abarbieri

Hi all!

Being part of our family trip, my brother booked a VIE-CDG flight and the payment was not authorized by his credit card provider. AB sent an e-mail with the phone contacts, but it was a german speaking number only - we tried the Portugal number at AB website without success. In the end, he made a new booking with other credit card, which was approved and the ticket was finally issued. Them, he replied the AB e-mail with the new booking, but they insist that the unpaid booking can't be cancelled without paying.

Anyone has been at the same situation? any thoughts?

Thanks in advance... (and sorry for english error,)

starflyer

If they won't let you cancel without paying first, simply state that you're fine with not cancelling the unpaid booking and are happy to follow their preferred process of just letting it expire unpaid.

Often1

Not a good idea. If there are duplicate bookings, they may cancel one or both. OP's brother needs to get this straiughtened out. Not the sort of unpleasant surprise one wants to confront at the airport on departure.

jiejie

I don't understand this position. If a reservation/booking has not been paid for, it cannot have been ticketed, so what is there to pay a cancellation fee for? No ticket issued = no contract between airline and passenger. Normally unpaid-for bookings just expire after a set period of time. If AB is actually trying to get payment for a non-contract, is this legal under EU law?

Flying Lawyer

This is certainly legal all over the place. The OP bought an ticket and did not pay for it. He is in breach of contract, so do not blame the airline. The OP made a mistake at the very beginning by making a duplicate booking and he needs to sort this out.

GUWonder

What is legal all over the place?

The "unpaid booking" did not have a ticket issued, so no ticket was bought when the earlier booking was made.

There is no general breach of contract when material consideration has not been provided for during that earlier (unpaid/non-ticketed) booking.

A non-ticketed booking is not a general contract of carriage that requires payment for cancellation. Non-ticketed bookings will eventually see the booked flights disappear and no money will be due for that to occur.

The OP should not volunteer an alternative means of payment for the non-ticketed booking. If the OP is even made to be obliged by AB pursuing the matter in a court of law in some jurisdictions, then that would be a stroke of bad luck as in most jurisdictions a retail interaction for a travel booking that is not ticketed is not a contract of carriage.

The OP made two bookings, and purchased (i.e., paid for) one ticket. There is no good reason for a retail consumer at this stage to volunteer to pay for cancellation of a non-ticketed booking.

Contrary to the false claim in the second sentence in the above quoted post, the OP bought a ticket and paid for it.

Flying Lawyer

The previous post is long, but it lacks not only some understanding. Probably you need to understand that there is a huge world outside the US that acknowledges the right and a claim of specific performance and not only damages for breach of contract.

The OP bought a ticket on ABs website. He pressed the button "book", entered into the relevant contract and then he failed to pay because his agent (the CC company) for what reason whatsoever did not transfer the funds. Instead of speaking to the airline, he bought (and paid for) a second ticket.

The airline is certainly in my and the airline's jurisdiction fully within their legal right to reequest payment for the first ticket purchased (but not paid) and will - if the OP decides to cancel - refund whatever is refundable.

AB is to my experience customer friendly but you need to talk to them and not follow erratic legal ideas.

jiejie

I'm still having a hard time believing this is legal under EU law. I guess it hinges around the question of WHEN does one enter an actual contract: when booking, which shows intent, or when the transaction is completed (with payment).

Sorry FlyingLawyer, nothing personal, but I've learned never to trust just one person's word on anything. So please, any others of you with knowledge of these sort of matters, chime in. For those of us not used to operating our daily affairs under EU law, it is of interest for future possible bookings with EU-based airlines. Not a deterrent per se, just an understanding of what rules are different. And to FL again: I don't think this happens "all over the place" as you purport. In North America and the (very large) part of Asia I'm familiar with, a booking made but transaction not completed (payment!) within a certain specified period of time gets automatically dumped and voided, no obligation on either side. It's not just a US phenomenon, so please don't try to lay that one on the forum.

Flying Lawyer

If you consider the PRC part of Asia: it is no different under Chinese contract law.

You need to understand the difference between a reservation eg a travel agent makes and purchasing a ticket on a website. The reservation a travel agent makes is nothing but a reservation and is intended to be nothing but a reservation. It is removed from the system if not ticketed within a certain period and none of the parties is under any obligation.

if you buy your ticket on an airline's website it is different. You purchase a ticket (and you are under the obligation to pay for it). If you don't pay, the carrier has (a) every right to cancel the contract and claim damages or (b) to demand specific performance and make you pay for the ticket.

