travelsaver

Yesterday, 06/27/22, after pre boarding American Airlines 1195 in St. Thomas with my wife, and son who has a disability, we learned from the flight attendant that two of our three seats were unavailable due to a oxygen system problem, but that the gate agent and ground crew had been made aware of that long before when the plane landed. No volunteer solicitations had been made prior to boarding and none were announced on the plane. After the rest of the plane was boarded, we were told by a ground crew person that the gate agent said we had to get off the plane. I protested verbally, but not wanting to be removed physically, we complied. No offer was made to us, instead I was told we would each be getting vouchers. We were not given a written statement of consequences of an IDB. I refused to take the vouchers as they are effectively worthless to my family given our limited travel opportunities. We had checked in hours before the flight, and I am a lifetime gold million miler on American, which says American didn’t use those for selecting us to be denied.
Right away, I asked for a flight on another airline that day, and was told there were no other flights remaining.
To make matters worse, after I refused the vouchers, the gate agent began fabricating a tale that claimed we volunteered to get off, and claimed that my wife had accepted her offers, because my wife was being emphatic about not spending a night in the terminal. The gate and ground crew said we had to go back to the front of the airport and made us carry our checked and carryon bags from the edge of the tarmac, with no assistance.

we feel very wronged that they didn’t ask for volunteers and then made us get off, and wonder if American violated any of our rights.

JetAway

What “rights” do you think you have that American may have violated?

USFlyerUS

If the seat was broken, the seat was broken. Many of the other facts in your post are irrelevant and muddy the story. You're owed compensation for the broken oxygen, including hotel night, etc. Leave the rest of the info out when contacting Customer Service.

VegasGambler

https://www.transportation.gov/indiv...ping-oversales

Can airlines involuntarily bump me after I have boarded the flight?

• Generally, no. If you have met the following conditions, airlines are not allowed to deny you permission to board, or remove you from the flight if you have already boarded the flight:
  • You have checked-in for your flight before the check-in deadline set by the airlines; and
  • A gate agent has accepted your paper boarding pass or electronically scanned your boarding pass and let you know that you may proceed to board

USFlyerUS

There was a mechanical issue that required certain seats to be left empty for safety reasons, which the second part of the answer to that question applies:

Can airlines involuntarily bump me after I have boarded the flight?

• Generally, no. If you have met the following conditions, airlines are not allowed to deny you permission to board, or remove you from the flight if you have already boarded the flight:
  • You have checked-in for your flight before the check-in deadline set by the airlines; and
  • A gate agent has accepted your paper boarding pass or electronically scanned your boarding pass and let you know that you may proceed to board.
• However, airlines may deny boarding or remove you from a flight even after accepting your boarding pass and informing you that you may proceed to board if the denial or removal is due to a safety, security, or health risk, or due to a behavior that is considered obscene, disruptive, or otherwise unlawful.

Antarius

This is specifically for oversells, not mechanical issues. If the oxygen masks or sensors or whatever MEL component is not functional, the seats cannot be occupied.

In this case, it sucks for the OP (or anyone in such a situation), but this has nothing to do with IDB or booking related removals.

scubadu

Ummm... in the context of the reason the OP shared for being removed is there a reason why you selectively chose to leave off the the second bullet of the section you quoted, which USFlyerUS, has now included? Do you believe the portion about "a safety, security, or health risk" is not relevant to the situation at hand?

Regards

redtop43

I've never heard of only some pax being denied boarding due to a mechanical. This is not an involuntary denied boarding situation, but it should be treated as mechnical, same as if the whole plane broke.

The priority order for IDB (involuntary denied boarding) doesn't apply, becuase it's mechanical. And the bottom line is that AA SHOULD have asked for volunteers and, assuming they found three, given you their seats. Probably not together, but better than waiting at the gate.

Normally in a mechnical situation, the airline will provide vouchers for meals and a hotel if they can't get you out that day, and in some cases will rebook you on another airline.

I've never been to St. Thomas, but I suspect it's like Bermuda, where there are a limited number of flights, they probably all come in around the same time and then turn around and go out the same time, and no one airline has enough staff to have reserve capacity. Despite your awful situation, I'm sure that if you were one of the other pax on that flight or the other one the ground crew was trying to get out, you'd be thinking "Why did they hold up two full flights of people for three travelers?"

They did mess up by boarding you into broken seats, and then probably messed up by giving you no assistance whatsoever, by which I mean not hotel and food vouchers until they could get you out the next day. Giving vouchers is a fraught process, because frequent travelers (who predominate on this board) will always have use for them, and many of us have forgotten what it's like to only fly once every few years. They might throw some miles your way, which at least don't expire if you're careful, but if they offered you, say, $750 vouchers, they won't give you miles equivalent to $750 in travel value.

You clearly have something coming from AA, but I can't say exactly what.

jayer

Pretty much agree with this, especially the leave out irrelevant details part. I never have had quite this situation (meaning I have been IDB'd years ago under questionable circumstances, but I was put on the next flight twice and was lightly compensated to go over to Delta the third time--not that being put on Delta still happens).

Does it constitute IDB, or is there a loophole for a mechanical issue with the seats? I don't know. I might assert Involuntarily Denied Boarding to AA, noting in passing it happened long after having been boarded, and want the cash compensation that an IDB would entail. I might even do the DOT thing for this scenario, even though personally I never have. (I am oh so not in the camp that thinks you complain if you don't have a PDB in your hand by the time the seat gets warm. But this might be different).

TravelerMSY

There’s gotta be something missing here. If you’re offloaded due to a mechanical, they should’ve rebooked you for the next available flight and given you a hotel if it’s the next day. One of those vouchers you refused was likely for the hotel.

I can see why you might be upset, but in the situations one should be pragmatic.

Write into American and it’s likely you can claim whatever your actual expenses were, or do it via a DOT complaint.

How did you get home?

beachfan

What is the oxygen system that is being discussed? Air vents or oxygen secured in advance?

travelsaver

When they took us off the plane yesterday , the American gate agent rebooked us to another flight the next day, today, but not the first available flight. Last night at the checkin counter they did give us a hotel voucher and made a reservation. Today they were able to get our seats together. I asked them, and they agreed, to escort us to the front of the extremely long US customs and immigrations lines that we dealt with yesterday. This afternoon I was notified that the airline had given each of us credits in our American Airlines account for $1,200, despite my refusal off them yesterday, but we still see no likelihood of using them. I requested cash compensation and was told by the agent they don’t do that. We’re still at the STT airport, as this flight has been delayed.

orbitmic

I don't know about the US but in the EU and UK, there would be specific protections for people with disabilities notably in the context of IDB so if AA were aware of your son's disability and some similar protections exist in the US that might be something to mention.

david55

I have to say I was surprised at the tone of some the first FT responses. I felt for you and your family and I thought you detailed the incident well. That all said....it sounds like AA did take hand of the situation and took care of you today. I hope you can use the credit for a future trip....maybe just a little closer to home and with a destination that has plenty of outbound AA flights.

TheDudeAbides

I'll bet you can figure out a way to use these even if you don't travel often.