Aug 22, 2020, 1:08 pm
Last edit by: JDiver
American Airlines prohibits the practice known as “hidden city ticketing” (sometimes referred to as “skiplagging”, “throwaway ticketing” or “point beyond ticketing” as well).
When you purchase an American Airlines ticket you are agreeing to abide by their rules, terms and conditions. Some refer to this as a “contract of adhesion”. Your purchase is considered agreement to comply.Applicable American Airlines Conditions of Carriage (in part) — link
Prohibited booking practices
Reservations made to exploit or circumvent fare and ticket rules are prohibited.
Examples include (but are not limited to):
Applicable AAdvantage Terms and Conditions, in part — link
Fraud, misrepresentation, abuse or violation of applicable rules (including, but not limited to, American or American Eagle® conditions of carriage, tariffs and AAdvantage® program rules) is subject to administrative and/or legal action by appropriate governmental authorities and American Airlines. Such action may include, without limitation, the forfeiture of all award tickets and any accrued mileage in a member's account, as well as termination of the account and the member's future participation in the AAdvantage® program. If your account is terminated due to inappropriate conduct or while under investigation, you may not open a new AAdvantage® account or participate in the AAdvantage® Program in any capacity without obtaining the express written permission of American Airlines. In addition, American Airlines reserves the right to take appropriate legal action to recover damages, including its attorneys’ fees incurred in prosecuting any lawsuit.
When you purchase an American Airlines ticket you are agreeing to abide by their rules, terms and conditions. Some refer to this as a “contract of adhesion”. Your purchase is considered agreement to comply.Applicable American Airlines Conditions of Carriage (in part) — link
Prohibited booking practices
Reservations made to exploit or circumvent fare and ticket rules are prohibited.
Examples include (but are not limited to):
- Purchasing a ticket without intending to fly all flights to gain lower fares (hidden city ticketing)
- Buying a ticket without intending to travel, including to gain access to our airport lounges or other facilities
- Combining 2 or more roundtrip excursion fares end-to-end to circumvent minimum stay requirements (back-to-back ticketing)
- Booking a ticket in someone's name without the person's consent (which is illegal)
- Holding reservations for reasons like securing upgrades, blocking seats or obtaining lower fares
- Booking duplicate or impossible trips, for example multiple trips for the same passenger around the same time (trips a passenger physically could not complete)
- Cancel any unused part of the ticket
- Refuse to let the passenger fly and check bags
- Not refund an otherwise refundable ticket
- Charge you for what the ticket would have cost if you hadn't booked it fraudulently
- Require you refund to us any compensation we provided like bag delivery costs, and reimbursement for clothes or toiletries because of late or lost bags
Applicable AAdvantage Terms and Conditions, in part — link
Fraud, misrepresentation, abuse or violation of applicable rules (including, but not limited to, American or American Eagle® conditions of carriage, tariffs and AAdvantage® program rules) is subject to administrative and/or legal action by appropriate governmental authorities and American Airlines. Such action may include, without limitation, the forfeiture of all award tickets and any accrued mileage in a member's account, as well as termination of the account and the member's future participation in the AAdvantage® program. If your account is terminated due to inappropriate conduct or while under investigation, you may not open a new AAdvantage® account or participate in the AAdvantage® Program in any capacity without obtaining the express written permission of American Airlines. In addition, American Airlines reserves the right to take appropriate legal action to recover damages, including its attorneys’ fees incurred in prosecuting any lawsuit.
Hidden city ticketing is a way to find cheaper nonstop tickets by booking a connecting flight to a final destination beyond yours, but ending your journey at a layover point. You might find that a flight from New York to Nashville with a layover in Atlanta is cheaper than a nonstop ticket from New York to Atlanta, so you book the itinerary with the connection. But, when the plane stops in Atlanta, you end your journey there and are a no-show for the onward flight to Nashville. — scottscheapflights.com
Hidden City Audit - AA Demanding Payment or Account Termination
Mar 22, 2021, 10:11 pm
#751
Suspended
Join Date: Feb 2020
Posts: 1,501
Jul 28, 2021, 12:30 am
#752
Join Date: Jul 2020
Location: So Cal
Programs: AA Platinum
Posts: 2,701
Have some questions about some hidden cities pricing with AA..
