Webjet absorbed
Jul 9, 2011 | 8:47 am
#1
Original Poster
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 2,187
Webjet absorbed
http://blogs.wsj.com/deals/2011/07/0...s/?mod=WSJBlog
Likely not good for consumers, since less competition generally means higher fares, but also not surprising, given Webjet's woes, which got so bad that the government stopped them from selling tickets for a while. The WSJ article makes it sound like there has been more competition than there really has been. TAM (part of the Star Alliance) and Gol (code share partner with American, Iberia and others, but not in an alliance) still strongly dominate the airline market. The presence of the competitors varies widely by market. For us in Fortaleza, Webjet had a pretty small presence. Avianca Brasil (formerly Ocean Air) a bit more.
Likely not good for consumers, since less competition generally means higher fares, but also not surprising, given Webjet's woes, which got so bad that the government stopped them from selling tickets for a while. The WSJ article makes it sound like there has been more competition than there really has been. TAM (part of the Star Alliance) and Gol (code share partner with American, Iberia and others, but not in an alliance) still strongly dominate the airline market. The presence of the competitors varies widely by market. For us in Fortaleza, Webjet had a pretty small presence. Avianca Brasil (formerly Ocean Air) a bit more.
Jul 9, 2011 | 6:47 pm
#2
Join Date: May 1998
Location: australia
Posts: 5,961
Really bad news
Not only has Webjet become my carrier of choice because it almost always has the best fares when I am flying but it (along with Gol) is one of the few Brasilian airlines that don't make it a total pain in the neck to purchase domestic tickets online.
Jul 10, 2011 | 7:24 am
#3
Original Poster
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 2,187
Gol is easy for online purchases? Why any easier than TAM? Don't you have to register for both? I couldn't get a total price form Gol without registering (at least with TAM could get the total price; their phone service is, however, a pain). Other sites regularly report on difficulty for foreigners to purchase a ticket online with Gol (TAM has international Web sites), but that's another question. I've not flown Webjet but would like to have options. Airlines do come and go, of course. I flew both Transbrasil and Vasp between the U.S. and Brazil. Also Varig, which is hardly close to what it used to be. My wife is flying between Fortaleza and Teresina (I like its airport code: THE) in two weeks, and TAM was cheaper for the particular dates she wants to travel. Nothing against Gol, however.
Jul 10, 2011 | 7:56 am
#4
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: RNO
Posts: 362
In this article, http://news.airwise.com/story/view/1310185450.html, it says the offer is about 96 million reais where Webjet is valued at 311 million reais. Webjet (or the owner) must be desperate to accept such a low offer.
Jul 10, 2011 | 9:41 pm
#6
Join Date: May 1998
Location: australia
Posts: 5,961
Gol is easy for online purchases? Why any easier than TAM? Don't you have to register for both? I couldn't get a total price form Gol without registering (at least with TAM could get the total price; their phone service is, however, a pain). Other sites regularly report on difficulty for foreigners to purchase a ticket online with Gol (TAM has international Web sites), but that's another question. I've not flown Webjet but would like to have options. Airlines do come and go, of course. I flew both Transbrasil and Vasp between the U.S. and Brazil. Also Varig, which is hardly close to what it used to be. My wife is flying between Fortaleza and Teresina (I like its airport code: THE) in two weeks, and TAM was cheaper for the particular dates she wants to travel. Nothing against Gol, however.
My personal experience with maybe 30 domestic flights in Brasil:
1) Gol - have always been able to book the cheapest fares on the Brazilian website much easier with Amex than other credit cards
2) Webjet - once I had my personalised pseudo-CPF from a site like http://www.downloadatlas.com/freeware-7bf3d5b8.html
I have had no problem booking fares on the Webjet website
3) Avianca - in its previous incarnation as OceanAir i was initially able to book on its website and even credit my flights to their Amigo FF program but it changed a year or 2 back and required a real CPF to book.I haven't tried since Avianca took over
4) TAM - I have never been able to book on the Brasilian site and the fares on the nternational sites are invariably higher and therefore have never pursued a booking there.
