Drunk passengers in emergency / exit seats
Apr 30, 2019, 1:16 pm
#61
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Las Vegas
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I was under the impression that flights in the US had no requirement that the exit rows be occupied for take off and landing? It seems rather bizarre, to me at least, that from a safety perspective it's perfectly ok to have no one in an exit row at all whereas if the exit row is occupied then there are specific requirements for those passengers who are seated there.
In the link posted above (https://www.law.cornell.edu/cfr/text/14/121.585) I don't see anything that specifically says that exit row passengers can't be inebriated (either when they board or as a result of consuming alcoholic beverages on board). The requirements are more geared to the physical condition of the passenger and their ability to understand commands from the crew. That said, there's probably enough leeway in interpretation to include being off one's face as a reason to ask a passenger to move
As for speaking up, I twice had occasion on a single flight to tell the FAs that two passengers in front of me weren't wearing seat belts (because they didn't fit, and they hadn't asked for extenders) but nothing was done. When I was disembarking I spoke directly to the Captain and told him what had happened. He was less than happy and stated he'd speak to the crew about it.
In terms of drunk passengers being denied boarding, I saw it once in SJC where a very drunk and tearful passenger was being spoken to by police as she'd been denied boarding on a flight to LAS. I am not sure whether her tears were because she'd been denied boarding per se or because her boyfriend hadn't, he'd ditched her at the gate, and flown to LAS on his own
In the link posted above (https://www.law.cornell.edu/cfr/text/14/121.585) I don't see anything that specifically says that exit row passengers can't be inebriated (either when they board or as a result of consuming alcoholic beverages on board). The requirements are more geared to the physical condition of the passenger and their ability to understand commands from the crew. That said, there's probably enough leeway in interpretation to include being off one's face as a reason to ask a passenger to move
As for speaking up, I twice had occasion on a single flight to tell the FAs that two passengers in front of me weren't wearing seat belts (because they didn't fit, and they hadn't asked for extenders) but nothing was done. When I was disembarking I spoke directly to the Captain and told him what had happened. He was less than happy and stated he'd speak to the crew about it.
In terms of drunk passengers being denied boarding, I saw it once in SJC where a very drunk and tearful passenger was being spoken to by police as she'd been denied boarding on a flight to LAS. I am not sure whether her tears were because she'd been denied boarding per se or because her boyfriend hadn't, he'd ditched her at the gate, and flown to LAS on his own
Apr 30, 2019, 2:16 pm
#62
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I wasn't at the Kennedy Assassination but can make some logical inferences.
I just find it hard to believe that if they were so drunk and useless that none of the FAs they interacted with - at the gate, boarding, on the plane, etc. - intervened or said anything. Especially considering exit row pax are forced to have affirmative interactions with FAs during the process. So either several employees negligently allowed dangerously drunk pax to sit in the exit row seats...or, the OP is exaggerating a bit. My $$ is on the latter. Maybe they were buzzed and having too good a time and the OP needs to lighten up? Also, the passengers probably most affected by poor behavior would be the ones directly next to them or in front (depending on plane config) and no one else complained or brought up the issue? No one AT ALL said anything about these dangerously out of control drunkards who were so obnoxiously drunk that they were a threat to human safety? I don't like victim blaming but, after adding the compensation admission, the whole thing feels thin.
I just find it hard to believe that if they were so drunk and useless that none of the FAs they interacted with - at the gate, boarding, on the plane, etc. - intervened or said anything. Especially considering exit row pax are forced to have affirmative interactions with FAs during the process. So either several employees negligently allowed dangerously drunk pax to sit in the exit row seats...or, the OP is exaggerating a bit. My $$ is on the latter. Maybe they were buzzed and having too good a time and the OP needs to lighten up? Also, the passengers probably most affected by poor behavior would be the ones directly next to them or in front (depending on plane config) and no one else complained or brought up the issue? No one AT ALL said anything about these dangerously out of control drunkards who were so obnoxiously drunk that they were a threat to human safety? I don't like victim blaming but, after adding the compensation admission, the whole thing feels thin.