Used to see flights to Miami on the 77W F for less money if you just added a city. Nasvhille, DC & Atlanta always came up a few hundred less even though you took the same LAX-MIA flight. I noticed for Nov, Dec & Jan (and maybe more, just didnt look past that) that AA has made it so the cost of the F ticket is always more now. Add ATL, BCN, DCA, etc and its $300-500 more than just the MIA F ticket. Did AA catch on to some of this and people doing the hidden city in F on the 77W Lax-Mia route? Or maybe it was more just a blanket fix of some of there pricing, not necessarily related to hidden cities.
I did find a huge savings with a hidden city headed to Jfk. Its $2500 in F Lax to Jfk but if you put in Boston its $1300 (the same price as if you just took the A321T to Boston in F). I know its frowned upon but I dont see why its so bad to do b/c you are paying and you are paying what the system wants, you just arent flying the last route and if you tell them once landing at Jfk they can fill the seat.
That said, I've never really done this and I could just buy the ticket to Boston and then for $150 hop down to Jfk.
If I were to use the trick and just go to Jfk using the Bos hidden city and its the first time ever doing it will I slide by with out getting in trouble?
Used to see flights to Miami on the 77W F for less money if you just added a city. Nasvhille, DC & Atlanta always came up a few hundred less even though you took the same LAX-MIA flight. I noticed for Nov, Dec & Jan (and maybe more, just didnt look past that) that AA has made it so the cost of the F ticket is always more now. Add ATL, BCN, DCA, etc and its $300-500 more than just the MIA F ticket. Did AA catch on to some of this and people doing the hidden city in F on the 77W Lax-Mia route? Or maybe it was more just a blanket fix of some of there pricing, not necessarily related to hidden cities.
I did find a huge savings with a hidden city headed to Jfk. Its $2500 in F Lax to Jfk but if you put in Boston its $1300 (the same price as if you just took the A321T to Boston in F). I know its frowned upon but I dont see why its so bad to do b/c you are paying and you are paying what the system wants, you just arent flying the last route and if you tell them once landing at Jfk they can fill the seat.
That said, I've never really done this and I could just buy the ticket to Boston and then for $150 hop down to Jfk.
If I were to use the trick and just go to Jfk using the Bos hidden city and its the first time ever doing it will I slide by with out getting in trouble?
Jul 28, 2021, 3:32 am
#754
Join Date: Jul 2020
Location: So Cal
Programs: AA Platinum
Posts: 2,701
Adding a city helps a lot on savings but dont want to cause a problem at HKG.. Would it be CX or AA who the issue would even be with (adding a city onto Hkg on CX but not flying it)..
Jul 28, 2021, 3:51 am
#755
Suspended
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: Canada, USA, Europe
Programs: UA 1K
Posts: 31,452
Ok good to know.. Any worse/better doing it internationally for my 1 freebie ? Adding a city helps a lot on savings but dont want to cause a problem at HKG.. Would it be CX or AA who the issue would even be with (adding a city onto Hkg on CX but not flying it)..
Adding a city helps a lot on savings but dont want to cause a problem at HKG.. Would it be CX or AA who the issue would even be with (adding a city onto Hkg on CX but not flying it)..
Jul 28, 2021, 4:03 am
#756
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: Brighton. UK
Programs: BA Gold / VS /IHG Diamond & Ambassador
Posts: 14,196
One issue is if you book (say) SFO-HKG-BKK and return because it's cheapet than SFO-HKG if you then miss the HKG-BKK then it's more than likely that they will cancel all the rest of the flights on the ticket. Remember your contract is to get you to BKK not HKG.
These sorts of hidden city bookings -vwhether domestic or international - are actually against AAs conditions of carriage.
Please don't regard it as a 'freebie'. If AA chose to go after you for it it isn't a get out of jail free card and 'but flyer talk said ...' isn't a defence either.
