This.

High value customers have choices, especially in intl J. AA is making the same mistakes as UA did under Smisek - we all saw how that went down.

Sounds like someone needs to fly on a real carrier offering a quality intl J and F product. Although I'm sure your response will be "My AA FA's do the exact same job (or better!) as those on LH/AF/CX/SQ/NH".

In general LUS crews are definitely more customer service focused, especially on international flights.

I'd go one step further and say legacy HP crews are the friendliest and service orientated folks out there.

I get excited for the food on Qatar. it's fantastic.

Of all the things that could piss me off when I'm traveling surly FAs are way down on the list. Give me a premium seat (or PE), couple of free drinks (afternoon or evening flights) and a decent AVOD (because tablets are PITA to use in flight) and I'm happy as a pig in slop. The meal to me is no different that a Burger King meal.

This is the industry, all US major airlines. No one at AA is going to change that. Complaining on FT isn't going to change it. And we certainly aren't going back to the golden days of flying. If the FA is that miserable in life not my issue or problem. After living in Manhattan for 17 years I learned how to tune most people out, including less than happy FAs.

My experience has been similar. I feel that LAA FA's have been a mixed bag for decades.
The new hires a few years ago were certainly a breath of fresh air and the LHP FA's were another needed breath of fresh air.

consider yourself lucky. I am not high maintenance or demanding in the least bit. I don't mind lackluster service. What I do mind, and see (more than occasionally) on AA long haul, is nasty and rude F/A's.

Heres the problem, surly FAs and ...... service tend to go together. I don't care if they smile or not, but I do care if I dont get any service/refills at all or get eyes rolled at if I ask for something.

I've been at an Elite of various levels at AA since 2003. In the premium cabin I've never had a FA refuse me a refill (yes many FAs aren't very attentive) and I've never had one roll their eyes at me. I've had FAs in their 70s to a young FA working the F cabin for her first time. I just do not believe this hyperbole that there are FAs in the premium cabin that purposely won't take your food or beverage order, won't give you a refill (provided it's not shortly before landing) and snarl/roll their eyes if you make a reasonable request. Yes lots of AA FAs won't do PDBs, some are surly and hate their job (at least the part dealing with paxs) and some are down right lazy. Including and especially the younger ones.

But given all of AA's real deficiencies (inability to operate with banked hubs, inability to clearly communicate delays or post reasonable times, shoving more seats into Y while announcing plans to rip out AVOD, etc.) FAs are way down on my list. Most have been very good (including in Y when the service just by nature lacks), some are average, a smaller number below average and relatively few bottom of the barrel. In 16 years flying with AA I've never had a FA so bad I would even remotely consider writing AA.

Believe it. I have experienced it several times. You go on to say that "some are surly and hate their job". These are the ones that should not have this job. You pay good money to travel in J, and surly employees doesn't bother you in the least? No customer, in any class of travel, should have to put up with that crap. And AA is powerless to do anything about it.

There is an axiom in life that you get what you tolerate. Sadly for those of us over the age of 50 its a brand new world. Suddenly the world in which we were raised is obsolete. Respect, Patience, Manners have all flown out the door and its up to us to PIVOT and accept things and behaviors that were appalling when we were being raised. I see it in my own kids. I'm an outlier in demanding respect etc. I've found that if you treat people the way you want to be treated, they will usually treat you the same. This attitude doesn't permeate the fabric of our society today, so its rare to see it
Poor service is tolerated because to ..... about it, gets you arrested LOL
In the end, we can speak volumes by our money. That axiom still exists, "money talks, bs walks." For me, AA is convenient to where I want to go. When it stops becoming that or the rules to maintain status worsen, I can go back to UA where I"m lifetime Platinum. Hopefully one day the pendulum will swing closer to the middle and we will treat each other with courtesy and respect. Until then we can all ..... on the forum just like I am.

No I've come to the conclusion it's part of the travel experience. Just like when people bring their rotten behaving children into the AC. Or some moron (usually seated in F) stands in the aisle blocking the entire boarding process. Or I land at MIA, just want to get home and we sit 30 minutes plus waiting for a gate. Like I said lots more that could piss me off than some FA mad at the world for whatever reason.

On the flip side I've had some FAs do some amazing things for me. Give me a goodie bag to go (or a bottle of wine which I assume is against the rules), ask me about my job and life, thank me personally for my business. I'm assuming bottom of the barrel FAs can be found at every US domestic airline. Even airlines known for their customer service such as B6 and WN have them. Years back some FA at B6 flipped out. As the a/c approached the gate he grabbed a six pack of beer, pulled the emergency shot, slide down and took off in the airport.

