makfan

Last night, boarding started nearly 45 minutes before departure. It took a while for pre-boarding, so it was probably 38 minutes to departure when F started to board.

I didn't use my laptop, but I was reading email on my phone. I clearly heard, as part of the usual announcements about one item under the seat in front of you and wheels facing out, that we were supposed to turn off and stow all electronic devices.

Boarding was very sporadic for whatever reason. There were times when the second flight attendant could go up and back hanging jackets and not block anybody.

Finally, we were done boarding. Then an announcement was made that we had our final paperwork and all electronic devices needed to be turned off and stowed.

So which is it? Was I violating a flight attendant's instructions by reading email while everyone else boarded? I may not value my time at $500 per hour, but I certainly value it at more than $0. I love using dead time like this to clear up and answer simple email messages, make todo lists, etc.

People can say I have no life, or that I need to disconnect, or whatever, but I ought to be able to choose what to do with my time. I want to get stuff done on the plane when I'm alone so that when I arrive I can connect with the people there.

GoLutes10

I believe the correct time to turn off electronics is, yes, when the flight attendant is given their final paperwork from the boarding agent. Which is, if the flight is on time, ten minutes before departure. Operations prefers the plane be boarded and pushing back from the jetway ten minutes prior to departure, and in order to do so, they want passenger's electronics turned off.

While it may only take you 30 seconds to put your laptop away, you almost have to understand that we deal with passengers who don't travel as often, and might normally take longer than that to put something away. For all the flight attendant's know, they might have to wait on you...so, to be safe, the announcement is made once while boarding to get passengers a head start who aren't as familiar with the rules, and again more strictly once the final paperwork is given to them.

Also, I realize it may be inconsistent, but from what I've experienced (not just on AS), flight attendants are less strict about cell phone useage when the door is closed than laptops, probably given the fact that the computer takes more time to power off and stow away.

jackal

I don't value my time at a tenth of what the OP does, but I still see the flaw in the current policy. Whether or not you think the policy failure is major or minor or even nonexistent, I fail to see how anyone can argue that the current policy couldn't be improved by making it more in line with some of AS's competitors.

^

[Moderator hat on]

The above said, we already have an extensive topic on turning off electronics before departure. In order to keep things centralized and make sure no one has trouble finding discussion on that subject, let's keep discussion of that topic in that thread and keep this thread focused more on general differing experiences on UA and AS.

[Moderator hat off]

ANC RED-EYE

Maybe you should read the OP again. I don't see anywhere that he is asking for "additional consideration or accommodations because of his hourly rate". What he is asking is why all passengers get less on AS than on competitors with regard to the issues raised...and I think that is a great question.

Furthermore, if those few things cause flyers who fly as much as the OP to consider changing their preference away from AS, then I think AS should probably pay attention.

Let's state it more simply:

If AS had a pre-departure drink in F, offered a better variety of snack options, and didn't pester passengers about electronic use before it was necessary prior to departure and during descent they would be more competitive when compared to other airlines.

So...we object to AS addressing these three little things why?

And yes, for all of you who want to criticize the OP for being high maintenance or nit-picky or whatever, I'm sure I won't stop you. But for those who want to think about it critically, maybe we should entertain the fact that often with customer service it is the relatively minor seeming things that make all the difference. Those of us who work in customer service oriented fields probably know and believe that. So, again I ask, we object to AS addressing these three little issues...why?

sxf24

Pester before it is necessary?

eternalX

I also feel that AS has the best people in the industry when it comes to FAs, call-center and airport check-in people. They are great at helping you out and finding solutions instead of, what is common UA, telling me how I'm breaking the rules or how much something is going to cost me - basically trying to act like my second grade teacher. This is a big reason to use AS.

What I only wish was that I could use my status to get me upgraded on some Euro international transcon. UA wouldn't help me much because I'd need to go through SF or ORD and that isn't worth it to get upgraded. Moving to DL wouldn't help either as it seems impossible to get upgraded on them as well.

seacarl

I fly frequently on both AS and UA, and as MVPG and UA-1K, I am frequently upgraded on both airlines.