To deal with this eg LH introduced a new feature allowing you to simply make a reservation via the website. It you do not decide the buy the ticket it will cost you (to my recollection) 30 Euro, if you buy it, fine. On AB's website there is not any doubt that you purchase a ticket and you need to pay. Not paying (like the OP did) does not release you from your obligations towards the carrier.

The fact of the matter is a major difference between in particular the US legal concepts and the legal concepts in civil law jurisdictions like Germany and China. The US follows to my knowledge the concept that a contract only becomes binding if both parties have met their obligation (payment made vs. ticket issued). The civil law follows the concept that a contract is binding as soon as both parties have agreed upon the essentialia negotii of the deal (obligation to issue ticket vs. obligation to make payment).

Further: there is no EU law on contract. Contacts are governed by the law of the relevant jurisdiction. If it comes to AB this is most likely Germany. And if I am certain for one jurisdiction, then I am certain about Germany....

Often1

You misunderstand. OP didn't make a reservation, he actually bought a ticket and agreed to pay for it by CC. His CC issuer declined to make the payment and it was OP's obligation to make good on his commitment to pay.

OP needs to in a cool & collected manner contact AB, not in writing, but either in person or via phone, explain what he did, and ask for AB to correct the situation.

Greg45

+1


I can only confirm Flying Lawyer’s excellent posts. Not that his expertise actually needs any backing up, but I am also a lawyer and sometimes flying, so why not pitch in.

To OP:

Even if you are legally required to “pay what you bought”, I am sure you can talk to AB about this. Especially if your second booking is exactly as the first one, I can’t see how they would not correct this situation. In this case it seems obvious that you made a mistake. If you made any changes in the second booking however, it might be more difficult to convince them.

Good luck!

GUWonder

You are peddling a misunderstanding and perhaps have misunderstood.

A non-completed "purchase" for a product/service is generally not considered a purchase until payment is considered accepted by the retail consumer's counterparty. Since the first reservation was not ticketed and payment was not considered accepted there is no general obligation for the OP to contact the airline about that reservation and pay any fee to cancel a purchase that did not take place.

And I ran this whole thing by EU-based attorneys for around a dozen airlines. I am in the EU too.

The OP needs not do anything except watch the ticketed reservation which has been paid for in full. Non-purchased, courtesy hold airline ticket reservations create no general specific performance requirements to purchase a held reservation. A non-purchased reservation being held is a mere courtesy hold until payment is accepted, beyond any counterparty representations about the hold terms applicable to the product/service supplier.

Flying Lawyer

We can agree to disagree, however remarks like "generally not comsidered" show that you did not make yourself familiar with the case. I booked an AB ticket on their website a minute ago and the website leaves no doubt on the moment the contract is entered into.

And your assumption that a contract is no contract until payment has been accepted is nothing but utterly wrong for the jurisdiction AB operates in. Great that you find EU based attorneys who hold differently. I personally question their qualification in particular because the contracts are not governed by any EU law but by the lw of the memberstates.

And if the two if us wish to enter I to a contract this contract is binding on execution (or oral agreement) and certainly not only on performance of the contractual obligations. I do not see any reason why this should be different in the case of an airline selling a ticket (and not only accepting a non ticketed reservation).

GUWonder

AB operates in multiple jurisdictions which is why my use of "generally" is accurate. Germany doesn't have absolute domination in the EU or even beyond it in various other markets where AB has chosen to sell tickets.

The airline does not generally accept non-ticketed reservations for travel. Ticketed reservations are distinct from non-purchased, non-ticketed reservations that are held until purchase or the reservation cancellation timed by the airline.

Flying Lawyer

AB is a German airline, so it is not an issue of Germany domintating the EU. Without carrying this to far (different from others I need to do some work) their conditions of booking are pretty clear:

"For all offers for flight bookings bookable on the Internet at www.airberlin.com or at other authorised Internet booking sites, the Contract of Carriage between the Airline and the booking party comes into existence upon clicking on the "Book Now" button and the subsequent appearance of a summary of the booking data on the screen (online booking confirmation)."

Nothing - other than your own pleadings - speak for you opinion.