Feb 14, 2013, 9:50 am
Last edit by: JDiver
MODERATOR GUIDEPOST
The AA - US merger was approved by AMR creditors and the boards of directors of both airlines on 13 Feb 2013, and announced the 14th.
There is no further speculation about whether the merger will occur; all that is pending is approval from the bankruptcy court and the regulatory authorities.
American Airlines and US Airways approve merger: just the facts, please outlines the facts we know;
AA - US Merger Agreement / Announcement Discussion (consolidated) is the thread for discussion of the announced merger.
The AA - US merger was approved by AMR creditors and the boards of directors of both airlines on 13 Feb 2013, and announced the 14th.
There is no further speculation about whether the merger will occur; all that is pending is approval from the bankruptcy court and the regulatory authorities.
American Airlines and US Airways approve merger: just the facts, please outlines the facts we know;
AA - US Merger Agreement / Announcement Discussion (consolidated) is the thread for discussion of the announced merger.
ARCHIVE: US LCC & AMR / AA Takeover / merger Rumors and Discussion (consolidated)
Jan 16, 2013, 12:36 am
#2836
Join Date: Jan 2013
Programs: AAdvantage Gold
Posts: 161
Hunh? JP Morgan Chase is HQ'd out of NYC with its retail and consumer out of Chicago. BofA is number two - but why does that really matter?
Wal-Mart is far larger, but Bentonville doesn't have an airport to speak of, and GE's nearest major airport is over an hour away from its headquarters, and closer to 2 hours to get to the NYC airports - IBM is in the same boat. Stamford, Connecticut has more financial workers than Charlotte does (and has the world's largest trading floor), and similarly has poor airport access.
Airports transport people who pay money, and just because somebody's company is headquartered somewhere only means that there are people there, not necessarily that there are more of them than somewhere else without a corporate HQ or anything else. It's why the Concorde was most profitable JFK/LHR as the only route with the necessary concentration of millionaires on either end that ran trans-oceanic to support the Concorde fleet; without that, the entire fleet became unprofitable.
Wal-Mart is far larger, but Bentonville doesn't have an airport to speak of, and GE's nearest major airport is over an hour away from its headquarters, and closer to 2 hours to get to the NYC airports - IBM is in the same boat. Stamford, Connecticut has more financial workers than Charlotte does (and has the world's largest trading floor), and similarly has poor airport access.
Airports transport people who pay money, and just because somebody's company is headquartered somewhere only means that there are people there, not necessarily that there are more of them than somewhere else without a corporate HQ or anything else. It's why the Concorde was most profitable JFK/LHR as the only route with the necessary concentration of millionaires on either end that ran trans-oceanic to support the Concorde fleet; without that, the entire fleet became unprofitable.
Jan 16, 2013, 6:01 am
#2837
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: SLC
Programs: AA EXP, Marriott Plat
Posts: 616
CLT does have something really big coming its way that no other airport can claim. CLT has just sign Honey Boo Bo as its goodwill ambassador to travelers. Big score CLT!
Jan 16, 2013, 6:20 am
#2838
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: JFK, DCA, BUR, YVR
Programs: AC, AS, BA, DL, HH (D), MR (T/LTP), UA (*S), UScAAre (PLT/1,87MM), WN
Posts: 5,207
Jan 16, 2013, 6:23 am
#2839
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: NYC
Programs: AA EXP, B6 Mosaic, UA Platinum, others
Posts: 1,270
CX has their flight in the late evening and gets in early morning. But, most flights to HKG from the US leave morning to mid-day and arrive in the early evening in HKG. You can still make connections in the evening bank of CX flights, but for the significant bunch of people going to HKG, that's way easier than going to LAX at 2am... and think of the return flight...
Jan 16, 2013, 7:51 am
#2840
Suspended
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: London
Programs: BA GGL, AA 1MM LT GLD, SPG PLAT, National Exec Selc, Hilton Diamond, Hyatt Plat, Marriott Silver
Posts: 8,278
Why on earth would that be natural? Because AA is naturally stupid?
CX has their flight in the late evening and gets in early morning. But, most flights to HKG from the US leave morning to mid-day and arrive in the early evening in HKG. You can still make connections in the evening bank of CX flights, but for the significant bunch of people going to HKG, that's way easier than going to LAX at 2am... and think of the return flight...
