Tipping guidelines in Cambodia?
 

For the Doakes Christmas tour of Angkor Wat (and surrounding areas) we enlisted the aid of a tour guide. He was very helpful and I'll be happy to give his informaiton to anyone who needs a great guide. Our driver for the first two days had a family situation, so he is not able to be our driver for the 3rd day. We never spoke to the driver, but he was always there waiting for us and our guide. A nice little program of him being at the opposite side of where we walked in...saving a lot of time because of no backtracking to get out. So, tonight we were faced with how much to tip our driver. We had no idea what was acceptable. I'll post my actual tip after i hear some acceptable ranges. We didn't want to give too much and pretend to be rich and didn't want to give to little because we are not rich (at least on American standards).
I'll look forward to any responses.

PS. I do plan on tipping our guide pretty heavily since he was a font of knowledge about Angkor, Cambodia and everything else here.

thanks.

An interesting question. When I was recently in Cambodia I too hired a driver and guide for two of the three days I was there. I was their only passenger and essentially had to pay for the full tour price which if there had been two people would have been half each.

I took the view that, but for me hiring them for these two days they wouldn't have gotten paid anything, therefore two days wages with no tip is better than nil wages.

My view is that tipping is just legalised extortion unless excellent service has been received. So essentially I don't tip.

Can you tell I am Australian who hasn't yet been to the USA? :p

Do you thank the bus driver for driving the bus?
 

It was just me and Mrs Doakes, so essentially a private tour. I don't know how much we shelled out for the tour, but it was worth it. The guide, the food, the entry tickets to Angkor, transportation, etc were all taken care of. Mrs D says that $20/day tip for both driver and guide (to be split how ever they want) is what she has heard. I agree with your legalized extortion though. But I have been conditioned to tip...stupid waiter job in high school!

Given that most people make just a few $100 per month, any amount should be welcomed. The guide said something about the Cambodia GDP being $400. So, that $1 that i lost to a local kid playing tic-tac-toe at a temple (he erased my 'O'...but i had to applaud his ingenuity) would be huge.

I've never been to Cambodia ... here is what's suggested by "Conde Nast Traveler" magazine

Cambodia

At Restaurants: About $1 per diner for the waiter.
At Hotels: One to two dollars per bag for the porter; service charge included for everything else at nice hotels.
Guides and Drivers: About $1 for taxis; $2 per hour for private drivers; $10–$20 per person per day for tour guides.
Dollars Accepted?: Yes; what's more, Sandy Ferguson of Asia Desk, a travel agency, discovered by chance that two-dollar bills open doors. Having gotten hold of a bundle of them in the U.S., Ferguson "almost caused a riot" in the airport when he paid that way. "Bring them to each hotel" for the porters, who consider them good luck—because of their rarity.
Note: Ferguson says be prepared for unusually effusive thanks for a tip here. "Don't get embarrassed by that," he says.

http://www.concierge.com/cntraveler/...7?pageNumber=5

I'm with Hvr on this one.I have been travelling to Asia for over 30 years and tipping was never part of the culture.As more american tourists have come it is now expected and in some places quite aggressively so.
It is always pointed out to those travelling to the USA that tipping is part of the culture and must be respected.It is sad then that Americans do not respect the cultures of other countries and leave their tipping habits at home.There is a great deal of anti-american feeling in Australia and a lot has to do with the way you tip without regard to local norms.

Exactly !

However, if you feel you "must" tip do take into consideration the cost of living in Cambodia rather than what you are used to in the US. I would use the cost of a meal at a local eatery as a guide, say no more than $1-2 per day ....

I also do not believe many ordinary cambodians earn several $100 per month, except perhaps those working in the tourist industry.

YMMV, but in Cambodia, you can hire a bike and driver to take you around for an entire day for $6-8, and that includes gas.

I don't think there's any reason to worry about overtipping though. $20 might ridiculously extravagant by local standards, but it's not much for the tourist wealthy enough to fly over to Angkor for a visit. The driver may well be surprised and perhaps even think you're foolish, but he just might use the money to put his kids through school, instead of making them hawk postcards at the temples.

It's been a couple of years, but
 

when I was there the cost of a taxi for the day was US$20. This was a newer air-conditioned Toyota Camry with English speaking driver who was disappointed that I did not keep him beyond an hour past dark.

The guide that he got me also was $20 per day. One day with him was more than sufficient.

I agree that the culture is one where one does not tip. Conde Nast seemingly has never been to any place that is not the most expensive in town and has little touch with reality.