Apr 30, 2019, 4:23 pm
#63
Join Date: Nov 2011
Posts: 2
I have a ribbon for you for compensation... I mean really like what anguish could you have possibly experienced that justified compensation.
I am all about people getting fairly compensated but you made it to your destination in time. Trust me if your max jet crashed that honeymoon couple was going out with a smile on their face. The chance of something happening to you was like your chance of winning it big in the lottery.
Now stop mooching and contribute something with merit...
I am all about people getting fairly compensated but you made it to your destination in time. Trust me if your max jet crashed that honeymoon couple was going out with a smile on their face. The chance of something happening to you was like your chance of winning it big in the lottery.
Now stop mooching and contribute something with merit...
Apr 30, 2019, 4:53 pm
#64
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As for speaking up, I twice had occasion on a single flight to tell the FAs that two passengers in front of me weren't wearing seat belts (because they didn't fit, and they hadn't asked for extenders) but nothing was done. When I was disembarking I spoke directly to the Captain and told him what had happened. He was less than happy and stated he'd speak to the crew about it.
Perhaps a better question in the context of this thread... has anyone ever had a negative safety-related outcome due to exit row passengers over-indulging? Were you personally harmed in some way as a result of the flight crew's "negligence?" No wonder AA Customer Relations responds with so many generic form letters if they have to weed through complaints like this to get to the legitimate ones.
Apr 30, 2019, 5:52 pm
#65
Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: SEA
Programs: AS MVPG & BoardRoom
Posts: 289
No you don’t deserve a compensation.
That is ridiculous.
Yes the FA should have done something to remove the couple from the Exit Row seats and at a minimum, cut off their alcohol.
Yes you should have made a complaint to the FA.
Yes other pax should have made a complaint if bothered as you suggest.
Yes you should have used your cell phone to capture video to validate your description. This is 2019 after all.
I always fly Exit Row. I am a firefighter. I always wonder how many seatmates have chosen Exit Row to assist in an emergency vs just profiting from extra leg room and first one out the door to safety in emergency.
That is ridiculous.
Yes the FA should have done something to remove the couple from the Exit Row seats and at a minimum, cut off their alcohol.
Yes you should have made a complaint to the FA.
Yes other pax should have made a complaint if bothered as you suggest.
Yes you should have used your cell phone to capture video to validate your description. This is 2019 after all.
I always fly Exit Row. I am a firefighter. I always wonder how many seatmates have chosen Exit Row to assist in an emergency vs just profiting from extra leg room and first one out the door to safety in emergency.
Apr 30, 2019, 5:57 pm
#66
Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: SEA
Programs: AS MVPG & BoardRoom
Posts: 289
Unless someone was reeking for alcohol or being loud I'd doubt that I know whether they were buzzed or not. A couple of years ago on a morning MIA/CLT flight in F a FA told a pax that he was cut off because she didn't know whether he'd when he would be driving (he'd probably down about 5-6 drinks within one hour). The pax in a defensive way told the FA he wasn't driving, someone was picking him up from the airport, so she served him one more. Ultimately, the interaction with paxs, particularly in Y, comes down to a matter of seconds. Unless that person smells like a brewery or is acting outwardly drunk (loud behavior, falling all over the place) chances are they won't know. Not to mention if there is an emergency that "buzz" tends to evaporate real quick. I've show up to the gate feeling a bit "tipsy" from the AC but not overly intoxicated and then an announcement that the a/c was on a maintenance delay and that the mechanics were determined if the a/c would go out of service immediately "sobered me up."
Yes, the FA would know.
Yes, the airline could be named in a lawsuit by the victims or their loved ones should that pax have left the airport as the operator of a motor vehicle. (No different than a bar or restaurant).
The FA should have cut them off sooner and stood by the decision to not serve another rather than giving in.