CX has their flight in the late evening and gets in early morning. But, most flights to HKG from the US leave morning to mid-day and arrive in the early evening in HKG. You can still make connections in the evening bank of CX flights, but for the significant bunch of people going to HKG, that's way easier than going to LAX at 2am... and think of the return flight...
From JFK - same thing 2 of CX's 4 JFK-HKG (one being the YVR stopover) are evening departures arriving in the early morning.
From SFO, 2 of the 4 departures (2x CX, 1x SQ, 1x UA) are evening departure, arriving in the morning.
Different people have different needs/preferences. But a significant portion of US-HKG travel is on these midnight departures. Not sure you can say "most" are day flights.
Jan 16, 2013, 8:12 am
#2841
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: ORD / MDW / FLL
Programs: DL DM/1MM, AA EXP, SPG Platinum, Hyatt Platinum, Marriott Platinum
Posts: 2,295
1. It is a fortress hub where US controls over 90% of the total traffic.
2. It is a logical connecting point for north-south traffic on the east coast
3. It is a logical east-west connecting point for the southeast
4. It is growing it's TATL and South American route network
5. CLT is one of the largest financial centers in US outside of NY
6. Region is in massive growth mode (still)
I'm not sure how one could compare CLT to MEM or to think that CLT is a redundant hub to any of AA's hubs but I'd be curious to hear your opinion.
Jan 16, 2013, 8:26 am
#2842
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: SLC
Programs: AA EXP, Marriott Plat
Posts: 616
I really think you may be missing a firm understanding of the economics over at US. The irrelevance of Honey Boo Boo aside, CLT is US's largest and most profitable hub.
1. It is a fortress hub where US controls over 90% of the total traffic.
2. It is a logical connecting point for north-south traffic on the east coast
3. It is a logical east-west connecting point for the southeast
4. It is growing it's TATL and South American route network
5. CLT is one of the largest financial centers in US outside of NY
6. Region is in massive growth mode (still)
I'm not sure how one could compare CLT to MEM or to think that CLT is a redundant hub to any of AA's hubs but I'd be curious to hear your opinion.
1. It is a fortress hub where US controls over 90% of the total traffic.
2. It is a logical connecting point for north-south traffic on the east coast
3. It is a logical east-west connecting point for the southeast
4. It is growing it's TATL and South American route network
5. CLT is one of the largest financial centers in US outside of NY
6. Region is in massive growth mode (still)
I'm not sure how one could compare CLT to MEM or to think that CLT is a redundant hub to any of AA's hubs but I'd be curious to hear your opinion.
" Birds of the same feather fly together"
I am sure NWA said the same about MEM, huge transportaion center (CLT shrinking finance center), feed the growing southeast, etc. We know what happened to MEM after Delta took control. A AMR/LCC marriage will have huge debt to pay and immediate pressure on near term results. This will mean CLT will be shrunk, DFW amd MIA will grow.
Jan 16, 2013, 8:31 am
#2843
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Rotterdam, The Netherlands
Posts: 655
Just announced: American made an operating profit of $ 494 million over 2012. Net loss over 2012 is nearly $ 2 billion. Revenue per seat-mile is up 1.6% and without the new CBA in place!
Hopefully this is a clear signal to the UCC: We don't need US Scareways!
Hopefully this is a clear signal to the UCC: We don't need US Scareways!
Jan 16, 2013, 8:48 am
#2844
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: NYC LAX RDU
Programs: US-Plt;Concierge key; American AAirpass; Delta Silver;Starwood - Platinum; Amex Cent
Posts: 710
Two notes- the Honey Boo Boo marketing campaign slogan at CLT may be something along the lines of:
" Birds of the same feather fly together"
I am sure NWA said the same about MEM, huge transportaion center (CLT shrinking finance center), feed the growing southeast, etc. We know what happened to MEM after Delta took control. A AMR/LCC marriage will have huge debt to pay and immediate pressure on near term results. This will mean CLT will be shrunk, DFW amd MIA will grow.
