wise2u

I could do without the rolleyes and thumbsdown attitude from an obvious AA fan, but you basically got it. I apologise if the word "ripoff" is too strong for this situation. The fact that the site looks like the standard rez system used by DL and UA for their points for car rental deals, made me assume that it operated with the same basic terms, yes my stupidity for assuming. It is nonetheless deceptive to hide the excluded fees in a long list of fine print, instead of making the exclusion obvious on the booking page.
when booking through a car company you are given a total that includes a listing of taxes and fees (maybe not a full description, but at least a total amount) AA does not bother to include this on its site and fools people by claiming that booking is "paid in full".
I was just trying to use extra miles gained from the Citi promo that are above the amount needed for a Europe F ticket, so it really doesnt matter that much to me, as it still saves a few bucks. I just want to warn others who may be seeing this as a good way to spend some of their hard earned miles, and finding out the hard way, its not really worth it. It's more the principle of the thing, having no changes or refunds, and disclosure of major extra costs buried in fine print. Not everyone reads the entire T&C looking for gotchas before booking and they seem to count on that.
On a side note the fees change from what I get quoted most everytime I use Budget or Dollar or Enterprise....I am an infrequent renter, usually just for vacations. I bring a copy of the quoted fees and taxes to debate the new total offered by the counter people. who try to explain the difference with outright lies....one guy in Vegas told me it was the airport fee that wasnt included in my "estimated total" until I pointed out the airport fee on my itemized total of taxes and fees provided by his companies website when I booked...then he gave it to me for that price...after tying to sell me insurance of every kind. Hawaii is bad about that too, I bet 3 people renting the same car on the same day pay 3 different totals depending on where they booked and how greedy the counter person was at the time. Enterprise in tunica has 5 rental cars total and is the only rental car in the airport, they tried for 10 minutes to match the price i paid online (through their site) with their computer system (to print up a contract) and failed, so they gave me a rate for .72 more that included the extra insurance package that I usually decline thanks to AMEX and AAA...i told them close enough. It seems like they are all training to lease cars for a used car dealer, with all the switcheroos they pull. It might just be the low end companies that have these problems, but it seems strange that with as little as I rent I have to argue with the counter people to get the price quoted 5 out of 6 times.

brp

I agree with most of this. The fact that it is different from the rental system used by other airline sites is completely irrelevant. It supposes that people are familiar with those sites and would assume that AA is the same. Not relevant at all.

I agree that "ripoff" is too strong, but something like not including taxes, and not even being able to say how much they are, should be prominently indicated. Sure, it's fine to say that it's "in the fine print," but that's really not a good answer. No one should be expected to read the volume of legalese that they put in there about how it's your responsibility if your dog dies from carbon monoxide poisoning while in the car to find basic information like

Taxes and surcharges not included in mileage rental

When I rent things through other sites, this is boldly disclaimed so that I can actually see it.

So, sure it's not really a ripoff, and sure, it is "in there," but come on folks...this can be done better.

Cheers.

wise2u

I paid fewer miles, but excluded fees are still undisclosed and can't be known until I get to the pickup counter.
the fact that unknown taxes and fees are not included in miles price is disclosed, but buried over halfway down in a long list of fine print disclosures, far from the booking page, is sneaky.
The only disclosure/disclaimer in the fine print that is in bold type is the part about all transactions are non-refundable.
Not all people read the microprint and legalese before trading miles for something fairly standard like a car rental.....you can bet I will not fail to do so in the future, so I'm not fooled/ripped off by deceptive deals.

videomaker

Reading the fine print is always a good idea. But just because someone didn't, it doesn't mean the deal is deceptive.

zombietooth

+++

You wouldn't believe the deals I have been able to get with Hotwire. I don't do the prepaid ones because the dates of my business trips often change at the last minute, I just book the best deal available on the date that I start looking and then request the price drop update feature. For example, a one week rental in Denver of a full-sized SUV (a big one), went from 458- down to 236- AI by the time I made my last reservation, and it was with a major company, Thrifty.

brp

I do best with Priceline "Name Your Own Price." Still killed by the unavoidable taxes as our rentals tend to be short, but the daily rates are ridiculously low.

Cheers.

newbluesea

It does appear that "only obvious AA fans" have learned the use of paragraphs.

Anyone who rents cars more than a few times are fullly aware that the "added" charges varies with time of rental, station etc etc etc and is unlikely to be quoted definitively.
Even free days earned with rental companies do not include these charges so
I find it pretty hard to believe that cars rented via another airline program is all inclusive of the additional charges.