Frankly, I completely disagree with the concept of tipping when the local culture is not accepting of it. My view is that it is rude to throw comparatively large quantities of money at people who are not used to it. It raises expectations that are not culturally acceptable and leads to problems with visitors down the line.

That said asking that the guide use the money toward schooling is an excellent concept especially in Cambodia.

He is more likely to use the money to acquire the latest Nokia phone.

Drivers/Guides in Cambodia are relatively well off compared to most of their countrymen, and to suggest that their children have to skip school to make ends meet seems a bit far fatched ....

Let's continue this discussion in the Asia forum.

A tip of a few dollars per day seems reasonable if the guide was good. The fact that the tip is expected should have no bearing. In countries that it's not a custom, it's not important to tip everyone. Even in places where it's expected, you, the customer should decide if one is warranted and at what amount.

I consider tipping to be reflective of the tippers situation as much as the service recieved. On good years, I'm likely to spread it around more than on bad years. Catch me in bad times, and them's the breaks.

Or on whisky and whores. But the point is, it's a lot more money for him than it is for you, and if you give him the money for phones/whisky/whores, he has less incentive to pull his kids out of school.

English-speaking guides, sure. The motodop who hangs out all day in front of your hotel hoping to snag a $2 fare, probably not.

I was last in Siem Reap about 4 years ago and while we were driving around with our guide we made a stop at the guide's home (he was dropping off an armful of lotus seed pods that he had bought on our travels that day). It was basically a lean-to hut that he was sharing with his little brother. I did NOT regret tipping him generously.

In 2006:

The tuk-tuk driver who was waiting at our guest house every morning and drove us anywhere we wanted all day and night for the agreed rate of US$12 a day got $50 for three days.

The English speaking Camry driver who took us to Beng Melea and Bantay Srei and later Tonle Sap in one long day for the agreed rate of $50, and with whom we then arranged for a ride to the airport the next morning, got $70.

I traveled Southeast Asia solo as a "Cheap Charlie" twenty years ago, rarely if ever tipping, and never gave it a thought, but the world is flatter now. I am also better off, and less focused on how far my money goes and more focused on how pleasant the experience is for all concerned.

The most serious negotiations are mostly between my sweet wife and me as to the size of the tip, and then she has been known to run back to the driver/guide/waiter with more, even after I have patiently explained why the amount we are leaving is beyond sufficient. :)

Why is it so many people on this forum are obsessed with tipping, yet fail to realise that it can be offensive as the people they are tipping see it as being bought. Tipping is a USA thing and yet people who ask about how much to tip fail to realise that the rest of the world is not like the USA. When I pay a price for something in USA I object strongly to being expected to pay more in the form of a tip. Dont start the argument they dont get paid enough to live on so you must tip them !!! I think anyone daft enough to work for such low wages in the richest country in the world needs to really ask why they get out of bed in a morning

Rather than tipping in Asia just use a little thought and do something that really helps.
I have loans to people in Cambodia and Vietnam through Kiva-
http://www.kiva.org/app.php?page=home
In Laos I have sponsored a book party through Big Brother Mouse-
http://www.bigbrothermouse.com/
Hopefully this is helping the ordinary people in a more meaningful way than tipping.As has been said tipping is basically a US custom that is being spread throughout the world with little thought for local customs.

I didnt realise this age-old trick still works ......

Kim San is a great guide, we just used his services last month while on a honeymoon in SE Asia.
Interestingly enough, he acted as guide, while his cousin was our driver. Either way, we were really pleased with him, and would definitely recommend him to all travellers to Siem Reap/Angkor Wat.

No, tipping is not "a USA thing", paying a little extra for services rendered well and/or going beyond the call of duty is near universal. (Yes, even in places like Japan, they just set the bar for "call of duty" pretty darn high.) What is American is the idea of an obligatory tip that has to be given, regardless of the quality of service.

Yes I agree, the in your face tip is down right rude but the obsession by Americans to use it especially in Asia to try and get something better is so often done in such a manner that it portrays the " I am richer than you " syndrome which is very offensive to a lot of people

I am richer than you syndrome?

This is a total assumption on your part bizclassboy... are you in their minds to know what Americans are thinking? Maybe they are thinking that they don't want to exploit poor working people?

