slawecki

Does the NWB card come with a Starwood Platinum?

RichardMannion

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[This message has been edited by RichardMannion (edited 02-07-2003).]

RichardMannion

[QUOTE]Originally posted by RichardMannion:
[B]Hi,

I beleive this was posted here for people to offer input on the differences between this NatWest Card (which is a MasterCard) and the AmEx Platinum & Centurion cards.

To answer the other question, no the NatWest card does not come with Starwood Platinum or any other hotel status. But then this is somewhat understandable for a UK based product, if you asked 100 UK people who Starwood are, a lot would not know. There is not the level of brand awareness of the UK for Starwood. (And before anyone pipes up with a sarcastic comment, I am not being a snob here.)

If I can recall it is based on the base MasterCard World card offering (http://www.mastercard.com/findacard/credit/mc_world.html)

A UK review here - http://www.ciao.co.uk/NatWest_Black_Review_5315296
Here:-
http://squawk.ca/lbo-talk/0206/2490.html

& theres an intersting document from PWC on Credit Cards here http://www.pwcglobal.com/images/gx/e...ousplastic.pdf

Thanks,
Richard

Merry

In response to an earlier comment: The income criteria is not a problem. Sometime after my 'rejection', I had dinner with an ex-collague from Experian, who is into score-cards etc.

He dug around a little and eventually came up with the explanation that the problem was due to bank references. I do my domestic banking with Alliance & Leicester and apparently they will not give Bank References. No bank reference, no card.

I did suggest to him that they could have contacted Amex Bank in Brussels, but he advised that off-shore accounts were not acceptable to NatWest for credit-card bank reference purposes.

I don't know how much of that is valid, but that is what he said. Mind you he manages MBNA and their score-card is about the easiest (with the exception of Marbles) in the UK. Send them a used train ticket of proof of your earnings and you are OK!

So in a nut-shell, no NatWest Balck for me, I am sticking to my trusty ABN-AMRO mastercard for non-Amex purchases (at least it gives me Airmiles).

Merry

This thread made me review why I responded for the invite for this card in the first place.

Now I know I will regret this but, if you are high-net-worth why would you require a lot of these beenfits?

Travel Insurance: Come on, anyone worth their salt has this covered several times over.

Road side assistance: If you buy a new car or are a company car driver (and most HMW's in the UK are) you have this already.

A Travel Booking Service: Look in the yellow pages!

Lounge Access: If you are earning more than £70k in the UK and your employers are making you fly economy, something is wrong. And come on why would you be flying Eco for personal travel (use those miles for upgrades).

So basically it boils down to Airmiles. But you can get a free Natwest card that gives 1 mile per £20 spend. This card gives 1 mile per £15 spend, but has an annual fee of £250.


AMEX does all of this (except AirMiles) and offers a few useful benefits to HMW's ie. Companion flight offers (OK they are bad value, but who cares it is on expenses right?).


But overall, it seems to me that all of these 'premium' cards are offering benefits that people who are really worth some money don't have a need for. So they can't really be aimed at people who are HMW, but people who want to give the illusion of being HMW.


In writing this I reviewed what my AMEX card gives me, and the answer is practically nothing. If I use their travel service they charge me £10 for the privilidge. I do sometimes have them send me foreign currency to home and that is convienient. I once used the FHR program, it was at the Venitian in Las Vegas, they would have 'upgraded' me to a high-floor, but I had a high-end room anyway. I have never had the need to use priority pass. I have used the Concierge service a couple of times, but they do nothing my secretary and the internet can't do. If I want to go to a sporting or cultural event I will take a customer or better still be invited by a supplier, I certainly don't want to pay for it.

If I had to pay for 'black' I would cut it in half.

If these cards really are targeted at people like me (with a reasonable job and income and a little savings), they are not offering much of real benefit.


Now flame away...

Flyaway

"....If I use their travel service they charge me £10 for the privilidge...."

This is certainly a reason NOT to use their travel service. I called PTS in Canada the other day to reserve a hotel in Charlotte NC. Their Amex rate was lower than the hotel's internet rate, however, with the Amex service charge it was not worth it. They told me that only the FHRS bookings do not attract the service fees.

CTEASDEL

Nikc,

You are bang on the nail with your comments so no flames from my point of view.
In fact I was wondering why I even pay for a Plat Amex. It gives me nothing that I don't have. I used the travel inusrance onece for a delayed bag and that was a pain in the ... as everything had to be purchased on the AMEX card which isn't easy on Christmas eve in Prague.

