skylady

Not sure where I got this from, but was thinking the empty tanks were the 2 she may have preordered and was using for the flight. The onboard emergency tanks, as well as the defibrillator, are checked before each and every flight. If there were actually 2 bad tanks and a bad AED,before boarding, then somebody will definitely be in hot water.

skywalkerLAX

Well, it might be because AA refused to comment the equipment problem

Most likely this empty oxygen tank (in case all the assumptions are correct) will cost AA more than equipping the whole fleet with brand-new ones !

skylady

It is possible that AA doesn't have all the facts, as do we. We can assume all we want. Speculation and assumption is par for the course, but never a reality.

ninerfan

I am not positive but doesn't a doctor have to prescribe o2? Just wondering.

I know there were doctors on board but I wonder if the FA is allowed to give out o2 ?

videomaker

Though this thread title--Passenger dies due to lack of oxygen on AA flight--is jumping to conclusions. I don't see where it's been determined that the lack of oxygen was what caused her death--that certainly wasn't the headline in the NYT article that was linked.

brp

Perfectly reasonable statement, IMO. We have no idea what the facts are, yet many are jumping conclusions. It certainly seems that, at the least, AA did not handle this well and, at the most, they were seriously negligent. But we don't have enough info to know where in that continuum things really lie.


Cheers.

skylady

Yes, FAs are allowed to administer O2. We cover this extensively in training each year. This is why I may question why an FA would possibly say no to giving a pax O2. Doesn't cost us a thing, and may save a life. The story needs some unemotional facts to be taken as fact.

skylady

If it wasn't inflammatory, we would not have clicked on it! The truth will win out in the end. Not to mention there are many more than just 2 O2 containers onboard. I just cannot imagine any {insert nasty adjective} FA saying no to a dying woman's request for oxygen.

FMNTG-37

This is my Intepretation from my Manual.

There is Six Criteria For a F/A to be permitted to Administer Oxygen to Pax in Apparant Distress. We do have our oxygen parameters. I will not post these out of the Manual, at this time, as this looks like a "situation." If the situation warrants f/a's are trained on the AED's.

If the emergency "situation" doesn't meet the Criteria, that's why we are able to page Qualified Health Professionals. They are ask to volunteer, verified and noted as qualified. They are the ones that will use the Medical Kit and make decisions in conjunction with our trained medical professionals via cocpit to ground.

(With prior warning of problem. PAX's may bring on their own oxygen, Dr.'s note, etc. and we follow the guideline and policies previously set by AA Medical Standards./Personnel, Dr.'s Advice. All handled before flight and ordered. To set-up and assist. Different scenario.)


A most unfortuante situation.

My views are my own, not a reflection of AA. My interpretation of manual/training.

markryanmiller

The article mentioned that when they did try to give oxygen to the passenger, the tanks they had were empty. This is a tragic situation whatever the circumstances. Would it be normal for a plane to carry empty oxygen tanks?

I don't mean this to sound insensitive in any way. I'd just like to educate myself better as to what is normal procedure.

eoinnz

Oxygen tanks don't have to be full before departure, there just has to be a minimum number of full tanks. Since most aircraft carry more than required they can use them without delaying the aircraft at it's next port. Of course if the aircraft was under the minimum, it would have to wait for the required number of full tanks before it departs. But all the tanks have gauges, so it seems strange that the FA would grab an empty tank. The FA should of moved to the next full tank which there would of been somewhere.

The AED would of been functioning - these are checked before every flight and the aircraft CANNOT depart without a functioning unit. The AED didn't administer a shock, not because it was faulty, but because the passenger was probably already asystole (flat line) and the AED doesn't shock in this state (which of course to someone unfamiliar with an AED could appear like it's not working)

SchmeckFlyer

The article was fairly clear she was short of breath, and given the acute onset and rapid deterioration, had she been administered oxygen she might have made it long enough to reach a hospital in Miami.

It's not really the fault of the FAs (they are not trained medical professionals) but if an older person is clearly short of breath (sitting in a seat) denying oxygen seems silly. Empty oxygen canisters and malfunctioning defibrilators, however, is pretty pathetic and negligent. What are FAs expected to do if there is a loss of cabin pressure and they need to walk around the aircraft for whatever reason?

The details in the article are obviously limited and not check. But it also mentioned she had had heart trouble. If she had suffered a heart attack and/or developed a rhyme dysfunction, she would not have been able to effectively deliver oxygen to her tissues. Administering oxygen helps to compensate to a certain degree and can give enough time to get to an ER. She might also have thrown a clot and developed a lung embolus, in which case oxygen would definately have helped.

eoinnz

Empty oxygen canisters are common on aircraft, as long as there are a minimum number of full tanks the aircraft can fly. Though it is odd the FA went to 2 empty tanks since they most likely have gauges on them.

The AED (Defibrillator) was most likely not faulty, but because the AED didn't shock, would of been interpreted that way by someone unfamiliar with how an AED works. The AED is completely automated and has no human decision if a shock is given or not. The AED only shocks if the heart is in one of 2 states. By the time the AED was used the passenger was probably asystole in which case the AED won't shock and advise to continue CPR. Aircraft cannot depart without an operating AED which is check before every flight.

If there was a loss of cabin pressure, cabin crew won't be walking round. They'll be seated ASAP, wedged between seats or whatever getting the nearest mask, because at a cruising altitude of 37000FT, you have about 20 seconds before you pass out. Only when the aircraft is at a safe altitude and determined by the captain, will cabin crew be able to walk around, in which case there is sufficient air to breathe without a mask, but crew will use a tank at this point when checking the cabin.

havetoshop

What I do not understand is that they flew to NY with the body on the floor after landing in Miami. How was that allowed?

Someone died on an AA flight I was on in the 80's JFK-LAX they put us down in K.C. and we waited hours for first the city and then county coroner. They took the body off and we continued on.

eoinnz

The aircraft didn't divert after she had died.