And this has happened to a friend of mine on a return from the US to Europe. They had booked JFK-LHR-AMS with the intention of skipping the leg to AMS. There were irrops with the LHR flight so they were rebooked JFK-AMS because at the end of the day the contract was to get them to AMS.
These sorts of hidden city bookings -vwhether domestic or international - are actually against AAs conditions of carriage.
Please don't regard it as a 'freebie'. If AA chose to go after you for it it isn't a get out of jail free card and 'but flyer talk said ...' isn't a defence either.
And this has happened to a friend of mine on a return from the US to Europe. They had booked JFK-LHR-AMS with the intention of skipping the leg to AMS. There were irrops with the LHR flight so they were rebooked JFK-AMS because at the end of the day the contract was to get them to AMS.
Last edited by UKtravelbear; Jul 28, 2021 at 4:34 am
Jul 28, 2021, 4:16 am
#757
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Jul 2003
Posts: 23,056
\
I did find a huge savings with a hidden city headed to Jfk. Its $2500 in F Lax to Jfk but if you put in Boston its $1300 (the same price as if you just took the A321T to Boston in F). I know its frowned upon but I dont see why its so bad to do b/c you are paying and you are paying what the system wants, you just arent flying the last route and if you tell them once landing at Jfk they can fill the seat.
That said, I've never really done this and I could just buy the ticket to Boston and then for $150 hop down to Jfk.
If I were to use the trick and just go to Jfk using the Bos hidden city and its the first time ever doing it will I slide by with out getting in trouble?
I did find a huge savings with a hidden city headed to Jfk. Its $2500 in F Lax to Jfk but if you put in Boston its $1300 (the same price as if you just took the A321T to Boston in F). I know its frowned upon but I dont see why its so bad to do b/c you are paying and you are paying what the system wants, you just arent flying the last route and if you tell them once landing at Jfk they can fill the seat.
That said, I've never really done this and I could just buy the ticket to Boston and then for $150 hop down to Jfk.
If I were to use the trick and just go to Jfk using the Bos hidden city and its the first time ever doing it will I slide by with out getting in trouble?
Jul 28, 2021, 4:23 am
#758
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: May 2004
Location: DFW/DAL
Programs: AA Lifetime PLT, AS MVPG, HH Diamond, NCL Platinum Plus, MSC Diamond
Posts: 21,422
IRROPS might cause issues, and no checked bags of course
Edit: and no round trips
Edit: and no round trips
Last edited by mvoight; Jul 28, 2021 at 7:58 am
Jul 28, 2021, 8:05 am
#759
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: East Coast
Programs: AA CONCIERGE KEY & 1MM, HILTON DIAMOND
Posts: 11,970
Have some questions about some hidden cities pricing with AA..
Used to see flights to Miami on the 77W F for less money if you just added a city. Nasvhille, DC & Atlanta always came up a few hundred less even though you took the same LAX-MIA flight. I noticed for Nov, Dec & Jan (and maybe more, just didnt look past that) that AA has made it so the cost of the F ticket is always more now. Add ATL, BCN, DCA, etc and its $300-500 more than just the MIA F ticket. Did AA catch on to some of this and people doing the hidden city in F on the 77W Lax-Mia route? Or maybe it was more just a blanket fix of some of there pricing, not necessarily related to hidden cities.
I did find a huge savings with a hidden city headed to Jfk. Its $2500 in F Lax to Jfk but if you put in Boston its $1300 (the same price as if you just took the A321T to Boston in F). I know its frowned upon but I dont see why its so bad to do b/c you are paying and you are paying what the system wants, you just arent flying the last route and if you tell them once landing at Jfk they can fill the seat.
That said, I've never really done this and I could just buy the ticket to Boston and then for $150 hop down to Jfk.
If I were to use the trick and just go to Jfk using the Bos hidden city and its the first time ever doing it will I slide by with out getting in trouble?
