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[Speculation] SFO-MSP On the chopping block!?

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[Speculation] SFO-MSP On the chopping block!?

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Old Feb 9, 2018, 7:24 pm
  #31  
 
Join Date: Dec 2016
Posts: 1,485
Originally Posted by dayone
My experience is the loads to SFO, LAX and LGA are pretty good. Yields may be a different story. AS is committed to trying to make DAL viable. WN and DL hope they are not successful.
I think long term, the Dallas to west coast stuff will probably be fine, but the DAL to LGA/DCA have no chance of sustaining. They are putting E75 on routes where both ends are very small operations. That's going to erase most of the CASM advantage they have against AA and WN on 738 will probably have a non-trivial cost advantage.

Here are some of the fare numbers. I'm assuming OO is Horizon operated AS in most cases here. VX seems to do pretty well fare wise on the SFO/LAX routes. DCA is terrible. LGA is pretty bad and got even worse after OO took over.
DALSFO
WN 151.20
VX 160.94

DFWSFO
OO 171.56
AA 193.60
UA 162.29

DALLAX
WN 150.43
VX 161.26

DFWLAX
OO 144.68
AA 187.73
NK 63.91
CP 178.28
UA 135.93

DALLGA
OO 151.58
WN 160.33
VX 165.78

DFWLGA
AA 206.83
NK 78.07
YX 196.01

DALDCA
VX 134.03
WN 156.87

DFWDCA
AA 230.55
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Old Feb 9, 2018, 7:34 pm
  #32  
 
Join Date: Jul 2015
Location: SEA
Programs: Hilton/Marriott Gold, Accor Silver
Posts: 2,036
Originally Posted by tphuang
I'm assuming OO is Horizon operated AS in most cases here.
SkyWest, not QX.
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Old Feb 10, 2018, 12:36 am
  #33  
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: TUS/PDX
Programs: WN CP/A-List, AS MVPG75K
Posts: 5,798
Originally Posted by Aliquot
AS has begun almost all their longer flights as one per day. One flight per day is useful to fewer people, but it is not any less useful for the people that the times work for. I have flown a lot, but I never have needed to fly a route more than once in a day.
Notice how many “new” flights are still once a day. PDX-ORD: once a day for all eternity, and it’s extremely difficult to flow connections through ORD without a double connect. SEA-RDU/BNA/IND/STL/MCI/SAT/MSY have all been once a day since they started. If the times work, AS is great. But it’s certainly not always easy to fit a work day (or leisure day for that matter) into the AS schedule.

Originally Posted by milypan
That's a good point – I didn't even think of the obvious Alaska-Houston energy link. I'd even be willing to fly via SEA in some cases, but the returns aren't viable (either 6 am from IAH...which is already an hour away from the other side of the Houston area, or an evening flight that fails to make any connections in SEA).
Doesn’t the evening IAH flight continue up to ANC? Or didn’t it at one point?
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Old Feb 10, 2018, 7:10 am
  #34  
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: PDX
Programs: AS MVP Gold 100K
Posts: 2,993
Originally Posted by tusphotog


Notice how many “new” flights are still once a day. PDX-ORD: once a day for all eternity, and it’s extremely difficult to flow connections through ORD without a double connect. SEA-RDU/BNA/IND/STL/MCI/SAT/MSY have all been once a day since they started. If the times work, AS is great. But it’s certainly not always easy to fit a work day (or leisure day for that matter) into the AS schedule.



Doesn’t the evening IAH flight continue up to ANC? Or didn’t it at one point?
PDX-ORD is starting to see a red eye on VX equipment sporadically.

The IAH flight used to continue to ANC (and originate from ANC), but no more.
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Old Feb 10, 2018, 9:06 am
  #35  
 
Join Date: Mar 2017
Location: Anchorage, AK
Programs: MVP Gold
Posts: 215
Living here in Houston now, I really wish they would add more flights into Houston. Or at least make it at least 2x daily flight
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Old Feb 10, 2018, 5:12 pm
  #36  
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: SFO
Programs: BART Platinum, AA Plat Pro
Posts: 1,158
Originally Posted by tusphotog
Doesn’t the evening IAH flight continue up to ANC? Or didn’t it at one point?
My guess is not, looking at the schedule (seems like it turns around as a red eye back to IAH). At any rate, I was referring to connecting to California or other points south of SEA.