The ridiculous " greedy counter person" statement in itself is laughable.
Despite the attempt by some here to sit on the fence... the fact is the OP
seems not to understand how car rentals work.. hence the crux of this "problem"

JDiver

I've never been able to figure the fees and taxes until I know what car I am renting and the costs show up - some seem to be percentages of rental price, location, airport fees, etc. and others are flat fees iirc, without even mentioning SLI, LIS, PAI, PEC, CDW and LDW rubbish - like the so-called:

Airport concession fee recovery
Cust facility charge & veh license fee recovery
Rental Surcharge
Frequent Flyer Surcharge
PlatePass and PlatePass service charge
Taxes

So, I can understand why one can not know the total soak, er, charges until the rental is decided on anyway. AA has chosen a market trick - fewer miles, but the difference is the driver/ renter absorbs the fees and taxes. Typical caveat emptor situation - and now the rental outfits are taking a page from the hotels and airlines by offering (nonrefundable) advance purchase rentals as well.

Ripoff? Not in my opinion - just one more issue where one has to make an informed choice. A ripoff is best reserved for when one turns in a rental car and gets charged for existing or non-existent damage, etc. (The "loss of use" free charged when a vehicle is damaged and they give the car liberal doses of "sunshine maintenance" to justify a higher "loss of use" fee.)

Yeah, semantics... and in my opinion car retnal companies are among the ultimate of scamming, wallet-sucking fee-passing con artists - if AA charged like an automobile rental company, we'd also have (in addition to all the existing fees):

$18.86 Airport gate and counter fee
$6.00 LAX surcharge
$2.00 Tires and replaceables
$1.80 Aircraft License Fee
$4.00 A, B and C check fees

(Thankfully, most business include various costs in their markup, and not as add-ons to make their offering price appear lower than the competition.)

OT: useful tips page for those not renting cars frequently <link>

brp

If I rent a car from a car rental company or a site like Priceline, the exact charge is displayed before I have to commit to the rental. This assumes that I adhere to the rental length specified, of course,and don't do things like pre-pay gas or add insurance. They are able to quote definitively based on the parameters I enter. Always.

Sure, if I specify a 2-day rental and keep it for a week, the charges are different...but that's not what we're talking about here.

Still, ripoff? Gimme a break.

Cheers.

Happy

Exactly!

Personally I would not use such programs because most of the time they are not bargains. However, that does not make me call it a Ripoff. You have been provided the program rules which enable you to make an educated choice.

One can argue that the tax and fees are not included should be more prominently displayed, but as a consumer it is always a good idea to make sure than simply assume this works the same as other programs...

Had the OP not used the word Ripoff, he would get my sympathy. By using the word Ripoff and the word Deceptive as excuses for his failure to go over Ts and Cs of the program, OP just shows that he does not want to take responsibility, and only want to lay blame on others once he finds out the program operates differently from other airlines programs.

Seriously, common sense would tell you to ask. "This seems too much disparity compares to the program of DL and UA - where is the catch? Is everything included?" That would be a reasonable next step. Instead of trying to find out more, OP grabbed it as it is such a "bargain" then later cried Foul that he was being ripped off... Gimme a break.

Happy

Heck, even the same station the taxes and fees still vary every time both by percentage term and by absolute $ line item amount.

We rent from the same Budget In-Town location several times a year for one-way rental to drop off it either at FLL or at MIA, and vice versa. The taxes and fees never be the same, particularly a mysterious $2ish fee seems to relate to government - sometimes it popped up sometimes it didn't, for the identical A to B or B to A rental. Should I call this Ripoff by the county or state?

Bacai

Not with Delta miles.

gemac

I knew that taxes weren't included the day that AA announced this new program, and I have never been to the website. I learned about it here on FT. Lack of knowledge coupled with lack of care is almost always expensive in life, and as life's lessons go this one was pretty cheap for you.

rasheed

I have posted my experience here.

http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/other...l#post15465586

However, it was very clear that taxes were not included and AA support actually helped me 'guesstimate' what they might be using both her AAVacations system and the rental car agency retail website.

Rasheed

stinkycop

I need to rent a min van in Hawaii ffom 4/1 to 4/8. Total cost is $556. Or I could cash in 35K in miles. Maybe some of you more veterans flyers could tell me if this is a good deal or not.