mhbnyc

I proved my assumption wrong yesterday when thinking a Purser is a position or seniority, addl responsibility, and experience. The very young purser on jfk-> sfo, while smiley and nice was atrocious and clueless with the service. So much so, that a FA from coach spent about 80% in the front servicing F. When he told me he had 29 years experience I inquired about her training and being junior. He said he like working coach because it’s less work. Surprising to hear they put an untrained person on a flagship route. For people working for the airlines, any light to shed here?

Antarius

I believe they are responsible for the paperwork and are trained/compensated accordingly. However, the purser is not a position of authority on AA, like it is on many international airlines.

AA F is a crapshoot with service quality. Sometimes great, sometimes horrendous. There's no real leadership at all - onboard, from A"P"FA or the airline.

razzaba

Correct. Some airlines have Cabin Crew Managers, which actually do have a supervisory role. AA does not.

JBKettle

I posted this on a different thread once before, but I was told that AA FAs choose their aircraft position on their own. (It's not a formal process. Once they are on the plane, they sort it all out.)


On one hand, I was a little surprised, because I had assumed they were assigned by AA using some metric, like seniority, customer service scores, etc. On the other hand, some of my various experiences suddenly made a lot more sense.

Mats

Due to the crew shortages, it's not unusual to have someone unqualified working as purser.
As I understand it, the APFA contract says that if there are no purser-qualified crew, the purser position becomes a "lead" without the designation of purser.
I'm pretty sure that JFK-SFO is an NIPD (non-international premium destination), so it has a purser position.

Although there is still a purser selection and training process, the requirement is only 18 months of service as a flight attendant. But there aren't that many purser positions, and it's still competitive for people who want to do it. I'm sure that Pan Am and BA used to require 400+ years of service before gaining a purser position, but we now have quite a different reality.

I try to look at the bright side: I would rather that crew training focus on safety above all else. If that means less time devoted to service training, they can pick up those skills later. Exits, defibrillators, and decompression take precedence over service flow.

The same seems to be happening at other airlines: heaps of new crew.

Maybe it can be beneficial long term: newer, more enthusiastic crew might eventually polish their skills. I like to think that many want to provide high-quality service, and they will have the opportunity to hone their skills as they fly more. They have not had a chance to learn the different meanings of alliances and high level frequent flyers, but they can catch on. If they know how to disarm a slide, that's a good start.

The US carriers are far less regimented about roles. There aren't pursers for each cabin or class of service. And I get confused by all of the three-letter acronyms to designate a purser or sub-purser (CSD, CSS, IFL, and the regrettable 'OBL.")

MADPhil

That's one tough prerequisite!

enviroian

I remember flying CW last year and if memory serves BA calls them "cabin manager" (?). This person seemed to be in charge of the entire cabin crew team and empowered to make decisions. I wonder if AA's reason for not doing this 1. revolves around cost 2. a US airline custom or 3. a mix of both.

Bradhattan

I so wish this position (still/ever?) existed on AA or any domestic. It represents dealing with issues when they occur, not after the fact. Customer Service doesn't have to be as hard as they make it.

edit: Distant memory, i know, but remember when landing, the major connection gates were announced?

Antarius

none of these are particularly complex things. Theyre simple enough that airlines all over the world are successfully able to handle this AND provide top notch service.

If you hear A"P"FA talk, it's like their members are solving world hunger and therefore cannot be expected to devote any time to the bulk of their job.


How long does this take to learn?

I know how to disarm a slide on a 777, 776/757, 737, a320, a330/a340 and MD80, if not more. I have actually disarmed a slide on a 77W and a 735 and have no formal training. It's pretty basic stuff.

I believe it stopped in 2016 or so when in-flight internet was available practically everywhere and aa.com was accessible to anyone for free. The announcement list was really long sometimes, so I don't miss it.

One funny story - I once flew IAH-DFW-HOU and the FA from Houston IAH to DFW was calling out the connections and got to mine, Houston Hobby and was very confused.

JAXPax

It all depends on the airline, the union, the contract, etc. Some airlines like Southwest the flight attendants bid a position A/B/C/D on board when they bid their work schedule for the month. So those who are senior and like riding in the back with the least to do are free to do so. A number of other carriers that have a lead or similar, many times there is a class or training to be certified but it's whoever is senior and qualified... they just have to log it as sometimes there's a pay difference of $1-3 an hour.

But yes, Purser role such as a premium market/cabin is mainly the one responsible for the aircraft paperwork (crew customs declaration, reconciling any onboard sales and deposit, duty free reports, etc). It may have some sort of qualification and likely some training but doesn't mean that person always flies Purser, or is very senior at all. An old joke about crew positions says that where you'll find the most senior flight attendant on an international flight is the one working galley where they don't have to face any passengers at all. Some more junior folks go for purser because they think it will, or does, yield "better" flying.

United has proposed a couple of times, including recently, wanting to make the Intl Purser a management position. This would give them some level of authority. Most union contracts prohibit one union member from directing the work of another or enforcing discipline. In 20 years in the airlines I've seen this applied from onboard situations where nobody is really in charge and someone just gets an extra $1 an hour to hand the paperwork to the gate agent on arrival to ramp positions where the workers were able to just pick what assignment they wanted off of a table because there wasn't a management supervisor present, so the person determining assignments can't assign them and just printed off the flights and set them out for people to fight amongst themselves over which one had the least work involved.

pauleeepaul

Ahh the days of mileage/segment runs, distant memories. I once did one LGA-XXX-LGA and had the same crew on the return. Upgrade had cleared on both and the F FA recognized me on the second flight. We had a short laugh about it.

TWA884

That is not correct. At American, cabin crew members bid and are awarded their monthly schedule that has specified equipment type, flights and positions. If they want to trade positions with another crew member on a flight, it has to be done through crew scheduling or via the computerized crew management system.

What's likely to have happened here is that purser called off or misconnected and a reserve flight attendant was assigned the number 1 position (purser). While only qualified crew members can bid and hold the purser position, that is not the case when a reserve flight attendant is assigned the position.

CJ99

FWIW, I helped with a medical emergency on a recent transatlantic flight and the purser was leading the crew response: keeping tabs on the available oxygen cylinders, discussing possible diversion with the captain, coordinating with EMS once we landed, filling out the paperwork. She was senior but had good instincts and plenty of experience.

PresRDC

Back in the day, I once routed between AUS and BDL via DFW and SJU. I was the only connecting flight out of SJU and the purser read it out "we have only one connecting flight to . . . Hartford?"

Very funny.

Antarius

Fun times!

I've definitely done these sorts of runs before, however my IAH-DFW-HOU was because of IROPS and AA routed me MIA-IAH while my car was at HOU. Faced with an expensive cab ride and horrendous rush hour traffic or 2 more segments and 1000 EQM, it was a no brainer.

Which is good and expected. The same happens on CX, QR, BA etc. during diversions and medical issues.

The broader point is that safety is not mutually exclusive from doing a decent job of service. Only AA seems to think that these are incompatible together.