" Birds of the same feather fly together"
I am sure NWA said the same about MEM, huge transportaion center (CLT shrinking finance center), feed the growing southeast, etc. We know what happened to MEM after Delta took control. A AMR/LCC marriage will have huge debt to pay and immediate pressure on near term results. This will mean CLT will be shrunk, DFW amd MIA will grow.
Jan 16, 2013, 8:53 am
#2845
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: eastern Europe & NC
Posts: 4,527
+1
Why screw up a good thing with US' debt load and Parker's bribes to unions?
Why screw up a good thing with US' debt load and Parker's bribes to unions?
Jan 16, 2013, 10:43 am
#2846
Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: Dallas, TX USA
Posts: 2,118
To Central America, they appear to serve LIR, CZM and BZE nonstop from CLT, but only on weekends. CUN has 2 daily nonstops with some additional
service on weekends. MEX and SJO have one daily nonstop service each.
My guess is that with the exception of MEX and possibly SJO, these Central American flights are going to attract mainly low-yield leisure travelers and not the kind of high-yield business traffic that AA is going to be looking for to become more profitable.
Jan 16, 2013, 10:53 am
#2847
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: NYC LAX RDU
Programs: US-Plt;Concierge key; American AAirpass; Delta Silver;Starwood - Platinum; Amex Cent
Posts: 710
As best I can tell from the Route Map on the US Airways web site and ExpertFlyer, US operates exactly 1 nonstop flight per day from CLT to South America (GIG).
To Central America, they appear to serve LIR, CZM and BZE nonstop from CLT, but only on weekends. CUN has 2 daily nonstops with some additional
service on weekends. MEX and SJO have one daily nonstop service each.
My guess is that with the exception of MEX and possibly SJO, these Central American flights are going to attract mainly low-yield leisure travelers and not the kind of high-yield business traffic that AA is going to be looking for to become more profitable.
To Central America, they appear to serve LIR, CZM and BZE nonstop from CLT, but only on weekends. CUN has 2 daily nonstops with some additional
service on weekends. MEX and SJO have one daily nonstop service each.
My guess is that with the exception of MEX and possibly SJO, these Central American flights are going to attract mainly low-yield leisure travelers and not the kind of high-yield business traffic that AA is going to be looking for to become more profitable.
Do ba and aa share revenue on all European flights or just to lhr. How will ba feel about all of us' direct European flights out of Phl.
Jan 16, 2013, 10:55 am
#2848
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: May 2001
Location: LAX; AA EXP, MM; HH Gold
Posts: 31,789
I honestly can't tell what your point is with the above comment.
My point in mentioning a possible departure time for a hypothetical AA metal flight to HKG was to point out that AA's T-4 at LAX has lots of space to accommodate a flight to HKG, if it chose to start flying LAX-HKG. AA's T-4 is more crowded during the middle of the day.
I have no idea of the ideal departure time for that hypothetical flight from LAX to HKG. The dominant carrier in that market has two late evening departures and one afternoon departure.
With the news yesterday that US will be moving to T-3 so that WN can have T-1 all to itself, that opens up a widebody-capable gate or two if/when US and AA combine.
My point in mentioning a possible departure time for a hypothetical AA metal flight to HKG was to point out that AA's T-4 at LAX has lots of space to accommodate a flight to HKG, if it chose to start flying LAX-HKG. AA's T-4 is more crowded during the middle of the day.
I have no idea of the ideal departure time for that hypothetical flight from LAX to HKG. The dominant carrier in that market has two late evening departures and one afternoon departure.
With the news yesterday that US will be moving to T-3 so that WN can have T-1 all to itself, that opens up a widebody-capable gate or two if/when US and AA combine.
Jan 16, 2013, 10:55 am
#2849
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: NYC LAX RDU
Programs: US-Plt;Concierge key; American AAirpass; Delta Silver;Starwood - Platinum; Amex Cent
Posts: 710
Jan 16, 2013, 11:00 am
#2850
Suspended
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: London
Programs: BA GGL, AA 1MM LT GLD, SPG PLAT, National Exec Selc, Hilton Diamond, Hyatt Plat, Marriott Silver
Posts: 8,278
BA and US were close partners when US was first building its TATL business out of PHL. And back then US was a formidable competitor with their int'l F/J soft-product too.