steve170461

We just did a very last minute RFS trip to Prague. On the way out on Tuesday morning the only option offered was in Y. The load was around 20 empty in Y and only 3 of 16 occupied in J.

We were only offered J availabilty on the way back yesterday. We were 2 of 17 pax out of a possible 20 in J with Y having around 20 empty again.

We would happily have used more miles and given BA a few extra £ to go in J on the way out so is there any logic to the availability we were offered?

KARFA

I think you are making the mistake of thinking there is a clear linear relationship between revenue seats, no. of tickets bought, award availability, and POUG availability. It is very complex and frankly unless you are in the industry - which I am not - you can't fully understand it. In any case, I think the one thing we do know is that BA do not operate a policy of trying to fill premium cabins unlike US carriers, so the fact seats are free in CE does not mean BA want to offer them all to Y passengers for avios/money upgrades.

cosmo74

Yes - BA's logic with award availability seems to be to make it as frustrating as possible so that people don't/can't redeem their avios

Other than that, there seems to be absolutely no ryhme or reason as to why reward seats are or aren't available but perhaps someone with insider knowledge can shed some light...

DomesticusTaxmius

I heard scientists have built a tunnel 27km in circumference beneath the Franco-Swiss border near Geneva to try to understand this very concept.

Rumour is, if they crack the availability matrix, the universe will collapse on itself.

KARFA

lol ^

Redwood

As far as I know, there are only so many redemption seats available per flight. Once they're booked, they're gone. It doesn't matter if overall there are seats available on the plane. If they aren't redemption/rewards seats, you can't book them with Avios. It's just how it works!

steve170461

Thanks for the replies-it certainly seems to be a black art.

Just as an aside can anyone explain the CIV codes which customers are given? I believe it's a way to indicate the importance of a customer.

Jetstreamer

There is an element of revenue protection that BA have to consider as well. If award seats become readily available last minute on every flight that is not full, it will likely hit sales of revenue tickets, especially in the premium cabin. They have to factor issues like this into the equation. Yes they could get some money and miles from you for that empty seat up front, but that could impact somebody's decision making in the future when considering purchasing a CE fare with money. Overall, BA could earn more revenue by not letting you have that seat.

Filthy Monkey

It's how BA measures internally how valuable a customer is to them. It's primarily based on spend, but certain groups of customers are given minimum values. GCHs, for example, start at 37 and this increases with spend, while GGL members have a score of 97. BA uses the figure, in theory, to prioritise things like op-ups, meal service etc.

steve170461

OK thanks for the info. We've both just dropped to silver and our code was a very lowly 14.

jp-mco

I honestly never thought of that. Having had a taste of premium cabins through an Avios booking may make you pay for it if the seats aren't available when you want them in the future. I've certainly done that so it's obviously a real factor. Having said that how on earth you plan and release seats on a particular flight on any given date is most definitely a dark art.

gcuk

This whole topic has been a great source of frustration over the last few days. I need to get my son back from Budapest on Monday for a funeral on Tuesday so very keen to use an RFS as flights are over £250 one way. I could use the GGL redemption but typically use them for family holidays. Been watching award seats released from most other Euripean cities a few days before the flights but nothing yet for Monday from Budapest. Oddly, the price had dropped from Hfl 130,000 to Hfl 94.000 overnight but no award seats released so I booked a revenue ticket this morning and will watch 24 hour cancellation option tomorrow and see if award seats free up overnight. Frustratingly, while watching BA, Easyjet prices have risen so would have been better off booking with them a few days ago. Will be interesting to see how many people are actually on the flight.

bernardd

I'm sure that's not all they're watching.

The problem is if they make avios too hard and to expensive in dodgy "carrier imposed charges" to redeem, they reduce our propensity to collect the stupid things. That in turn reduces our willingness to pay over the odds for BA flights, sign up for brands of credit cards with issuers we don't really like, shop at Tesco (thankfully 5,000 miles reduces the tiny temptation for me!), choose particular brands of fuel etc.

It's all a huge compromise. If you bias it one way you threaten another revenue stream. It will be interesting to see how well BA really understands its customers and if their approach changes with the economy.

paul4040

I've never quite understood how the revenue management works with award tickets.

Example - 23 March was last week showing on the SFO-LHR route, a total of 13 J seats and 2 F seats over the two flights that day. Try finding availability any other day that month and it is sparse indeed... No idea why that particular Monday evening was so availability-rich; wide open.

I nabbed one of the seats. 64A to boot. ^

steve170461

So sorry to re-energise an old topic but I just thought I'd share this with you and hopefully understand more how seats are, or in this case, not. released.

We just returned from the Caribbean on an Amex 241. We were in BGI but as there were no J seats available from there I looked at other options. POS was the only flight showing seats and that flight goes via UVF.

We got ourselves to POS expecting a light load out of there and much fuller out of UVF. it would have been easier for us to get to UVF from BGI but as I say there was no availability from UVF. Imagine my surprise with the following load from UVF to LGW:

F=2
J=10
Y+=12
Y=122

At the very least I would have expected that we may have been offered an upgrade to F on MMB but not even that happened.

Just as an aside the service offered was fantastic the other day with a charming, personable cabin crew in J and, by the announcements, a real character who was running the F cabin.