5) Azul - site looks promising but I think a valid CPF is needed - could be wrong though. Their base being Campinas has never motivated me to pursue a booking.
6) Trip - all the flights I've looked at seemed to be multistop milk runs and the idea of multiple take-offs and landings within Brasil just to get from A to B has never met an acceptable risk profile for me
Jul 11, 2011 | 1:48 am
#7
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Aug 2000
Location: London
Programs: Hilton, IHG - BA, GA, LH, QR, SV, TK
Posts: 18,297
Simple!
Because GOL accepts credit cards (at least it accepts Amex) registered at non-Brasilian addresses. i.e. I can book a flight from my desk in London and access normal airfares.
TAM adopts the policy "milk the gringo", insisting that reservations from overseas are made in higher fare buckets through its "international" website. The Brasil call centre also refuses payment with foreign credit cards.
For Webjet I went through their call centre to pay by credit card. Once you get used to Brasilian operators not understanding an Anglo-Portuguese accent, it works
Because GOL accepts credit cards (at least it accepts Amex) registered at non-Brasilian addresses. i.e. I can book a flight from my desk in London and access normal airfares.
TAM adopts the policy "milk the gringo", insisting that reservations from overseas are made in higher fare buckets through its "international" website. The Brasil call centre also refuses payment with foreign credit cards.
For Webjet I went through their call centre to pay by credit card. Once you get used to Brasilian operators not understanding an Anglo-Portuguese accent, it works
Sep 20, 2011 | 1:55 pm
#8
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Los Angeles
Programs: AA EXP
Posts: 637
Simple!
Because GOL accepts credit cards (at least it accepts Amex) registered at non-Brasilian addresses. i.e. I can book a flight from my desk in London and access normal airfares.
TAM adopts the policy "milk the gringo", insisting that reservations from overseas are made in higher fare buckets through its "international" website. The Brasil call centre also refuses payment with foreign credit cards.
For Webjet I went through their call centre to pay by credit card. Once you get used to Brasilian operators not understanding an Anglo-Portuguese accent, it works
Because GOL accepts credit cards (at least it accepts Amex) registered at non-Brasilian addresses. i.e. I can book a flight from my desk in London and access normal airfares.
TAM adopts the policy "milk the gringo", insisting that reservations from overseas are made in higher fare buckets through its "international" website. The Brasil call centre also refuses payment with foreign credit cards.
For Webjet I went through their call centre to pay by credit card. Once you get used to Brasilian operators not understanding an Anglo-Portuguese accent, it works
Sep 23, 2011 | 2:29 pm
#9
Original Poster
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 2,187
Calling from overseas? 0800 is a toll free number within Brazil. Whatever service you use for international calling may be able to tell you if you can call such a number (obviously not toll free). Or perhaps you can find a non-0800 number.
I have always found TAM's prices nearly identical to those of Gol and never had trouble booking through their site, but have only booked through their Brazil site. Last time I flew them (FOR-GIG-FOR), I got a better price going through Expedia.com, which had the added advantage of allowing me to pay in USD and not have to pay my credit card company's 2.7% foreign currency transaction charge. Expedia did not show any Gol flights (except as pat of international itineraries involving other airlines). When I booked through Expedia, I was even able to cancel a flight over 24 hrs. after booking (my wife had to change her flight plans). I imagine you could also book through other sites, such as Travelocity and Kayak. There may well be third party sites that book Brazil domestic flights on Gol; I just haven't seen any. Personally, I would have no particular preference in flying Gol vs. TAM. Haven't yet flown Webjet, Azul or Avianca.
Avianca Brasil (connected to, but not actually part of, Avainca International based in Colombia, at least not yet) seems to have lower prices on some routes, though, of course, far fewer flights than Gol or TAM. They seem to be using Fokkers (vs. Boeings for Gol and Airbus for TAM). I haven't booked a flight through them yet, but did look into it and their site appears to offer options to use either a Brazilian CPF or foreign passport number in order to register.