Internaut

"But overall, it seems to me that all of these 'premium' cards are offering benefits that people who are really worth some money don't have a need for. So they can't really be aimed at people who are HMW, but people who want to give the illusion of being HMW."

Not so much a flame but..... Firstly I'm not sure that it's safe to assume that all high net worth individuals are big spenders. I personally know one who is convinced he can take it with him :-)

Secondly, looking at the lounge access benefit which I quite like (and which IMHO can be something of a life saver between long haul flights):

A lot of businesses are trying to cut costs at the moment (and have been for some time). This would make it a pretty poor business decision to carry on flying staff full fare business/first. When it comes to cutting costs, the logical order appears to be perks first, jobs/salaries later.

Also, I'm still trying to work out who would actually want to fly business for domestic travel (e.g. within the EU). My last dometic business trip was a 1 hour flight from Brussels. The seat was exactly the same as those in economy class and the only difference in service was more alchol plus a warm meal (which was crap, I honestly would have preferred the chicken sandwich in economy). And the price difference? Approx 300UKP. The lounge access having stuggled through a busy security check was nice though.

Finally, I'm sure that being able to fly business and actually choosing to do so are two very different matters. The lounge access is quite a nice perk here.

CTEASDEL

Easy, Flexability.....

Internaut

Aye, I've tried arguing that one with my employer who promptly argued back that the cost of changing tickets is so little that it would take several changes of return before justifying the cost of a business ticket. I cannot comment on ease since someone else always makes arrangements for me (annoying - I can't get rewards points for the flight cost).

Since making my own arrangements to get lounge access (initially via Diners, lately via Amex/Priority Pass), the only benefit I've really lost out on with domestic travel is the faster check in. Of course, long haul is harder - you cannot beat a proper seat with a leg rest (or better still a sleeper).

Ex Amex Card

I agree with you 100%, so there's no flames from me.

It's interesting to see the airmiles example they give on their website. Spending 35,000 on your card would get you a free flight from London to Berlin! But then again, not having a Black card would save you £250 and get you 2 or 3 "free" flights to Berlin.

These cards are for the type of social climber who craves status and respect but is yet to find that money doesn't buy it.

I have a good laugh at the people featured in the "Fame and Fortune" section of the Sunday Times. Most of them just have a Barclaycard.

Ex Amex Card

Merry: If you really want to know why they refused you then go to www.Experian.co.uk and ask for a copy of your credit records. It only costs 2 quid (although they charged me nothing) and makes interesting reading.

It is quite feasable that someone would be refused if they have a couple of other cards with a high limit.

The card issuers will most certainly keep a careful eye on the total amount of credit you can have available. They can get all these details from your credit file - regardless of who has issued the cards.

Merry

As I said earlier, I used to work at Experian, and therefore my credit file is no mystery to me!

The credit file will not tell me why I was refused a card, simply what information was avialable to the card issuer. As there is no default information on my file, only liability and presence infomation, there is nothign on the file to lead me to the reason for a refusal without knowledge of credit scoring criteria used.


You may be interested to know however that shortly Experian are introducing a product (at the request of the UK governement) which will monitor your total credit liabilities (how much you actually owe on your cards, rather than how many cards you have or at best your cards credit limits). Amex credit cards have signed up to this service, although Amex charge cards have not.


Nick

Kovich

So we are agreed then: if you actually have a NWB black card or a Amex plat black card you are definitely not HNW. If you don't have such a card you might be HNW or you might not be, it just depends on how much money you have got.

This theory certainly works with me as I have an Amex Plat and am not HNW

RichardMannion

We need to define HNW first.

The Beckhams have Centurion Cards, are they not HNW?

Noel Gallagher has a Centurion Card, is he not HNW?

Prince Charles has a Centurion Card, is he HNW?

George Michael has a Centurion Card, what about him?

There are several other UK celebrities that have Centurion cards, are they not HNW?

If they are not HNW, then I'm not either (and I mean that in a cheeky way, nothing pompous or snobbish).

I think the theory is somewhat flawed or for a better version, shall we make it friendly for this board level:-

Anyone carrying a Platinum or Centurion card is (delete where appropiate):-

a) stupid enough to pay the huge annual fees to make themselves feel important
b) rich enough that they don't really care about the annual fee
c) get it free as part of their arrangement with AmEx private banking
d) not-HNW but see the value in carrying one of the cards for its associated benefits
e) something else.....

Lets just remember that in the UK, when you sign up for Centurion now, you fill in the form and also agree for AmEx to do a bank reference for £50k (obviously addressed to your private banking manager ).

Thanks,
Richard