Like I said if you want to volunteer to give up your J seat so that a mystery shopper can ride along and ferret out those few bad apples be my guest. I'll take my upgrade and deal with a surly FA from time to time. How exactly should AA get rid of these so called evil FAs? Someone complains and they are instantly fired? Given the way some paxs act I don't blame the way they come off at times.

If someone is constantly dealing with so many so called bad apples I have to wonder if it's the pax or the FA. Again, as someone that has no issue expressing his anger I've never remotely thought about lodging a formal complaint against a FA.

Well I've been an elite since 1992 and I can tell you that I've seen it all. Good, bad and horrendous. Who said the FAs refused to take my order? They just walked by me- twice. When I said excuse me they were already long gone... and when I confronted them I got the nasty stare... And throughout the whole flight it was the same thing....rushing through the cabin for everything... I have food on my plate and I'm eating and they have their hand on my tray to take it away... Plus a purser who was constantly making long-winded aggressive announcements with endless unnecessary commentary. I don't want fake smiles. I want professionalism and common courtesy.

If you don't care about it then fine, good for you. But 5 pages later you can see that a) lots of other people have had similar experiences and b) they DO see it as a problem.

Because in posting on FT since 2005 I've come to realize lots of people here somehow think AA can (and would) bring back the glory days of flying. I watch YouTube videos flying from the 1960s and sans the smoking I think what a treat that must have been. Today if your flying Y it's a tab above the NYC subway, J maybe Metro North. You had a FA that threw you attitude and liked making announcements. At least in J you get noise cancelling headsets. I've had a few FA give me attitude and I usually just laugh at them (because in the grand scheme of things they are nobodies) and if their life is that miserable I feel sorry for them. They should experience some real tragedy in life (like I have).

Who's asking for glory days? All that is being sought is a reasonable level of professionalism.

Again, this is your criteria. A very unique personal criteria.

I simply expect people to do a decent job at their.... job. Its not rocket science, or expecting some "glory days". If a Courtyard or Towne Place Marriott can give a consistently better experience, why can't American Airlines manage in International J?

it is on AA, much more than any of the other airlines I do business with

In that scenario you may be right. If the premium cabin is a free upgrade....it beats the alternative any day. But as a paying J/F flyer i find it unacceptable.

IMO a FA can only reasonably care about me as much as I care about them: we owe each other basic human respect and courtesy, but...I don't know the person and they don't know me. I've flown first class to Asia where the FAs do a great job of providing service and acting concerned, but I was never sucked so far into the fantasy that I believed they really did care. It doesn't bother me one bit to not have that feigned-concern as long as the service (the tangible bit) is good.

In the above, you aren't demanding respect. You're earning it.

I'm sorry I just don't believe that if the FA skipped over you and if you said excuse me miss/sir but you forgot to take my order they'd roll their eyes. Possibly if they asked and you were so engrossed in something you ignored their original request. I certainly don't see a FA grabbing the plate away from you with fork and knife still in hand. Sure if you're slowly eating (as I do because flying is the only time I ever seem to eat a meal slowly) they might think you're done. Simply say "oh I'm still working on that."

I find that if you treat the FAs well and professionally (they are not flying waitresses) they're treat you right. Sure some are not much into their job, might even hate their job. Those kind of people are everywhere in every profession. BTW most flight crew have no clue who is upgraded or paid and they really don't care. They know what the service is for a premium cabin for a particular flight, what the Y service is. Sometimes you get service plus, sometimes you barely get the service. I've seen grannies hustle up and down Y constantly offering drink refills and even seconds on snacks. I've seen 20 somethings have no interest in anything other than their phone.

I've seen sometimes how FAs get treated in the premium cabins. I've seen FAs ask for desired beverage or meal choice only to be barked at by some DYKWIA type. If I had to put up with what they put up I'd might be a bit surly too. Of course management shoving more seats into the a/c making sure that each seat has a butt then finding a way to charge for everything makes the experience like ridding the NYC subway at 5PM.

It sounds like a nice world you live in. Wish it wasn't mostly fantasy. I get where you are coming from, but having experienced some of this on AA myself I have to say that I simply don't believe your disbelief. A classic bit of clinging to a fantasy world against mountains of real experiences.

Ummm... alrighty then....

How are you so unequivocally certain they haven't? :rolleyes:

Why don't you put the shovel down and take a breath for a little while?