Your admittance you would not be able to recognize an individual under the influence has zero relevance.
Last edited by arcticflier; Apr 30, 2019 at 6:07 pm
Apr 30, 2019, 6:06 pm
#67
Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: SEA
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As for speaking up, I twice had occasion on a single flight to tell the FAs that two passengers in front of me weren't wearing seat belts (because they didn't fit, and they hadn't asked for extenders) but nothing was done. When I was disembarking I spoke directly to the Captain and told him what had happened.
Apr 30, 2019, 10:21 pm
#68
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Apr 30, 2019, 11:35 pm
#70
Join Date: Sep 2014
Location: YEG
Programs: Table scraps from Aeroplan and AmEx Plat
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WOW. Ageism at all? Keep that comment in memory for when you attain the ripe "old" age of 70 and people half your age with half your experience and abilities start to question your abilities. Because...ageism. Too bad Richard Branson isn't on this thread. He might have something to say about that comment.
Many, and I would venture a guess most, of the people in that age group are not particularly well versed with things Internet. My own mother is only a year older than the gentleman, and despite having a degree in CS and being a computer programmer for decades is one of those people. She happened to leave that line of work around the time graphical user interface became the norm in personal computers and I suppose she never caught up.
In closing, lighten the hell up.
Mods, apologies if my language crossed a line.
May 1, 2019, 10:00 am
#72
Join Date: Feb 2010
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TODAY with the political, social environment we live i (how active are teachers / parents in building up character ?) the motto should be
"SEE SOMETHING, SAY SOMETHING"!
May 1, 2019, 10:18 am
#73
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: San Francisco, CA
Programs: US CP, *wood Gold, Marriott gold, Hilton something
Posts: 1,458
Here's a thought to contemplate, there's a difference between:
I feel unsafe and they were too drunk.
One is something one personally feels and can chose to act on, or not. The other is a judgment about someone else's behavior and circumstances.
Certainly, there's something to be said about the behaviors of others when they affect the whole tribe. But I still think that can start with I feel unsafe, so I'm going to ask to deplane and explain to a FA why I feel unsafe.
Taken to the extreme, do FAs have an obligation to quiet screaming babies? If a baby is screaming and I can't hear the emergency instructions, am I at risk? Is the parent liable? ... personally, I have to remind myself that I'm the one reacting to the baby's screams and I can chose to ignore it, get mad about it, celebrate those little lungs.... (I have great headphones, this is an entirely made up example, but it illustrates the point that if I feel something I get to chose how to respond or not. I don't think it's an FA's responsibility to quell my discomfort).
I'm only replying and offering because I've found this framework helpful in my life for reducing inner conflict.
I feel unsafe and they were too drunk.
One is something one personally feels and can chose to act on, or not. The other is a judgment about someone else's behavior and circumstances.
Certainly, there's something to be said about the behaviors of others when they affect the whole tribe. But I still think that can start with I feel unsafe, so I'm going to ask to deplane and explain to a FA why I feel unsafe.
Taken to the extreme, do FAs have an obligation to quiet screaming babies? If a baby is screaming and I can't hear the emergency instructions, am I at risk? Is the parent liable? ... personally, I have to remind myself that I'm the one reacting to the baby's screams and I can chose to ignore it, get mad about it, celebrate those little lungs.... (I have great headphones, this is an entirely made up example
, but it illustrates the point that if I feel something I get to chose how to respond or not. I don't think it's an FA's responsibility to quell my discomfort). I'm only replying and offering because I've found this framework helpful in my life for reducing inner conflict.
May 1, 2019, 11:42 am
#74
Join Date: Jan 2010
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Having had the wonderful opportunity to have met JDiver in person (at an AA gate when I was leaving on the launch flight of the first 777-300ER), I can say that you'd never guess his age in person and he also has some mad forum moderating skills as well. IMHO he's one of the top if the not the top moderator here on FlyerTalk.
