Dogs_Ears_Up

I can appreciate that the safety demo tape is frustrating for those of you that travel a great deal, however there is IMHO a value to it. Before every take-off, your pilots will run through some checks and procedures and certain touch and memory drills. This has the effect of mental preparation in terms of mind set as well as re-enforcing vital procedures and ensuring clarity of team work. This is despite the fact that they already know all of the items intimately.

Passengers are clearly not operating crew, so it is unreasonable to expect the same level of skill and commitment - that's what the crew are there for. That said, for the three minutes out of your life that the safety demo takes, I'd suggest that some focus for that short time would be potentially useful, even if only to establish the mind set. It is a suggestion that you are absolutely free to ignore, and many do - it's entirely your call.

On the occasion mentioned above by HaaZe, the Concierge PA was approximately 1 minute long - I know this because I made it. There is an awareness within the airline that PA's are intrusive, and sometimes over-used, and we do try to minimize them: I suspect as in many areas, we do our best and sometimes we don't do it quite well enough. Text messages through the IFE system are sometimes used in lieu. In general terms, certainly for Business Premier and Premium Economy, PA's are made during the first 5 minutes after the seat belt signs are switched off, and then there are no further. In Pacific Economy, additional PA's usually refer to the meal choice.

I have to say that I was somewhat pleased with HaaZe's comments above. It strikes me as a pretty reasonable assessment of how the flight went. There was a fair bit more going on elsewhere than he/she realized, but that is precisely how it should be. The function of a Concierge is to be visible when needed to those who need them, and to stay invisible to those that don't.

The perception of the role will no doubt continue to be controversial, and some opinions volatile. It continues to be a work in progress, with standards varying from flight to flight and concierge to concierge. That said, I'm beginning to find that confidence in the role is slowly building from both customers and crew and I'm aware of gradually becoming more useful as time goes by. Maybe, that's as good as it gets for now: Time will tell.

TiggerK

Not wanting to cause offense to our very respected FT comrade ntddevsys, but I am quite surprised at this lack of respect for the protocol of airline safety.

We all know the reality of airline accidents, and very possibly none of the safety tips may be of any use whatsoever, but we should always have respect for the crew and I firmly believe we should do them the courtesy of paying attention for just a couple of minutes out of our lives. To not do so is insulting, rude and arrogant. In my opinion anyway. As even more frequent travellers than me, YMMV.

Cheers
TiggerK

flyingmoa

Wonder if he's related to the absolute misery I had the misfortune of sitting near on a 767 tasman service a few months back; was on one of the reconfigured 767s and when a headset was handed to him and the lovely crew member told him he could start watching immediately now; his reply was 'but you guys just interrupt it all the time with announcements'. made me want to strangle him myself!

HaaZe

You learn something new every day (and the IFC on NZ2 learnt something about EU passports ).

Interesting position to meet on a long haul flight, and being in a 'stealth' or
'behind the scenes' type of job myself, I can appreciate that it might be a demanding role, albeit not very visible. If there is an IFC on my return flight out of LHR, I shall keep my eyes peeled, spying and noting every detail.

Or, I shall simply nod off to sleep, which is probably the more sensible option.

Dogs_Ears_Up

Just so you know... we move in a mysterious way, our wonders to perform

HaaZe

That explains why the said IFC was spotted outside the windows, polishing the starboard winglet.

Maybe it would be an idea for NZ to publish the 'role' of the Cabin Crew +/- the IFC in the Kia Ora magazine - similarly to how the SQ crew are generically presented in their publication...

ajnz

I don't really have any specific feelings about the IFC PA, mostly because I don't recall hearing it, but what is annoying is the constant start-pause-stop of the announcements. The IFE auto-pauses, yes, but it usually autopauses badly. When someone starts an announcement, pauses briefly in it (and turns the mic off) because they've been interrupted, forgot what they were going to say next, had to flip a page, whatever, then starts again, it really messes with the IFE in an annoying way. You will miss parts of what you are watching, and that is annoying.

Get the PAs out of the way in a single stream, WITHOUT the start-pause-stop, and people would probably be happier.

Stupid question: how do you know they're there, if they stay invisible? How does one take advantage of the knowledge they have?

everywhere

None taken.

I am slightly bemused however as to how not paying attention to something which is already well known can be a lack of respect for the protocol of airline safety. Furthermore I fail to see how it is insulting, rude or arrogant to use the time to better effect - such as reading the social pages of the Herald on Sunday.

People who are not familiar with the particular aircraft can still watch the safety demonstration and count the rows of seats to the exit - while noting their nearest exit may be behind them. Anything that might interfere with that - for example carrying on a loud conversation across the aisle about the performance of the NYSE, as I witness from time to time, is not really a good idea. Equally flyingmoa so would complaining loudly about the video to the crew (and come to think of it strangling someone might also interrupt the demonstration), but I have no experience as to either of those scenarios.

