agreed (of course), but i think i'd expand the range of possilbilities beyond 苏杭. aside from beijing (which should be obvious), i'd look at chengdu, sichuan, and even putuoshan as potential diversions.

Two weekend nights in Shanghai coming up. I've read on a bunch of threads that Pudong is really out of the way, and that cab rides can be long. Is this advice accurate? Is there a public transportation option?

Or should we fork over the extra money to stay at a place like the Westin near "the bund" (whatever that may be)?

-In general, I think that advice is accurate, but some people really like it over there (a simpler life, perhaps).
-Public transit is fine by developing country standards.
-I don't like the Westin's location; one doesn't gain a lot by staying "near the Bund," IMO

ime, fork over the extra cash. It's about a 40 min. cab ride to Pu-xi. However, you can take the subway now, but it doesn't run all night.

where one is traveling to/from makes a big difference. for example, if you're staying in lujiazui, you can get to the bund in under 5 minutes, if all goes well, but xujiahui would take at least 20 minutes. while the subway doesn't run at night, there isn't much traffic at night so cabs can be pretty quick.

another thought about the subway: i usually try to avoid transfering between the 2 lines because the walk is long and i've been pick pocketed several times in people's square station (and never anywhere else, ever).

The hotel we're considering in Pudong is the Renaissance:

http://marriott.com/property/propertypage/SHARN

St. Regis might also be on the list. How far away are these places (taxi and train) from the sightseeing and nightlife we'd want to do in a two day trip?

Any other major western chain hotels you think are better located?

That sounds terrible. Once would be bad, but SEVERAL times?

Anything else I need to know about Shanghai?

I could also benefit from hotel recommendations. For a tourist, where am I likely to find the best deal on a nice (don't need "5 star") property?

Also, how is the train to Hangzhou? I've heard the train station in Hangzhou is "chaotic." What's the scene in Shanghai?

Thanks!

There is a drastic shortage of 5-star properties in the market so the incumbents command a stiff premium (though many FTers have scored $100 rates at the JW, which is definitely worth pursuing).

Consequently, I advise most people to set their sites a notch down from the top because the price diffrerence is substantial. I've posted my recs many times before so I won't repeat myself here, but my general feeling is to try to get a place near the Hilton that isn't the Hilton. You can move a little south and/or east of there (Okura Garden makes up the SE corner of my desirable square) and still do quite well. Feel free to PM me if you need more help, but please search first.


The train to Hangzhou is fine. Sure, the train station sucks, but it is the nicest in the country and you'll do just fine.

In response to your question about SH in general, which I already deleted, it really is an ok city; my bad experiences are limited to a singal subway station, which can be easily avoided. That said, I firmly believe that BJ is a better place (even discounting for the fact that there is much more to do/see there), so I suggest you weight your China trip(s) in that direction.

BTW, I have nothing against SH. In fact, I spend most of my China time here and appreciate many aspects of this place. And, most SH expats regard BJ as a second rate city. But, they have different priorities than you guys and, for the most part, those that hold that opinion have never done BJ properly.

We stayed at the Renaissance last year during the Shanghai DO. They gave us a nice little fold out map with all the major tourist stops in chinese/english to show the cab drivers.

We generally did not find the taxis to be that much of a problem getting around. And during our four night stay only had a long slow taxi ride one time. Nights were never a problem

We are going back again in April but are planning to stay at the St Regis this time.

I think your view is certainly the majority one. I personally don't plan to spend much time in Shanghai. Frankly, I might not have bothered to see it at all except that we want to go to nearby Hangzhou and Suzhou. So once we're in the area, it seems worthwhile to stop in Shanghai, even if for no other reason than to try to understand modern China.

Anyone have a link to an english city map possibly even with a list of hotels?

I'm looking for either an SPG or Hilton hotel near Huai Hai Zhong Road Postcode： 200021

edit: was able to find a not so detailed map and realize that this is a really long road... anyone know if the 200 block of this road is close to the River?

zhong means middle so the 200 block is not close to the river, but is around hk plaza (huangpi nan lu subway stop), if i'm not mistaken. the jw is reasonably close, while the hilton and westin are each around 15 minutes away by taxi (but, in opposite directions). alternatively, you could try the okura garden (nice hotel for the money) or the jinjiang (not so nice imo), both of which are on huaihai road near shanxi rd (one subway stop west of huangpi nan lu).

Anyone have experience using Priceline for Shanghai? They do divide up the city -- I'm guessing most tourists would want "Huangpu," but perhaps some would also bid for Pudong. Seems risky to bid for less than 5-star -- which would cost you at least $55, since I've heard tthat's the (unwritten programmed) minimum priceline will take for 5-star hotels. The Westin Shanghai seems to participate in priceline (indeed, it MAY be the only 5-star in the Huangpu zone), but there aren't enough reported bids to know what they might take.

thanks for the info... you are right I think the cross street is huangpi nan lu. Was thinking of getting some hotel points on the stay but I think convenience is more important.

Did you consult betterbidding AND biddingfortravel? Everytime I've checked out SH data on those sites, I've concluded that bidders were getting ripped off (and I can't recall ever seeing the Westin; the Westin sells out on a regular basis).