FlyerTalk Forums

FlyerTalk Forums (https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/index.php)
-   British Airways | Executive Club (https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/british-airways-executive-club-446/)
-   -   The 2016 BA compensation thread: Your guide to Regulation 261/2004 (https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/british-airways-executive-club/1735482-2016-ba-compensation-thread-your-guide-regulation-261-2004-a.html)

lorcancoyle Jul 1, 2016 1:38 am


Originally Posted by monkeytennis (Post 26855422)
Hello eu261 experts.

I was routing CPH-LON-JFK return and unfortunately was downgraded on the CPH-LHR leg (along with 13 others!!)

It's a bit unclear as to how much compensation is due in this scenario. 30% of the fare from CPH-LHR (not very much) or of the whole CPH-JFK fare?

Thanks for your help.

Take distance of the downgraded leg over the total distance, multiply that fraction by 75% and the cost of the ticket ex fees and charges that don't vary with travel class (e.g. airport fees etc.) - unless the booking allocated a specific part of the fare component to the leg in question. So not very much

Recent ruling in last few weeks on this at CJEU

lorcancoyle Jul 1, 2016 1:40 am


Originally Posted by Ziz (Post 26855355)
I'm not planning to claim anything even if eligible, since I think I was treated pretty well by BA in this circumstance, but I just want to check my situation in case something arises in the future. I think it's pretty straightforward.

Originally scheduled on a 10:35 to Dublin - cancelled and rebooked on a 9:20 service. This leaves more than 1 hour earlier than scheduled, but does not arrive late so entitled to 125 euros (assuming it's not due to weather)?

Also scheduled on the return 12:55 to LHR - also cancelled and rebooked on 11:40 leaving more than 1 hour earlier, etc. Another 125 euros? Does it matter that this segment is the first part of a long haul?

You were still leaving more than 1 hour early for your trip in second instance, the amount should be based on trip length I believe, not leg length

corporate-wage-slave Jul 1, 2016 1:55 am


Originally Posted by Ziz (Post 26855355)
I'm not planning to claim anything even if eligible, since I think I was treated pretty well by BA in this circumstance, but I just want to check my situation in case something arises in the future. I think it's pretty straightforward.

Originally scheduled on a 10:35 to Dublin - cancelled and rebooked on a 9:20 service. This leaves more than 1 hour earlier than scheduled, but does not arrive late so entitled to 125 euros (assuming it's not due to weather)?

Also scheduled on the return 12:55 to LHR - also cancelled and rebooked on 11:40 leaving more than 1 hour earlier, etc. Another 125 euros? Does it matter that this segment is the first part of a long haul?

We don't know the cause, so it may be your aren't due anything, though the evidence in your particular case looks to be more equipment/crew shortage. The first one is 125€, the second one is open to debate in application (though I think the Regulation plus case law is clear), but 125€, 250€ or 300€ according to total distance on the great circle basis from start point to end point.

corporate-wage-slave Jul 1, 2016 2:00 am


Originally Posted by lorcancoyle (Post 26855732)
Take distance of the downgraded leg over the total distance, multiply that fraction by 75% and the cost of the ticket ex fees and charges that don't vary with travel class (e.g. airport fees etc.) - unless the booking allocated a specific part of the fare component to the leg in question. So not very much

Recent ruling in last few weeks on this at CJEU

Indeed, probably almost nothing. I'll do a full posting of the implications in a few days, but you can no longer read the advice in this thread as correct, since the CJEU has ruled very strongly in the airlines' favour late last week. In the case of CPH - LHR the won't be much to it, since there are no carrier surcharges or APD differences on that route, so taxes stay the same and are excluded from the calculation.

monkeytennis Jul 1, 2016 2:23 am

Thanks all.

I will try for compensation outwith eu262 initially then.

Out of interest, what would you deem appropriate for a downgrade CPH-LHR?

caz312 Jul 1, 2016 2:54 am

I thought I had my head around all this stuff but not sure about this one...
Flight EDI-LCY cancelled and auto rebooked on a LHR flight 6.5 hours later (a Monday morning so nothing else available) not suitable so opted for refund and booked on flymaybe. Refund received.... assuming reason for cancellation not extraordinary...does EU261 comp apply? (I know you can opt not to travel after 5 hour delay and receive refund + comp but not sure about cancellation and rebook being 5+ hours later)

UKtravelbear Jul 1, 2016 3:09 am


Originally Posted by corporate-wage-slave (Post 26855789)
Indeed, probably almost nothing. I'll do a full posting of the implications in a few days, but you can no longer read the advice in this thread as correct, since the CJEU has ruled very strongly in the airlines' favour late last week. In the case of CPH - LHR the won't be much to it, since there are no carrier surcharges or APD differences on that route, so taxes stay the same and are excluded from the calculation.

Not read the judgment but did it say anything about carrier surcharges being included in the calculation or not?

If they are excluded I can see some airlines reducing the base fare and just increasing the surcharge (until some one spots it and takes a case to court and wins)

corporate-wage-slave Jul 1, 2016 3:43 am


Originally Posted by UKtravelbear (Post 26855926)
Not read the judgment but did it say anything about carrier surcharges being included in the calculation or not?