In the US, the wait staff at most hotels/restaurants earn a minimum wage and, therefore, they depend on the 15-20% tip (depending on the level of service) to raise their families and to basically survive. This is totally voluntary as the tip is not calculated in the final tally but patrons have the attitude and the understanding that the wait staff got to make a living too.

In Italy, the coperta is 10% and automatically added to your bill ... the same goes to most places in Europe, Thailand, etc. Wait staff throughout the world have the same needs: to raise their families and to basically survive. The little that you giving them (for their service and extra effort) will not break you and will surely help them.

And as seanthepilot summed it in an earlier post:

The fact that the tip is expected should have no bearing. In countries that it's not a custom, it's not important to tip everyone. Even in places where it's expected, you, the customer should decide if one is warranted and at what amount.

I consider tipping to be reflective of the tippers situation as much as the service recieved. On good years, I'm likely to spread it around more than on bad years. Catch me in bad times, and them's the breaks.

I suppose it makes for a nice trip knowing that you've helped poor working people in an "etc" country with their basic survival needs.

Yes and its rich coming from a poster who assumes that Italy automatically adds 10% as a tip, he is obviously well adversed in the lonely travellers guides but not in real life. Like I said the attitude of how "we helped those poor people so we gave them a tip" makes you feel good. I think haven spoken to many service staff who tell me they dont earn minimum wage but dont tell the punters makes me laugh when I see postings like this one. Its a myth the way people like this think they are helping people survive and raise their families, I am laughing my socks having read this post

Here you go again scroogeboy making assumptions again ... oops ... I meant to say bizclassboy. FYI, I lived and worked in Italy for 2 years in the late 70's (when you were sucking on your thumb, I presume) and yes my Italian is a bit rusty now but the last time I was there (Valentine's week 2004) the tip was still called coperta (or coperto) and it was listed at the bottom of the menu. Liked the service or not, you paid the service charge pal. The same goes for Europe, often the gratuity (15%) is figured with the total and it will be stated at the bottom of the menu. There are no assumptions on my part and no "lonely travelers guide" information here either but real life experiences.

This is not about "helping those poor people" or "makes you feel good" This is about treating people with dignity and respect and in par with the way you treat their European counterparts. This is called maturity, experience and wisdom. In 30 years of traveling the world, I have learned two things: The first is that when you travel, at some point you will find yourself in a dire predicament. The second is that, equally inevitably, someone will miraculously emerge to take care of you whether the situation is dramatic or mundane, some stranger will appear to save you, spontaneously and with no thought of compensation or reward. I suggest that you read "The Kindness of Strangers" edited by Don George to know what I am talking about.

I am really glad that my post made you laugh. Keep up the good laugh and have a happy new year ... Cheers!

Civility alert!

And Topic Alert! -- "Tipping guidelines in Cambodia?"

On-topic and civil posts are welcome. Others have been and will be dealt with appropriately. Let's keep this interesting and helpful discussion interesting and helpful. Thanks.

cblaisd
Senior Moderator

I only visit Italy between 10 and 15 times a year for the last 10 years and have been visiting there since 1977 for work so hardly a novice I think . How can tipping be treating people with respect and dignity when a simple thank you will suffice ? After 30 years of travel I guess you missed that one. My point is very simple, tipping is more often than not done to in order to buy somehting extra or to get something that is not included.

My questions: Is tipping any harder to explain than why we don't just leave the restaurant without paying? Given that (almost) everybody tips, is the final incidence more or less neutral for the customers? Do we tip, in part, to produce the illusion of control over how we are treated?

What do we know about tipping?
1. Two studies show little relationship between quality of waiter service and size of tip.

2. Hotel bellboys can double the size of their tips, on average, by showing guests how the TV and air conditioning work.

3. Tipping is less prevalent in countries where unease about inequality is especially strong.

4. The more a culture values status and prestige, the more likely that culture will use tipping to reward service.

5. Tips are higher in sunny weather.

6. Servers can increase their tips by giving their names to customers, squatting next to tables, touching their customers, and giving their customers after-dinner mints. (query: how do lap dances fit into this equation?)

7. Drawing a smiley face on the check increases a waitress's tips by 18 percent but decreases a waiter's tips by 9 percent.

8. In one study, waitresses increased their tips by 17 percent by wearing flowers in their hair. In general it pays to look distinctive albeit not freaky.

MODERATOR - feel free to remove this if you think it is going OT

My understanding is that the coperta is not a service charge, but a cover charge (coperta literally translated means blanket or cover). It's essentially a minimum charge which covers the restaurant for things like bread, butter, condiments, olive oil, salad dressing etc. It is often referred to by the French term 'couvert'. It does not go directly to the wait staff as I have learned from my own experience waiting tables :-(

Quoth Mr. Pink . . .
 

