tcook052

A fairly interesting article I thought worthy of inclusion:

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/servl.../National/home

The signature, that individual mark of integrity, will soon suffer another blow as shopping loses its personal touch.

In the name of cutting down on fraud, credit-card users will be required to key in their personal identification numbers instead of signing sales receipts.

The change, which is expected to be rolled out in Canada by 2010, is another step in the decline of the business signature, which has been waning in recent years because of the increase in e-mail, online shopping, automated signature generators and gasoline retailers' pay-at-the-pump systems.

patty canuck

Canada is behind the "cc" times compared to other countries (quote from my account manager). Before I left Ireland 6 months ago, these "chip and pin" ccs were all over the place. Now with Christmas looming (and me back in Ireland for a vacation at present), one can really see the effect - virtually everyone is no longer signing their receipts here anymore.

It saves only a 10 or so seconds on the transaction, but have about 15 people in the queue and it adds up ....

Have it on my RBC Avion card - but I think it is still considered useless in Canada at present.

PreferJ

I don't know if I have ever seen a retailer in Canada that has the chip reading terminals for credit cards. I wonder if it's the same hardware that would be used for the Visa "Electro" (?) thing cause I think that uses some kind of embeded chip deal?

DJ Bitterbarn

It often seems that I'm the only person in Ireland anymore with a card you have to sign things for. Of course, that leads into all sorts of fun since the signature actually rubbed off my card (taking most of the signature space with it), and since nobody signs anything the clerks are usually that much more thorough in comparing signatures. Plus, I keep forgetting to re-sign it. Might be time to consider getting that Bank of Ireland visa.

But you're right, it does save just that much more time and with a 10-deep line, it does make a bit of a difference.

Sidenote: The new Tesco self-checkouts don't even check signatures or pin numbers at all. New way of saving money?

ALW

Most Canadian retailers don't actually check signatures either. I have a friend who wrote "Please ask for ID" on her signature strip and it's literally about 1 in 100 times that someone notices. It's obvious that they're not looking at what's written on the strip when they "check the signature".

Feb 14/06 was the deadline in the UK for accepting only PINs when the customer has a chip-and-PIN card. I was at a meeting in LHR the following week and organizers warned us about this, and that retailers might not be aware they're supposed to accept signatures from us North Americans. As it happened, there was no difficulty.

http://www.businesseye.org.uk/511064.html

=aw

Carioca Canuck

Several merchants here in YYC have c/c chip readers.........still gotta sign the slip though.

Fiumicino

Visa Electron means it is a debit card, not that it has a chip.

meagicano

I noticed while in PHX that some places only check signatures for amounts over a certain dollar value.... the clerk told me he wasn't sure what the value was, but that sometimes the signature request would pop up. I haven't seen that in Canada yet - if I'm out of cash and have to pay for a coffee on visa, I still have to sign. I spent $30 at a Walgreen's and didn't have to sign anything.

patty canuck

Nice to see that someone else does the Canada-Ireland travel sidestep-thing too

gglave

If you look closely, you'll notice they're starting to crop up everywhere... Saw them in Starbucks just this morning.

Cheers,
Geoff Glave
Vancouver, Canada

DanJ

I had the clerk at the No Frills gorcery store giving extra scrutiny comparing my cc signature to the scribble I usually do on the receipt. She asked to see my ID, and while digging it out, I jokingly said she should show me her certificate in handwriting analysis LOL.

dodgy

I had a clerk at the Superstore yesterday ask to see a second piece of ID to confirm my signature. Purchase was for $52.

I didn't mind at all that she cared enough. Visa probably doesn't mind either.

d

Doc Fraud

A casual glance won't permit the average person to distinguish a chip and pin device from a non-chip and pin device. Many of the keypad MSR devices installed in the last couple of years are CP capable, but not enabled for obvious reasons.

2009 seems like it is a long way off, but it will still be a mad scramble for retailers in this country to get compliant by then. Chip and pin isn't really intended to provide additional protection for the consumer, rather it is a convenient mechanism for the FI's to shift the liability of fraud back to the merchant.

DF

sng8888

Was just down in LA for a week. Almost every retailer I was at insisted on checking for photo ID when making a CC purchase. There usually isn't a sign posted in regards to this. I had thought that the merchant agreements expressively forbid this (as well as asking for your phone number). If the terminal gives an approval code, the credit card is accepted.

I had this long argument with a sales cashier one. She said it was for *my* protection. I informed her it was for the retailer's protection, I'm already protected from fraud as per the agreement with the cc company. Recently someone must have cloned my VISA and charged up 19 gas pump transactions each just under $100 over a 4-5 day span. Visa's computers didn't pick up the bizarre behaviour, nor the fact that I was in Thailand and occasionally using my card there. One phone call and it was cleared up without any $50 penalty. A number of Shell's and Petro-Can's in East Van are going to get a lot of charge backs.

canuck_in_pa

You are correct, at least when it comes to Visa and MC. Amex merely frowns upon it as far as I know.

Here's the (US) link to complain about that kind of treatment: http://www.mastercard.com/us/persona...iolations.html