hannover1998

On an AA flight operated by AirBerlin last month, DUS/MIA, I had an AAdvantage business ticket, but they changed the aircraft, and there were nothing but economy seats everywhere.

No one told me of the change, and I discovered it only when I stepped onto the plane. But then it was too late to confirm another flight or do anything about it, so I flew in coach.

Does this aircraft change (from regular configuration to economy only) happen regularly on transatlantic flights? What about the miles I used for business class?

Thanks for any advice.

JDiver

As airberlin is the operating airline, this question is better asked in the operating airline's forum.

AA should certainly refund the miles difference.

JDiver
senior moderator

Djokison

Airberlin has a couple (I think 3) all Economy A330's. They're often scheduled on Caribbean (leisure) routes. I believe All USA/Canada routes (With the exception of perhaps Ft. Myers) are always scheduled with business class.

I assume this was a last minute sub and you most definitely deserve at the bare minimum the difference in miles between business and first. Frankly, you deserve compensation above that due to the involuntary downgrade.

djibouti

I think the EU rules would apply in this case, as well, so you'd be entitled to not insignificant cash compensation. I'm not sure if it's AB or AA who owes it. I'm not even sure if I'm right =).

Often1

OP is likely owed downgrade compensation of 75% of the ticket price. There's a lot of debate as to how that ought to be paid in the case of a mileage ticket. And, AB will fight this until the end of time. Whether it's cash or miles, they still have value to a FF.

seawolf

OP is due 75% of they ticket. The question is whether it is 75% of the entire itinerary or just the segment involved.

The other issue is AB needs to work it out with AA so that OP gets back 75% of the miles for the ticket subject to the first paragraph above.

TravellingSalesman

If my reading of EU 261 is correct, OP is due refund of 75% of the entire ticket price, i.e. miles and potential fees.

dujardin

I'm booked on 7450 DUS-JFK on 1 March 2014 (3 passengers). The seatmap for this flight shows the all economy config, and no J can be booked on this flight (I mentioned this in a previous thread). So apparently the use of all eco is sometimes scheduled long in advance, even for JFK.
I (as OW Sapphire) booked seats (a month ago) in the middle section of row 1. The seatmap for this flight (i.e., on checkmytrip etc) shows a middle section of 4 seats for this flight (1 DEFG), even though according to seatmaps on the airberlin website the all eco config has a middle section of 3 seats in row 1 (1DEG). When I called they would only allow me to book 1DEF and not 1DEG, since you can only book three seats next to each other (?). Now, my fear is that at some point it will turn out that 1F does not exist, by then 1G will be occupied, and we will end up in the worst seats somewhere in the back. How to solve this? Thx!

OK, so called airberlin again (their central European callcenter apparently). The agent was very friendly. I asked her to book 1DEG. She said she tried to do it but the system won't let her since we are 3 passengers traveling together. She insisted that since 1F is showing in their system it will definitely exist on the flight. I'm not so sure about that. Do any of you know if such a plane exists (all eco with 1DEFG)?

seawolf

If DUS-JFK is your first segment, try qantas.com to self-assign.

dujardin

Thanks for the tip, but apparently qantas.com won't let me pick seats either.
I would still like to know whether the all eco config with 1DEFG actually exists...

dujardin

I just noticed that the seatmap for my flight not only has 1DEFG instead of 1DEG, but also has 51 rows total, instead of 47 (as shown on the seatmap for the all eco A330-200 on the airberlin website)... So this does indeed appear to be another aircraft...
edit: OK... very weird. Just checked again with a dummy booking, and this plane has economy seats 2-4-2 rows 1 through 8, no rows 9 through 13, and then more economy rows 14 through 51. Seems like a strange hybrid between regular config (business + eco) and all eco.
Maybe someone with more knowledge could to a dummy booking for flight 7450 DUS-JFK on 1 March 2014...

Tyrolean

Seat assignment on QF.com does not work since a few days.

Djokison

This part makes sense, as the regular A330's economy starts at row 14. No point renumbering all the rows when they were converted to all-eco.

Edit to add:

I just checked out some flights that I knew to be flown by the all-eco A330-200 as well as your flight.
Based on the seatmap on Airberlin.com (where you choose your seat) and expertflyer, there is an "F" seat in the first row, so you shouldn't worry about that.

Your flight shows rows 1-8 and then 14-51, As do all the other flights I checked in 2014. In 2013, they still show as 1-7 and 14-50 (this config also has all 8 seats in the first row).

I would disregard the regular seatmap in "our fleet" on the website.

swiss_global

The use of eco only acft on long haul is increasingly becoming a concern. I hope it's a temporary phenomenon. I'm regularly flying the DUS-JFK route in J. But since I'm 200cm/6ft8" I simply don't fit into Eco seats - eventhough as an AB Plat I would certainly get one of the better ones ...

dujardin

Thanks very much for your input, much appreciated.
So it seems that they're putting in an extra row of seats in the front cabin at some point?
How do you see on which dates they're flying DUS-JFK with all eco? Could you give an example of a date where you see the config you describe in 2013?

Thanks!