Each airline has its strengths and advantages and foibles.

However, I agree with the OP that on the whole UA's first class is superior to Alaska in a couple of significant ways:
- United's seats are more comfortable and recline further. They seem to have better lumbar support, and the additional recline is significant if you want to sleep, particularly on red-eye flights. Alaska's seats in F just aren't as comfortable
- United does offer pre-departure drinks, and generally seems to have more attentive service in F. At least half the time on Alaska, the flight attendants serve the pilots the meal before serving the passengers their first drinks, and it can take 45 minutes.
- Alaska generally does seem to be more forceful about shutting off laptops well before the boarding door closes and sometimes before landing, though it is not really a big deal
- Alaska's food has gone downhill a lot. United's can be a bit inconsistent, but the Alaska meals aren't much any more, whether on 1000 mile flight or a transon.

From Seattle, Alaska offers a lot more non-stop destinations than United, and life's too short to connect in SFO. On the other hand, United has more reach, both domestically and internationally where you can enjoy elite benefits (including Star alliance lounges when traveling internationally) but you will generally need to make more connections (which of course increases the mileage credit )

On the whole I feel that employee attitude and courtesy and friendliness is pretty comparable. On both airlines you experience a wide variation in friendliness and competence. Ten years ago I would have said that Alaska employees were a lot more friendly than United, but United's gotten better and Alaska has moved more to average.

For me the biggest advantage of Alaska is no change fees. I pay for my own travel, so I personally pay every change fee. If I'm not sure about a trip, I'll try to book Alaska because I know I can use the value of the fare for a different trip or can adjust my plans. I know that if I book on United, I may lose the whole fare or at least $150 if I have to change the date. On both United and Alaska it is usually pretty easy to switch flights the same day, and neither charges for the switch within some number of hours of the flight. Alaska used to let you switch +/- 24 hours if the flight was open, but I think they have reduced that to same day only, which is too bad. But being able to totally change or cancel and use the ticket value is a big Alaska benefit.

ANC RED-EYE

Yep, there is an entire thread on that (which, if my memory serves me correctly, you have been a signficant contributor to); however as jackal pointed out, the point of this tread need not be to repeat that thread. However, since you find my above statement something worth rolling your eyes at, I'll qualify by saying that, yes, I do believe Alaska's current policy (which has been outlined extensively in the other thread) of warning pax several times starting 10 minutes before the actual time it is necessary to actually shut your electronic devices off is consistent with pestering passengers.

Pester according to Webster: "to harass with petty irritations"

That seems to be what the OP and the entire other thread are addressing.

sltlyamusd

I do find that AS f/as tend to wait longer after takeoff before beginning service and prepare the cabin for landing earlier than on some other airlines. I have also noticed the pilots are a little more hesitant to turn off the seatbelt sign than on other airlines. Not a big deal.

I have not, however, ever heard this announcement to turn off electronic devices 10 minutes before door closure. My experience is that they ask to turn off electronic devices when the door is about to be closed. There is really no sense in requiring these devices to be off until the plane is about to leave the gate.

As far as AS offering a variety of snacks in flight, well they did offer the snack basket for a while but people hated it so much they ended up donating loads of uneaten snacks to charity, and then discontinued it. So, I guess it's back to a bag of pretzels and whatever appetizer plate they are serving in F. Some of the appetizer plates aren't bad, though I'll pass on the bruschetta.

I do agree that AS could offer a PDB at no significant additional cost, and there is really no reason not to, given how early they like to begin boarding.

seacarl

It is my impression that Alaska is more apt to close the door (and require electronics to be off) as soon as boarding is completed, even if bags are still being loaded or they are waiting for information or otherwise not ready to push. It is not unusual to wait for 5-10 minutes after door closure before push. Maybe there is an incentive for gate agents for early door closure. On United my impression is that they close the door when they are ready to push, or they tend to push more quickly after the door closes, so it appears that you can use electronics until shortly before push. I haven't objectively collected data, so my impression could be biased. And I don't consider it a big deal, but over hundreds of flights it feels like Alaska enforces electronic devices to be off earlier until pushback than UA.

