best it's generally kind of a polite matter-of-factness rather than genuine hospitality. There's this "I'm here as a safety procedure warden, not service staff." attitude that U.S. airlines seem to emphasize a lot more than even the European majors.

PUCCI GALORE

There is one thing that we're all overlooking. AA went into bankruptcy. It invoked this Chapter 11 (?) which meant that it could do a huge sort-out, not pay its creditors, and keep flying. BA never has had to do this and couldn't even if it wanted to. I think that it's a vast benefit that has been used by every single US carrier flying the Atlantic today.

Don't get me wrong. I'm not disagreeing but AA today is more US Airways than it used to be. Domestically the food in F or whatever it is, is pretty dreadful. It is as much F or J as charter nosh and I've seen better charter meals. The bar is hopelessly bereft of anything much. TATL is a different story. There I have no argument. I have just travelled DFW-HNL. The choice was Cheese Lasagna, or Shrimp Curry. They were OK but F it isn't, and frankly J is what they were serving in Y before the merger. Down the back in Y they don't get a proper meal at all on a trip of 3900 miles. Even BA has not sunk quite that low.

I'm just mentioning this as we are none of us are satisfied with BA these days, but AA was worse not that long ago. It comes and then it goes. BA need to invest again and look after its staff - then maybe things will improve. They jolly well need to!

T8191

As we often stage through CLT, that may be a factor. I've been kissed on the cheek, and had my hand shaken, by FAs

"Matter of fact" is fine by me, as long as the F&B keeps coming! But then, as I noted earlier, we have never encountered that issue [45k miles on AA since we started with them in 2015].