Used to see flights to Miami on the 77W F for less money if you just added a city. Nasvhille, DC & Atlanta always came up a few hundred less even though you took the same LAX-MIA flight. I noticed for Nov, Dec & Jan (and maybe more, just didnt look past that) that AA has made it so the cost of the F ticket is always more now. Add ATL, BCN, DCA, etc and its $300-500 more than just the MIA F ticket. Did AA catch on to some of this and people doing the hidden city in F on the 77W Lax-Mia route? Or maybe it was more just a blanket fix of some of there pricing, not necessarily related to hidden cities.
I did find a huge savings with a hidden city headed to Jfk. Its $2500 in F Lax to Jfk but if you put in Boston its $1300 (the same price as if you just took the A321T to Boston in F). I know its frowned upon but I dont see why its so bad to do b/c you are paying and you are paying what the system wants, you just arent flying the last route and if you tell them once landing at Jfk they can fill the seat.
That said, I've never really done this and I could just buy the ticket to Boston and then for $150 hop down to Jfk.
If I were to use the trick and just go to Jfk using the Bos hidden city and its the first time ever doing it will I slide by with out getting in trouble?
The MIA LAX 3-class 77W flights have been poorly revenue managed for years... it was not until recently that they were often pricing J higher than F. Now, AA figured out that they can sell more seats by making F slightly more expensive than J but at reasonable levels and that strategy seems to be working better for them. I have seen F for as little as $844 one-way with J being $699 on some dates.
Jul 28, 2021, 2:26 pm
#760
Join Date: Jul 2020
Location: So Cal
Programs: AA Platinum
Posts: 2,701
Whilst you can save a lot of money, if you make it a habit, eventually AA's corporate security team will catch you and they can suspend your account so I would be very careful with this.
The MIA LAX 3-class 77W flights have been poorly revenue managed for years... it was not until recently that they were often pricing J higher than F. Now, AA figured out that they can sell more seats by making F slightly more expensive than J but at reasonable levels and that strategy seems to be working better for them. I have seen F for as little as $844 one-way with J being $699 on some dates.
The MIA LAX 3-class 77W flights have been poorly revenue managed for years... it was not until recently that they were often pricing J higher than F. Now, AA figured out that they can sell more seats by making F slightly more expensive than J but at reasonable levels and that strategy seems to be working better for them. I have seen F for as little as $844 one-way with J being $699 on some dates.
I dont get why the Transcon to Jfk have skyrocketed to $2500 ish for all F flgihts. 3 weeks ago I saw $808 on a couple Saturday flights and many $1159's throughout the week. Now everything is $2500 which is why I was even contemplating this workout with Boston
Jul 28, 2021, 2:29 pm
#761
Join Date: Jul 2020
Location: So Cal
Programs: AA Platinum
Posts: 2,701
I saw it on quite a few diff days within the week I was looking at. You have to scroll all the way down so you know how AA usually has 40 options of flights, I believe it was always listed in the 30-40 category so very close the end. Its always the 1130pm red eye from LAX to JFK and then the A321T from Jfk to Bos. It is $1239 to $1323 depending on the day but on all days that same red eye straight to JFK with out Bos was $2500 mostly and once $3500.
Jul 29, 2021, 2:16 pm
#762
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: East Coast
Programs: AA CONCIERGE KEY & 1MM, HILTON DIAMOND
Posts: 11,970
$944 I see often now, I did snag $844 a few months ago. Just that it used be you can get that fare when tying in another city and now they seem to have caught that. In normal times the small difference for F to J is worth it but now its pretty much the same flight.
I dont get why the Transcon to Jfk have skyrocketed to $2500 ish for all F flgihts. 3 weeks ago I saw $808 on a couple Saturday flights and many $1159's throughout the week. Now everything is $2500 which is why I was even contemplating this workout with Boston
I dont get why the Transcon to Jfk have skyrocketed to $2500 ish for all F flgihts. 3 weeks ago I saw $808 on a couple Saturday flights and many $1159's throughout the week. Now everything is $2500 which is why I was even contemplating this workout with Boston
Airline RM has lots of moving parts, especially when the analysts who manage the inventory buckets for each flight aren't the ones actually setting the rates; technically, yield analysts and pricing analysts are supposed to work closely together but at companies with limited talent like AA, often this doesn't happen and basically the left hand doesn't know what the right hand is doing, which is why we see ridiculous mistakes, like AA pricing Premium Economy much lower than First/Business on CLT/DFW/ORD to HNL/OGG flights.