If they are excluded I can see some airlines reducing the base fare and just increasing the surcharge (until some one spots it and takes a case to court and wins)

I'll put more on this later. But there are two features here: surcharges sometimes vary between cabins (though not in all cases). That aspect should not be controversial, the passenger should get that delta back if it applies. The other aspect is the wording in this new judgement, which said this (36):

"Those taxes and charges are unavoidable components of the final price to be paid by the passenger in order to avail of the service proposed by the air carrier"

Carrier surcharges are as avoidable the base fare, to my mind, but that may require further legal clarification.

squawk Jul 1, 2016 9:42 am


Originally Posted by corporate-wage-slave (Post 26852875)
If it was a straightforward cancellation or delay you normally hear within a fortnight at the moment. That's going direct via BA.com and following the guidance at the top of this thread. I can't see why Resolver would necessarily be slower, but I guess it would depend on the circumstances or any complexities. Downgrades do take longer for example, and complex connections too. If you hadn't heard after a month I would call BA via Customer Relations to find out more, quoting your incident number.

Thank you corporate-wage-slave - it was a simple delay to a transatlantic flight, which led to a missed connection from LHR to the regions (despite running flat out through T5 - I suppose it woke me up!). I was rebooked onto a later connection that day, but that put my final arrival at 4 hours past my scheduled arrival.

I'll dig out the case reference, check the date I submitted, and follow your advice. Thank you!

bhatnasx Jul 1, 2016 3:30 pm

I'm not sure if this is a valid claim or not, so any thoughts would be appreciated.

Was booked on an overnight JFK-LHR-SVG. JFK-LHR was delayed due to mechanical issues and got in about 45 minutes late, and then we taxied for a while & they deplaned the 747 using buses and my 1:30 scheduled connection was blown due to the late arrival, mixed with the use of buses to deplane, I didn't even get to the FastTrack passport/ticket checking line til 8:10am and I would not have made for my 8:30am departure.

I was scheduled to arrive in SVG at 11:10am, local time and then I had a later flight (separate ticket) to Amsterdam.

The agent that helped me wanted to put me on the later afternoon SVG flight (that would have gotten to SVG around 5:15pm) - had I taken that, I would have missed my flight to AMS and had a forced overnight in SVG (not BA's problem, I know).

I was able to convince the agent to put me on a KLM LHR-AMS flight that left LHR at 12:35pm and got into AMS at 2:55pm. That flight was on time (landed at 2:41pm, at the gate by 2:55pm).

I'm not really sure if a claim exists here.

I'm not sure I'm going to even file a claim, but I'm wondering whether this would qualify.

I was originally supposed to get to the final destination at 11:10am, but arrived at 2:41pm, so 3:31 later - but, they allowed me a free change to my destination (I was flying in paid business class).

Is this a valid claim?

Thanks!

corporate-wage-slave Jul 1, 2016 4:25 pm


Originally Posted by bhatnasx (Post 26858629)
I was able to convince the agent to put me on an LHR-SVG flight that left NYC at 12:35pm and got into AMS at 2:55pm. That flight was on time (landed at 2:41pm, at the gate by 2:55pm).

Could you just clarify the quoted paragraph, I can't get it to compute with the rest of your post. But broadly speaking, if you re-engineered (and reticketed) your booking you may be deemed to have reset the clock.

binman Jul 2, 2016 12:55 am

BA just advised over night that they are paying out for my delay on June 24. This was my first EU261 claim and am surprised at how easy it was, and how quick BA settled.

For others who got caught up in the mayhem last Friday and who may have been put off claiming by BA flight crew, ( mine tried to blame weather and ATC from the day before) BA clearly accepting responsibility and part of their reply to me stated
"’ve looked into the details of your complaint, and from what you and other customers have told us, we didn’t keep you as informed as we should have. Our airport managers meet often so they can look at ways we can improve our service."
Thanks to thread the £206 will in some way make up for the delay.

leaveamessage Jul 2, 2016 6:40 am

What is the situation for a claim when a flight is classed as delayed for 22hrs due to no aircraft being there?
Not me this time, but asking for a family member who for some reason decided to fly VS yesterday and is not enjoying being in a hotel somewhere in NJ.

In this case it was EWR-LHR (VS2) last nite.
The inbound aircraft (VS1) was almost at EWR then diverted to BOS, and then kept at BOS overnite - I suspect due to crew out of hours after the divert and the original delay in leaving LHR.
Will it be dismissed instantly due to the storms, or is the fact that there was no aircraft actually there for her flight sufficient for a claim?

corporate-wage-slave Jul 2, 2016 6:44 am


Originally Posted by leaveamessage (Post 26860654)
Will it be dismissed instantly due to the storms, or is the fact that there was no aircraft actually there for her flight sufficient for a claim?

EWR isn't a base for Virgin so you can't presume it has the ability to find and lay on an extra aircraft. It will depend on the reason for the diversion to BOS, if that was weather related, as you indicated, I don't think this is going to go anywhere. If, on the other hand, it was due to a technical problem at LHR or en route then you may have a case.

bhatnasx Jul 2, 2016 8:04 am


Originally Posted by corporate-wage-slave (Post 26858837)
Could you just clarify the quoted paragraph, I can't get it to compute with the rest of your post. But broadly speaking, if you re-engineered (and reticketed) your booking you may be deemed to have reset the clock.

Sorry - multiple typo!

Original itin was JFK-LHR-SVG & the agent at LHR put me on LHR-AMS on KLM instead of LHR-SVG later. Also, ex-LHR, not NYC - I'll edit the post!


All times are GMT -6. The time now is 2:45 am.


This site is owned, operated, and maintained by MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. Copyright © 2024 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Designated trademarks are the property of their respective owners.