Hey, I knew this all sounded very familiar!

Tipping Is For The Birds

DISCLAIMER: YouTube clip contains rude language and a racial slur, neither of which I personally endorse or condone.

ha ha totally agree what a great movie

In my opinion you "have to realize" this is such a short sighted approach. I don't think its such a "good idea to help people" if it means helping them to expect tips... so it just becomes what it is like in the US. Or perhaps "these folks" should be grateful for the opportunity.

staying in Phnom Penh for a while I can tell you that tipping is not expected. If you pay for a good meal in a restaurant you can tip $1-2 . But if you have paid $20 for a guide or driver they will not expect a tip. I understand that Americans like to tip wherever they go, as a European traveller I try to follow the local customs. And a poster here said that the average salary is $400 . That is just not true. The staff at the restaurants earn about $50 plus tip . Instead of tipping your guides or drivers (they are among the richer cambodians) you should give a few dollars to the streetkids. They really need it, or you can buy them food. $1 will buy a lot of food here.

In lieu of tips in Cambodia to those who are not normally tipped, one can make a contribution to places like the Ponheary Ly Foundation or make some microloans via Kiva and their Cambodian partners (see more in FlyerTalk Cares! Forum), or contribute to the amazing KANTHA BOTHA hospitals founded by Dr. Beat "Betocello" Richner (see here).

Any of these will touch a number of lives and have a lasting effect; it certainly is what I have done, and continue to, do years after being in Cambodia.

That's an outrageous tip for anything but an expensive western meal. Seriously, 1-2,000 Riel is sufficient in almost all cases. That's akin to leaving the coins received as change as a tip in Thailand.

I don't think anyone has touched on how tipping is really deeply integrated into Cambodian culture. When a driver/guide brings a good paying customer to a business..... the proprietor of said business often tips the driver/guide as a measure of good will to express his gratitude for having a good paying customer delivered to his door.

Your driver/guide has undoubtedly been tipped plenty on account of driving you around. Whether you noticed it or not.

Often this is quite innocent, fair play and part of the culture and has no more negative impact on you than if a western business offered you some bonus for signing up a friend. Sometimes it plays out in much more sinister commission racquets.

But that is the way "tipping" integrates as part of Cambodian culture. Trust me your driver/guide was tipped.

AKA kick-backs.

Please do not give money to the street kids. This encourages them to stay out of school and to beg instead of get an education. In some homes, parents will force the younger kids to beg in order to augment the family income. A sweet slightly dirty little girl with big eyes gets a handout much quicker than a begging able bodied adult.

+1000000!!!

Doing this also causes these little urchins, or feral children if you prefer, to gravitate toward foreigners expecting money.

Please do not give the kids anything.... even food.

Was just in Cambodia.

IMHO, as in China, tipping is something imported by foreign tourists and which is not part of the native scene.

Nonetheless, some tourists cannot control themselves in their imported desire to tip where it is inappropriate.

PS I am still laughing about the clipboarded list on the counter, at the immigration crossing from Thailand, where you could sign-up to give 100 Baht in explicitly stated (in English) "tea money" to the thuggish looking Cambodian authorities.

Bad enough to give the corrupt government twenty bucks cash for the visa.

I think that your attempt at satire was, perhaps, too subtle. Some readers might think you were serious using the term "feral children." Please tell me you weren't serious.

To be fair, I think the Colonial Brits and other Europeans were galavanting around the globe handing out gratuities long before Squanto showed us Yanks how to feed ourselves in exchange for a flintlock. In some places it took hold as 'tipping' where others it evolved into something along the lines of Egyptian baksheesh (more bribe than tip). Other places get the tip out of you one way or another (by altering your service according to what you paid). Our tipping culture in the US didn't begin in force until the late 19th century, when the nouveau riche decided to be more cosmopolitan and mimic the European custom at the time.

The thing about culture (or custom) is that it mixes and spreads, and nobody owns it. The same romantic notion that travelers shouldn't upset 'quaint' local customs ("look dear, it's so nice, they still live in grass houses!") can also lead to preservation of disease and high infant mortality. There are far more dangerous things in this world than misplaced American generosity, however naive and unnecessary it may be.

You took exception to 'feral children' but not 'urchins'? Hmmmmmm......