Regards

You need to get off your high horse and see what other FT’ers have written the state of affairs on AA. This isn’t an isolated incident. And since on the routes below AA is not price competitive in F or J with their OW counterparts (CX and BA) why would anyone ever pay AA money for international J or F on these routes? Have you extensively flown carriers from other countries? It’s not even in the same universe as AA. You are right, AA is like a bus or subway and international carriers are like, flying!
AA 193 (LAX-HKG) entire F cabin IFE non-functional (compensation for flight issues)
Best way to report FA in F, HKG-DFW
Flight attendant fills overhead bin with personal items, rude to passenger
HKG - LAX: Incredibly Rude FA, J Pax offloads himself!
Review: American Airlines First Class 777-300ER Los Angeles To London

And now you're suggesting I contributed to it or didn't handle the situation properly. Listen, I have traveled over 10 million miles all over the world for the past 30 years. I also have a good upbringing and treat people with deference and respect.

It's actually humorous that you find it totally unfathomable that something like that could happen on AA, or anywhere. Well, hate to break it to you- it did. And it does. As some other folks have said- it might be time for you to get your passport out and try some foreign carriers to see how the real world treats customers.

You really are an endless source of self-righteous, condescending nonsense.

You really don't get it. Who's calling for a return to anything? I'm sure there were some winners back then too.

"In the grand scheme of things they're nobodies".

Wow. Well, that sums up your character and value system.

A great way to see others. Sad actually.

Interesting discussion. I travel a lot internationally, usually in F or Business. My negative experience on AA match what as been described here. AA has some good FAs, but most and especially on international flights are just dreadful. I just got off a few Air China flight. Pleasant experience. Nice attendants. Edible food. And Air China is nowhere near the top of the list of international airlines.
I am lucky since I don't need to travel much in the US any more and have a choice of much better airlines than AA for most of my trips. I feel sorry for the posters here who are stuck with AA or most other US airlines.
And I am amazed that people here defend AA. Looks like they have never experienced serice on a good airline.

What class.

I really agree with this. US airlines seem to cycle up and down and right now for whatever reason AA is at the low end. At least I hope it is the low end and they will start to improve from here. I don't get the impression that DL or UA FAs feel they are immune from negative feedback if customers write in to complain about them, quite the opposite in fact. And both airlines seem to have been able to instill a sense of pride in their FAs toward their work and airline. AA is just not at this level. Some AA FAs are good but too many seem to be hoping for a quick flight where no one will ask them for anything and they are not required to do anything other perfunctorily performing their duties.

That's essentially what I consider genuine concern. An employee should be concerned that their customers are happy. I don't really mean genuine concern, if that makes sense. :)

Less than enthusiastic FAs are nothing new at AA. They'be been around for years. Nothing unique about this, I see consultants that should have left the industry years ago. Like FAs for whatever reason they stay in a job that makes them miserable.

I also see young FAs that are already miserable and if they stay with the job are only going to get worst. Yes AA seems to need to do a better job in recruiting FAs that can withstand the vigor, hassle and stress of the job over time.

However, I don't see FA proactively removing ill tempered FAs, particularly since it's not the easiest objective thing to do. Look at most flyers. So engrossed in their screen they wouldn't give a rat's behind of whether the FA was a saint or the recreation of the devil himself. Complaining isn't going to get you anywhere. Writing posts on FT certainly isn't going to get you anywhere.

If you believe DL and UA don't have these snarling, unprofessional, careless FAs then by all means take your business there. My assumption is that the same kind of FAs are also present at both those airlines (as well as other US airlines). Or accept that from time to time you're going to get a less than stellar FA, maybe down right combative but move onto more worrisome issues in life. Miserable FAs are way, way down my list of concerns.

Yes they are, but far fewer of them.

I bet that DL and UA's respective mergers, contracts, etc went smoother than US/AA's is probably a contributing factor.

UA most certainly did not. For all my gripes with Parker, at least he isnt Smisek.

Last week is was flying DL in J TATL. I got up to go to the bathroom and passed a FA absorbed in busily texting and thought "it's not just AA". When I left the bathroom, she stopped texting, smiled nicely and asked if there was anything I needed.

It was probably because it was just one flush.

If it were two, this story might have played out differently.

good point.

That and on the scale of 1 to tan, how brown was the flushing party. :D

+1. I think newyorkgeorge has low expectations/standards because they are getting a "free" upgrade. When you pay for J, your expectations tend to increase.