Originally Posted by seahawks10177
Living here in Houston now, I really wish they would add more flights into Houston. Or at least make it at least 2x daily flight
I think it is twice daily (to SEA)? Most of the times are not great though.
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Old Feb 10, 2018, 9:46 pm
  #37  
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Programs: UA Plat 2MM; AS MVP Gold 75K
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Originally Posted by seahawks10177
Living here in Houston now, I really wish they would add more flights into Houston.
The O/D is pretty light for Houston, especially to the West Coast. The only reason there's as many flights as there are is because of the UA hub. I can't find the chart at the moment, but IAH has some like the second or third highest percentage of connecting traffic in the country. The majority of people using the airport are not starting or ending there.
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Old Feb 10, 2018, 10:40 pm
  #38  
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: SFO
Programs: BART Platinum, AA Plat Pro
Posts: 1,158
Originally Posted by channa
The O/D is pretty light for Houston, especially to the West Coast. The only reason there's as many flights as there are is because of the UA hub. I can't find the chart at the moment, but IAH has some like the second or third highest percentage of connecting traffic in the country. The majority of people using the airport are not starting or ending there.
Quoting my own post from last October:

HOU is the #14 market out of the SF Bay Area. This is for origin-destination pairs; we're not talking about connections.

I'm not claiming HOU is a top 10 market. It's not (though PHX, also unserved, is). But AS serves #46 (TUS), #38 (IND), #33 (ABQ), #31 (MCI), #29 (BNA), #28 (RDU), #24 (MSY), #21 (MCO), #20(MSP), and #18 (AUS). None of these are in CA or the PNW. In raw numbers, HOU has 4x the traffic of IND, and PHX has 10x the traffic of TUS. There are big holes in the AS network coming from CA right now.​​​​​​​
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Old Feb 11, 2018, 9:50 am
  #39  
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: PDX
Programs: AS MVP Gold 100K
Posts: 2,993
Originally Posted by channa
The majority of people using the airport are not starting or ending there.
You could probably say that of most major hub airports in the country.
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Old Feb 11, 2018, 10:53 am
  #40  
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Originally Posted by milypan


Quoting my own post from last October:

Right. That's all traffic not terminating traffic. UA does a lot of connecting business in IAH.


Originally Posted by Chugach


You could probably say that of most major hub airports in the country.
Not really. A lot of the hubs in major cities have a great deal of O/D traffic.

​​​​​​​I believe the top 3 for connecting traffic ate CLT, ATL and IAH.
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Old Feb 11, 2018, 11:12 am
  #41  
 
Join Date: Nov 2001
Location: Portland, Oregon
Programs: Hilton Platinum, Alaska MVP Gold
Posts: 2,363
Originally Posted by Chugach


PDX-ORD is starting to see a red eye on VX equipment sporadically.

I think this is, more or less, the spring break special run.
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Old Feb 11, 2018, 12:54 pm
  #42  
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: PDX
Programs: AS MVP Gold 100K
Posts: 2,993
Originally Posted by WebTraveler
I think this is, more or less, the spring break special run.
I thought I saw it show up this summer. Could be wrong though.
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Old Feb 11, 2018, 1:11 pm
  #43  
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: PDX
Programs: AS MVP Gold 100K
Posts: 2,993
Originally Posted by channa
Right. That's all traffic not terminating traffic. UA does a lot of connecting business in IAH.




Not really. A lot of the hubs in major cities have a great deal of O/D traffic.

I believe the top 3 for connecting traffic ate CLT, ATL and IAH.
​​​​​​​Are you including Hobby in the O&D stats for Houston?
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Old Feb 11, 2018, 2:05 pm
  #44  
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Originally Posted by Chugach


Are you including Hobby in the O&D stats for Houston?
Just IAH. HOU would probably improve the O/D since WN is more of a point-to-point carrier. Though WN only has 2 flights OAK-HOU (nothing SJC-HOU or SFO-HOU).
​​​​​​​
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Old Feb 11, 2018, 5:11 pm
  #45  
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: SFO
Programs: BART Platinum, AA Plat Pro
Posts: 1,158
Originally Posted by channa
Right. That's all traffic not terminating traffic. UA does a lot of connecting business in IAH.
Quoting my own quote, emphasis added:

This is for origin-destination pairs; we're not talking about connections.
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