As of last weekend, at least, Webjet was still flying as a separate airline (we saw several Webjet planes when taking a friend to catch a flight at FOR).
I am currently hoping for a sale on TAM or Gol this weekend for a flight to Brasilia and back next month. Prices jumped over the past several days.
I have always found TAM's prices nearly identical to those of Gol and never had trouble booking through their site, but have only booked through their Brazil site. Last time I flew them (FOR-GIG-FOR), I got a better price going through Expedia.com, which had the added advantage of allowing me to pay in USD and not have to pay my credit card company's 2.7% foreign currency transaction charge. Expedia did not show any Gol flights (except as pat of international itineraries involving other airlines). When I booked through Expedia, I was even able to cancel a flight over 24 hrs. after booking (my wife had to change her flight plans). I imagine you could also book through other sites, such as Travelocity and Kayak. There may well be third party sites that book Brazil domestic flights on Gol; I just haven't seen any. Personally, I would have no particular preference in flying Gol vs. TAM. Haven't yet flown Webjet, Azul or Avianca.
Avianca Brasil (connected to, but not actually part of, Avainca International based in Colombia, at least not yet) seems to have lower prices on some routes, though, of course, far fewer flights than Gol or TAM. They seem to be using Fokkers (vs. Boeings for Gol and Airbus for TAM). I haven't booked a flight through them yet, but did look into it and their site appears to offer options to use either a Brazilian CPF or foreign passport number in order to register.
As of last weekend, at least, Webjet was still flying as a separate airline (we saw several Webjet planes when taking a friend to catch a flight at FOR).
I am currently hoping for a sale on TAM or Gol this weekend for a flight to Brasilia and back next month. Prices jumped over the past several days.
Last edited by SoCal; Sep 23, 2011 at 2:39 pm
Sep 24, 2011 | 8:26 am
#10
Original Poster
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 2,187
www.webjet.com.br seems to give just one non-0800 or 0300 telephone number, (21) 3535 2525. That's for travel agencies but maybe they could direct you, if you can't find a way to call 0800 or 0300 from the U.S. Finding someone who can speak English is a different question.
p.s. I did just buy a ticket from Gol, since they're having a sale. The Web site did seem to allow one to buy using a passport # if they don't have a CPF, but I am not sure. I actually had to give up on the Web site and go through a travel agent, but you might have better luck.
p.s. I did just buy a ticket from Gol, since they're having a sale. The Web site did seem to allow one to buy using a passport # if they don't have a CPF, but I am not sure. I actually had to give up on the Web site and go through a travel agent, but you might have better luck.
Oct 5, 2011 | 5:48 pm
#11
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Los Angeles
Programs: AA EXP
Posts: 637
www.webjet.com.br seems to give just one non-0800 or 0300 telephone number, (21) 3535 2525. That's for travel agencies but maybe they could direct you, if you can't find a way to call 0800 or 0300 from the U.S. Finding someone who can speak English is a different question.
p.s. I did just buy a ticket from Gol, since they're having a sale. The Web site did seem to allow one to buy using a passport # if they don't have a CPF, but I am not sure. I actually had to give up on the Web site and go through a travel agent, but you might have better luck.
p.s. I did just buy a ticket from Gol, since they're having a sale. The Web site did seem to allow one to buy using a passport # if they don't have a CPF, but I am not sure. I actually had to give up on the Web site and go through a travel agent, but you might have better luck.
I ended up using Avianca. I called the main toll free line and they connected me to Avianca brazil/OceanAir. The guy spoke okay English but the call volume was pretty low. He was very helpful, booked me two tickets and after about 30 mins of repeating the passengers name, guess what?! at the end he said they didn't take US issued CC but he was able to put a hold for the tickets so I can pay at the Rio airport. I have to say, I have never experienced such pain in booking tickets even at the most remote part of Asia. Nonetheless I am super excited for Brazil tomorrow!