Jul 29, 2021, 3:27 pm
#763
Join Date: Jul 2020
Location: So Cal
Programs: AA Platinum
Posts: 2,701
[QUOTE=fly747first;33448753]This may be due to staffing. AA terminated many RM staff due to Covid and recently they started to hire again. If they aren't being careful, the RM system may panic thinking that it's building too fast in lower buckets (compared to previous years because of course the system doesn't know about Covid) and thus these get closed immediately leading to higher fares.
Airline RM has lots of moving parts, especially when the analysts who manage the inventory buckets for each flight aren't the ones actually setting the rates; technically, yield analysts and pricing analysts are supposed to work closely together but at companies with limited talent like AA, often this doesn't happen and basically the left hand doesn't know what the right hand is doing, which is why we see ridiculous mistakes, like AA pricing Premium Economy much lower than First/Business on CLT/DFW/ORD to HNL/OGG flights.[/QUOTE
Great analysis, thx for the info..
I really just assumed this is it and from here on out $2500-3500 for Transcon F to JFK, which puts me out as thats just too high. Hope things will come back down in line with what you were aluding to.
I booked in J for the exact flight I need, $659. Hopefully F will become more reasonable. If not the Lax-Bos Via JFK on the say flight I want is very temping and $1200 less.
Airline RM has lots of moving parts, especially when the analysts who manage the inventory buckets for each flight aren't the ones actually setting the rates; technically, yield analysts and pricing analysts are supposed to work closely together but at companies with limited talent like AA, often this doesn't happen and basically the left hand doesn't know what the right hand is doing, which is why we see ridiculous mistakes, like AA pricing Premium Economy much lower than First/Business on CLT/DFW/ORD to HNL/OGG flights.[/QUOTE
Great analysis, thx for the info..
I really just assumed this is it and from here on out $2500-3500 for Transcon F to JFK, which puts me out as thats just too high. Hope things will come back down in line with what you were aluding to.
I booked in J for the exact flight I need, $659. Hopefully F will become more reasonable. If not the Lax-Bos Via JFK on the say flight I want is very temping and $1200 less.
Jul 29, 2021, 5:44 pm
#764
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: Washington,DC
Posts: 1,822
Interesting Thread...
Is this allowed? I see examples of this all the time, especially where DL has non stops and AA don't undercut their fare
1. MSP to ORD to LHR Round trip in Biz is $8,900 on DL and AA
2(a) MSP to ORD on way in First is $300
2(b) ORD to LHR RT in Biz is $2500
2(c) ORD to MSP one way in First is $300
Can I save $5,000 by purchasing three independant AA tickets?
Is this allowed? I see examples of this all the time, especially where DL has non stops and AA don't undercut their fare
1. MSP to ORD to LHR Round trip in Biz is $8,900 on DL and AA
2(a) MSP to ORD on way in First is $300
2(b) ORD to LHR RT in Biz is $2500
2(c) ORD to MSP one way in First is $300
Can I save $5,000 by purchasing three independant AA tickets?
Jul 29, 2021, 5:47 pm
#765
Join Date: Feb 2000
Posts: 6,546
Interesting Thread...
Is this allowed? I see examples of this all the time, especially where DL has non stops and AA don't undercut their fare
1. MSP to ORD to LHR Round trip in Biz is $8,900 on DL and AA
2(a) MSP to ORD on way in First is $300
2(b) ORD to LHR RT in Biz is $2500
2(c) ORD to MSP one way in First is $300
Can I save $5,000 by purchasing three independant AA tickets?
Is this allowed? I see examples of this all the time, especially where DL has non stops and AA don't undercut their fare
1. MSP to ORD to LHR Round trip in Biz is $8,900 on DL and AA
2(a) MSP to ORD on way in First is $300
2(b) ORD to LHR RT in Biz is $2500
2(c) ORD to MSP one way in First is $300
Can I save $5,000 by purchasing three independant AA tickets?