I would have thought that the act of boarding the plane and sitting down and fastening the seatbelt would be enough to mentally prepare the mind. This you can see on many commuter flights, such as say NZ451 there are plenty of passengers that carry on reading right through the safety demonstration. From memory the safety video is only 2 minutes in length for this flight.

The real problem comes up when you have gate to gate IFE in that you have
constant start-pause-stop announcements that you can't get rid of, a safety video that can't be skipped, and the odd alert through the IFE that you have to cancel (such as please close the shades). It is a bit like the iphone alerts system that interrupts you and asks you what to do rather than one that let's you know its there and then vanishes into the background for later perusal.

trooper

Not sure if this is new.. or well known...

Flying out on NZ 2 tonight.. (upgrade has already cleared and I am a brand new GE.).. checked my e-mails only to find one from the Concierge rostered to that flight tonight.. introducing herself etc..

Not sure about the whole concierge concept... but that is surely a nice touch!^

Libenitz

I think the concierge (when making rounds) should pay particular attention to the 1st time NZ visitors and go over general procedure of making domestic connections.
I have helped dozens of people with this through the last 5 years. Even when they ask someone for help they usually only get a reply to the specific question when it should be clear they are then going to be confused again.


A simple:
Go through customs (where they check your passport)
Collect your bag and take to x-ray machines
When you go through sliding doors stay to the left to re-check your bag.

I did meet the concierge in the LAX lounge and, while polite and engaging, I didn't really see the value.
I can't agree with the others here that gush over someone talking to them on a long flight. But to each their own.

cavemanzk

AKL needs better signage for connecting passengers too.

Its not just passengers that have never been to AKL that get confused. I know a few Aucklanders that have started to walk up the wrong way on the main pier, Because they where half alseep & had a little to drink on the aircarft.

Kiwi Flyer

The problem arises because some gates you turn left on leaving the airbridge and others right, and it isn't as simple as a rule of thumb of turning in towards the main part of the terminal. That is one reason why they need so many people at the gate for arrival - to steer bleary-eyed passengers the right way.

Dogs_Ears_Up

As I prep up and pack for LAX tomorrow, I thought I'd pop by flyertalk to see what issues may be simmering, and in particular, if there are any changes to this thread. It's been over a year now since this all started, and reading back through this thread makes for mildly depressing reading. I wondered if anything had changed?

I know that what I do is useful: Our London flights are busy (usually daylight for part or even all of the flights) and I'm kept going throughout the duty in all cabins. I have about 150 customers that I keep in intermittent contact with throughout the year, a couple of dozen who fly once a month or more, and a handful that do some really serious mileage. I've given out more destinational advice for LAX than I can accurately recall, and occasionally covered NZ as well. I've solved problems, and spent money and mobile phone bills doing so. In short, there's plenty of activity, and letters of thanks to demonstrate it. The crews are starting to trust us a little more, and regular customers are starting to work it out and use us when needed.

Reading back through this thread, it's apparent that whatever we're doing right, we're not doing it often enough for many of those using this forum. So forgive me if I ask again - What should we be learning, or have learned already?

Kiwi Flyer

Thanks Dogs_Ears_Up. It is great to see crew take in interest in how things can be improved ^

There is probably an inherent bias happening. Those that most need and appreciate the help of a concierge are the infrequent flyers and visiting LAX, LHR, NZ for the first time.

FTers travel more than most and are less in need of your help (except in irrops, which by nature is not too frequent).

That said, one thing I've noticed in my frequent longhaul flying on NZ is that some concierges are good at making sure pax know they are onboard, but in the majority of my longhaul NZ flights I have no clue if they are onboard or not because I never see or hear from them. If I only see or hear from concierges on 10 or 20% of my longhaul Air NZ flights, and have never used their services (except when they help out with meals) then it is easy to be dismissive about their value. That doesn't mean there is no value - far from it.

Even a PA at the start of the flight saying you are onboard and happy to help (with a brief explanation of how you can help) - look for the green striped shirt or just ask any crew member to call you over - would be a good start in raising awareness. I know some concierges do this already but either I'm incredibly unlucky in finding concierge-less NZ flights or there are a lot of concierges who do not do this and instead rely on wandering the aisles & for the pax to know and notice them.

Libenitz

Spot on! Give examples of how/what can help with, and how to you can be identified.

And just a side note, The concierge on my last flight was asking a young woman on my last flight into NZ if it was her first visit. She said yes and the concierge assumed for sightseeing but the girl sucked the air outa the plane when she said it was for her mom's funeral! The concierge handled it very well. I realized at that point that it really does take a skilled customer service person to do that job well.