Agree that Alaska flight attendants seem to generally wait longer to start service. As to offering PDB, I bet that would be require a huge cultural change at AS and encounter resistance by the FAs as they are not used to doing it and it will be more work.

Some of the appetizer plates are pretty good and some aren't. I appreciate having the option of a (sometimes healthy) fresh snack (there are usually vegetables included) even on fairly short flights (where United wouldn't offer anything). On the other hand if it's over 2 hours during mealtime on SEA-DEN, PHX or LAS then the plate's a bit sparse. But on the whole not hugely better or worse than UA, just different.

The more important issue would be a more comfortable seat with more lumbar support and more recline. And eventually an entertainment system that is not a Digeplayer. And it is nice to have the option to listen to Channel 9 if you are curious, though Channel 9 seems turned off more often these days.

COS flyer

For me as a Gold and a Prem Exec (1P), I have to agree with the OP. The biggest perk for Alaska is the change fee. If AS changes that, I probably would shift to more UA and WN flying. UA has all of what the OP said, plus, they board Elites first. Not parents with SUV strollers. Their regional product on the CRJ-700s and E-170s are nice (not sure it's overly worth it to have F, but it is nice) and when you don't get first (which for me is about a 50% hit rate for both airlines) you get E+. E+ makes a big difference. UA's customer service has come a long way. I really like flying them today. And best of all Continental is coming! UA/CO should be pretty good when they get though the merger. AS customer service is still very good and they fly routes I need to use. For my money, Star Alliance is pretty powerful against the Final Frontier Alliance. UA's service has only improved, where I do feel AS has become a race downward to meet everyone else.

boosman

I'm a 1K and an MVPG, and fly out of SEA. This year it's not clear that I'm going to have 150K BIS miles, so I've had to prioritize to be sure I make one or the other. I've prioritized in favor of UA -- I'm close to requalifying as a 1K, but though I know I'll make MVP, I doubt I'm going to make MVPG this year. My thinking went like this:

AS advantages:

• Friendly, happy employees
• Plenty of non-stops out of SEA
• Support the home team!

UA advantages:

• SWUs -- these are worth their weight in gold to me
• Excellent domestic upgrade availability out of SEA, especially on 757s
• E+ for those few times I'm not upgraded

Most of my flying is across the country, and my track record in upgrades on AS is maybe 50 percent on transcons, whereas on UA it's probably at 90 percent or higher. Those few times I'm not upgraded on UA, if there's not an exit row seat, I always can fall back on E+. When I book a transcon on AS, unless I'm doing it months in advance, exit rows are usually booked, so I know that if my upgrade doesn't clear, I'm going to be in a regular Y seat, and at 6'2", after five hours of that, I actually hobble a little down the jetway on the other end. Not good.

Also factoring into my calculation to prioritize UA this year was the introduction of the MVP 75K level. My assumption is that given how hard it is for me to get transcon upgrades now as an MVPG, it will be even worse now with the 75K level -- basically they'll grab them all. So since I know I won't have enough miles for 75K, I'm not sure how much of a point there is to MVPG. I'm guessing it will still be good for upgrades up and down the West Coast, but that's not much of my flying.

jackal

Interesting observation, and one I have noticed for some time now, too.

I've always wondered what takes AS so long to push compared to UA. I used to think it was an operational issue--AS takes longer to get their paperwork in order, etc. Maybe it's not that AS is slow but rather what you say--AS closes the door before they're actually ready to go and are waiting for other things to finish.

ANC RED-EYE

AS 258 SEA - LAX today 0800 schedule:

^ I was nearly shocked when the F FA asked me if I would like coffee, and how I took it just after boarding. I don't think I have ever been offered anything but water pre-departure on AS.

All told, >20 minutes went by between when the first "turn off all electronic devices at this time" announcement went and the door closed; 25-30 minutes between first courtesy reminder and door closed.